What are the current models of S and X equipped with as far as their on-board chargers? Still the 72A (if not, when were those discontinued) or are all models now the same 48A as the 3?
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Current onboard charger in S and X?
- Thread starter efusco
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ucmndd
Well-Known Member
All onboard chargers were reduced to 48A late 2018.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
My understanding is that even Rivian with a 180kWh battery is planning to being equipped with a 48A charger. So it seems that a consensus has formed that 11.4kW is all that's needed for L2. If you want faster find L3...
Another reason to keep my old 85. Charges twice as fast (22kW). 
Indeed only needed on journeys, but makes a big difference.
At home, which is the main charge location, we’re fine with just 7kW.
I guess Tesla used some stats from the charging habits and decided 11kW was enough for the majority.
Indeed only needed on journeys, but makes a big difference.
At home, which is the main charge location, we’re fine with just 7kW.
I guess Tesla used some stats from the charging habits and decided 11kW was enough for the majority.
I still believe the consensus is that 48A is fast enough to charge at home quickly, yet less detrimental to the battery for long term and frequent use than the 72A charger. It seems that it is being adopted by many manufacturers. I don't think they are just choosing 48A randomly.
Ostrichsak
Well-Known Member
For something capable of charging at a charge rate of over 1,000mph, the difference between a charge rate of 30mph and 60mph is largely irrelevant.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
I suspect the plan is that superchargers will be abundant enough that there won't be any need to resort to using L2 on a journey unless you're at your destination. We're already there in most areas.
It's probably not 'random' but I doubt it has anything to do with the battery or cars with a 70, 90, 100 and 180kWh battery pack wouldn't all have a 48A onboard charger.
It's probably because 60A circuits (that you need to support 48A) are cheap and abundant. The step up from 48A to 72A significantly adds to the cost and not much to the usability. Similarly that why most public chargers are 32A... because 40A circuits are the most cost effective.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
It’s super rare that I find a HPWC destination charger that is wired for more than 48 amps. Seems the vast majority are set in the 40 amp range. I’ve been all over the western US and have yet to find place where I really NEEDED or wanted super fast L2 charging.
As Tesla eventually makes good on setting up the WiFi connection in the gen3 HPWC to enable billing for use, I expect a lot of the existing Gen 1/2 units are gonna get “upgraded” right quick and provide 48 amps max in any case.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
Nah, the difference between 48 and 72 amp charging is fully negligible to the long term health of the battery. Completely irrelevant.
On the contrary, >60 amp circuits are expensive and require separate disconnects in many jurisdictions. Designing the innards of the wall connector to handle that amperage is expensive and very few people actually used the capability, not to mention the extra onboard charging hardware in every car, that is again hardly ever used, so there’s natural pressure to control costs.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
I don’t think there’s any vast agreement, conspiracy, or consensus here. To my knowledge, Tesla is really the only EV company that has ever offered onboard L2 charging >48 amps at any point in time.
I have a 72 on my March, 2018 Model S 100D and a 48 on our April, 2018 Model 3 RWD.
The Model S charges at 55 mph.
We have 2 HPWCs sharing a 100amp circuit.
Here’s Video I posted:
Tesla Model 3 & Model S Load Sharing 2 HPWCs (720p)
The Model S charges at 55 mph.
We have 2 HPWCs sharing a 100amp circuit.
Here’s Video I posted:
Tesla Model 3 & Model S Load Sharing 2 HPWCs (720p)
More likely it's the other way around.
No other manufacturer has anything faster so the majority of destination chargers don't output enough power to use the extra headroom of Teslas therefore the downgrade of the onboard is affecting almost no one while saving money.
I guess that’s another difference with EU countries. In mine, most public charger deliver 22kW. And also many of the Tesla DeC are wired for 22kW.
This cuts in two charge time.
I really needed this on our Croatia holiday, when my car acted up and would only charge in SuC and DeC. Public or mobile charger would not work anymore.
So we ended up having diner every other day at a local resort with Tesla DeC at 22kW.
It meant over the 2h, I could almost recharge fully, and thus visit the country.
In Europe, one of the most if not the most popular EV is the Renaud Zoe. One of its better feature is the 22kW charging.
My take took.
As a reference point you can still get a 72amp if you pay out of pocket as of a year ago. Had a failure on the 48amp and I was out of warranty. SC had to get permission.
We have 200 amp garage. One dedicated 100amp for the 72amp S. Then another wall charger on a separate circuit. We will have 3 cars charging at night with very high daily milage on all three. One car that has to be able to go a long way without super charging at just about any time of day. So there are use cases like mine, just rare.
I have found places I wanted faster L2 charging. Many. Driving backwards to get faster charging is hard to do when one is not on a leisurely stroll across the country. I love getting off the supercharger highway and traveling away from it or along side of it. Stopping in the middle of the day for hours is hard sometimes. Not ending up at a hotel with charging neccistates charging during the day especially in the winter. Also most L2's that I find aren't even enough to have a lunch and pick up much range. Again off the supercharger highway. I would have to eat lunches all day long.
We have 200 amp garage. One dedicated 100amp for the 72amp S. Then another wall charger on a separate circuit. We will have 3 cars charging at night with very high daily milage on all three. One car that has to be able to go a long way without super charging at just about any time of day. So there are use cases like mine, just rare.
I have found places I wanted faster L2 charging. Many. Driving backwards to get faster charging is hard to do when one is not on a leisurely stroll across the country. I love getting off the supercharger highway and traveling away from it or along side of it. Stopping in the middle of the day for hours is hard sometimes. Not ending up at a hotel with charging neccistates charging during the day especially in the winter. Also most L2's that I find aren't even enough to have a lunch and pick up much range. Again off the supercharger highway. I would have to eat lunches all day long.
Thanks for the interesting discussion.
As we live in something of a Supercharger desert, having the capability of charging at 22kW was great, it shortened time to be ready for trips and allowed travel to places that otherwise would have been exceptionally inconvenient. That need has diminished with time, but having that 80a/22kW capability was a selling point for sure. I'm getting by just fine, of course, with the 48A in my Model 3 and the limitations of the mobile charger as well, but I think it was a market advantage having the larger onboard charger and distinctly faster charging speeds over the competition, even from Level 2 charging.
As we live in something of a Supercharger desert, having the capability of charging at 22kW was great, it shortened time to be ready for trips and allowed travel to places that otherwise would have been exceptionally inconvenient. That need has diminished with time, but having that 80a/22kW capability was a selling point for sure. I'm getting by just fine, of course, with the 48A in my Model 3 and the limitations of the mobile charger as well, but I think it was a market advantage having the larger onboard charger and distinctly faster charging speeds over the competition, even from Level 2 charging.
Well, that's funny, because I live in Boise, and there have been routes out of Boise that were enabled for several years by very high amp wall connectors that required the high power onboard charger. Going through eastern Oregon to Bend, and going southwest to Winnemucca were both like that.
That's because of an infrastructure difference. Europe has very common three phase electricity available in a lot of places. With three phase, you can deliver a lot more power for the same thickness of cabling and wire runs to the charging locations (cost issues). That is a nice advantage there.
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