Day 1 of install of 14.28kW system with 4 Powerwalls

[coney27]

Today is the first day of my install which was supposed to last only two days. Unfortunately it is raining here in Connecticut so the solar lead arrived and stated they were have to reschedule to tomorrow and Friday. In the mean time I have 4 electricians in my basment currently mounting 4 power walls and the inverters.

I'm pleasantly surprised after placing my deposit on 7/12/20 the project is already at the install point. My main concern was getting a system that would supply my whole house and more and having it installed before the year was up to get the 26% federal tax credit.

After stumbling across this board I would like to thank the people for their knowledge and advice after knowing nothing 6 months ago. Anyways im excited for this install to progress and I will update.

 

[bob_p]

When the system has been installed, strongly recommend performing "max load" and "off grid" tests to verify system operation.

Max load - while the system is operating off-grid, turn on every high power device (except for EV charging) and using the Tesla app determine the max power consumption. With 4 PowerWalls, if the max load is above 20KW, you could have a problem during power outages, and may need to be prepared to either shut off or not use some devices during an outage. For us, we determined having both of our electric ovens heating up at the same time pushes us above 20KW (4 PW); since we probably wouldn't use the ovens during an outage, we're not too concerned about this. If you have a Tesla Wall Connector attached to the system, you'll also want to lower the charging power during an outage in the Tesla app to ensure you stay below the 20KW limit of your PowerWalls.

Off grid - disconnect the TEG from the grid. Our TEG panel has a grid power breaker, making it easy to take the system off-grid. If you don't have a breaker for that, you'll need to get your installers to help you do the off-grid test. This test will verify your devices operate correctly off-grid. It's possible the "solar power cutoff" frequency set by the TEG may be too high to allow some devices to work (especially UPS boxes), which Tesla can fix by lowering the cutoff frequency. This test will also verify that the TEG will automatically take over when the grid is down, manage the solar panel power and PowerWalls, and properly transition the system back to the grid. Plus it will verify your devices will work through those transitions. We had one UPS box (since retired) that refused to work when the system was off-grid (even after Tesla adjusted the cutoff frequency).

Also, if you haven't already planned for this, you should add soft or hard starts to all of your air conditioner compressors. The compressors require a surge of power to start, which is beyond what PowerWalls can provide. During our off-grid test, we were able to get one air conditioner to start up reliably. The second would sometimes start. And the third would never start. Once the hard starts were installed, we didn't have any HVAC issues operating off grid.

 

[nyprepper]

@coney27 here's a pro-tip:...... bring in a nice lunch for the install crew and tip them all at the end. Ask the lead installer for his cell phone # in case you have any questions or need assistance troubleshooting. you will have questions and you will need some assistance at some point. i have since become friends with the lead electrician on my crew and haven't had to call the 800 # once. i'm just about at the 2 year mark since my install and I could not be happier. also- the advice above about performing those tests when the crew is still there is very sage.

 

[jakespeed]

here's another vote for adding a soft start to each hvac compressor. my inrush load dropped from 115 to 24 amps on my 4ton hvac

 

[holeydonut]

You all have no idea how beyond frustrating it is to learn how easy it was for you to get soft starts installed on your outdoor condenser units.

When I tried to get get them installed on my 2x 3 ton condenser units - this was how it went:

1) Call local authorized Lennox installer with lots of 5-star reviews on Yelp. Ask person on phone if I can get a quote for two soft starts to be installed on Lennox outdoor condenser units. Person on the phone says "we don't do any advice over the phone, we need to send out a tech." Tech comes out 2 days later and asks me "What is a soft start? Do you mean hard start? I don't do soft starts." I insist I mean "soft start" or "secure start" and show a picture of the Emerson Copeland scroll compressor SecureStart unit listed on www.lennoxpros.com. Tech says he's never seen or heard of this and thinks I'm wasting his time. I explain my situation around needing them for upcoming Tesla Powerwalls. Then he leaves thinking I'm wasting his time since my condensers are working fine.

2) Call Lennox HQ support line and attempt to confirm soft start availability on my two Lennox condensers. After getting transferred to 3x different phone personnel, I get told HQ (Lennox Industries) cannot advise customers for technical problems over the phone. They instruct me to call another local authorized Lennox installer.

3) Call another local authorized Lennox installer #2. Ask person on the phone if they can quote me for two soft starts, but they have no clue what I'm talking about. They begrudgingly agree to send a tech out to my house even though they don't know what the problem is that I'm having with the Lennox hardware. Tech finally comes out 3 days later and are also confused what is a "soft start" or "secure start". I again show them the Emerson Copeland scroll compressor unit listed on www.lennoxpros.com. Tech becomes amazingly skeptical and thinks I'm trying to con him. He proceeds to call Lennox HQ's "tech support line" After 50 minutes of wait and being transferred around, he says:

"Lennox has no record of any customer ever installing these soft starts on any residential compressor unit. Lennox will not support a soft start or secure start on your compressors. If you install it your warranties are void. You've been flagged in the system. Please do not install these soft starts or whatever you call them on your condenser." Then the tech leaves extremely pissed off that he wasted an hour.

 

[coney27]

Powerwalls mounted

 

[coney27]

Just some random observations;

My guys used a normal hand truck and not the fancy powerwall lift hand truck I have seen on other installs for the powerwalls

I have 2 crews of electricians on sight who said they were alloted 44 hours each to install the powerwalls. Tesla dictates 11 hours per powerwall.

Per my solar installer he has not seen a 14kW system installed at all this year. According to him he only does 4/8/12kW installs and was surprised to see my 14kW system. Which I found odd.

They will be conducting a max load / off grid test on the final day and they advised on not installing a soft start for my ac unit as they believe the 4 powerwalls will easily handle the loads

 

[BrettS]

My guys used a normal hand truck and not the fancy powerwall lift hand truck I have seen on other installs for the powerwalls

That’s because your powerwalls are floor mounted. They did the same with my floor mounted ones, although I did see the fancy lift hand truck in their van. I’m sure it’s heavier and more of a pain to use, so I think they only use it when they actually need to lift the powerwalls to wall mount them.

I have 2 crews of electricians on sight who said they were alloted 44 hours each to install the powerwalls. Tesla dictates 11 hours per powerwall.

That’s interesting. I just had two electricians for my install. One installed the powerwalls and the other did the electrical panels. They got my four powerwalls and all of the panel work done in one (very long) day.

Per my solar installer he has not seen a 14kW system installed at all this year. According to him he only does 4/8/12kW installs and was surprised to see my 14kW system. Which I found odd.

I think that’s because of the cookie cutter design of the tesla installs. I’m sure the vast majority of their installs are the standard cookie cutter sizes.

They will be conducting a max load / off grid test on the final day and they advised on not installing a soft start for my ac unit as they believe the 4 powerwalls will easily handle the loads

They did not install a soft start on my AC unit either for my 4 powerwall installation. I have been essentially running off grid for more than two months since my install and I haven’t had any issues with my AC or the lack of a soft start.

 

[hurjio]

Per my solar installer he has not seen a 14kW system installed at all this year. According to him he only does 4/8/12kW installs and was surprised to see my 14kW system. Which I found odd.

Well, 4/8/12kW are the standard sizes Tesla offers, so I imagine majority of installs fall under that. I imagine most consumers don't browse Tesla forums and aren't aware you can custom your system size. I imagine Tesla prefers it that way too.

 

[jakespeed]

You all have no idea how beyond frustrating it is to learn how easy it was for you to get soft starts installed on your outdoor condenser units.

When I tried to get get them installed on my 2x 3 ton condenser units - this was how it went:

1) Call local authorized Lennox installer with lots of 5-star reviews on Yelp. Ask person on phone if I can get a quote for two soft starts to be installed on Lennox outdoor condenser units. Person on the phone says "we don't do any advice over the phone, we need to send out a tech." Tech comes out 2 days later and asks me "What is a soft start? Do you mean hard start? I don't do soft starts." I insist I mean "soft start" or "secure start" and show a picture of the Emerson Copeland scroll compressor SecureStart unit listed on www.lennoxpros.com. Tech says he's never seen or heard of this and thinks I'm wasting his time. I explain my situation around needing them for upcoming Tesla Powerwalls. Then he leaves thinking I'm wasting his time since my condensers are working fine.

2) Call Lennox HQ support line and attempt to confirm soft start availability on my two Lennox condensers. After getting transferred to 3x different phone personnel, I get told HQ (Lennox Industries) cannot advise customers for technical problems over the phone. They instruct me to call another local authorized Lennox installer.

3) Call another local authorized Lennox installer #2. Ask person on the phone if they can quote me for two soft starts, but they have no clue what I'm talking about. They begrudgingly agree to send a tech out to my house even though they don't know what the problem is that I'm having with the Lennox hardware. Tech finally comes out 3 days later and are also confused what is a "soft start" or "secure start". I again show them the Emerson Copeland scroll compressor unit listed on www.lennoxpros.com. Tech becomes amazingly skeptical and thinks I'm trying to con him. He proceeds to call Lennox HQ's "tech support line" After 50 minutes of wait and being transferred around, he says:

"Lennox has no record of any customer ever installing these soft starts on any residential compressor unit. Lennox will not support a soft start or secure start on your compressors. If you install it your warranties are void. You've been flagged in the system. Please do not install these soft starts or whatever you call them on your condenser." Then the tech leaves extremely pissed off that he wasted an hour.

i know your frustration

i called the hvac installer, he's gone out of business

i called a repair guy i had once used, said he was only familiar with hard starts & had never heard of a soft start

i called 1 of the large chains who wanted $600 for labor

i called a local guy with the highest google ratings who offered to install for time & material if i ordered the soft start

after i ordered/received the unit the local guy no longer replied to my messages

i finally installed the soft start myself

it provided me an excuse to purchase a fluke clamp meter with in-rush & bluetooth functionality : ) i'm a tool collector

 

[coney27]

Start of day 2 and inverters are mounted

 

[coney27]

End of day 2;
Powerwalls are up and running. Seems like they were shipped with about 22% in all four of.

Tried the off grid test and that failed instantly. After about 1.5 of testing and calls it was determined that the Gateway 2 was the issue. It was discovered that during the mock up I was quoted and issued a gateway 1. The day before my install started the change was made to a gateway 2 but was never entered into teslas internal system. Since the gateway 2 was never keyed into the system the gateway was not closing its relay when the off grid test was performed. It was shocking to the installer but it seems like a virtual and physical protection for tesla to prevent any theft of equipment and usage of consumers. Pretty cool and also very annoying.

The solar crew installed 26 out of 42 panels on their first day and are back here now to finish up.

After asking them about a soft start for my ac on day 1, they installed one on day two without requesting which was a nice surprise.

I am now trying to figure out how my crew needs to gain access to solar edge so I can be granted access to the solar edge app. Neither one of the two crew leads at my house have never done it before and aren't sure how they gain access themselves. Anyone know the process for them? Thanks!

 

[BrettS]

I am now trying to figure out how my crew needs to gain access to solar edge so I can be granted access to the solar edge app. Neither one of the two crew leads at my house have never done it before and aren't sure how they gain access themselves. Anyone know the process for them? Thanks!

The crew should have an installer account for SolarEdge so they can commission your inverter(s) using the SetApp app. It would be shocking if they didn’t have this since they wouldn’t be able to get your inverters working without it.

However, I don’t believe that the crew has access to monitor your system or the ability to grant you access to monitor your system. In order to get access for yourself you will need to call the tesla support line and request access after the install is complete.

 

[coney27]

So system install was complete 3 days ago and is running pretty well thus far. Panels are up and producing but are also quite dirty somehow so I will be cleaning them in the next few days. My 4 Powerwalls are also doing a good job and are running my entire house over night with plenty of left over in the morning.

Does anyone know if there's a way to view each powerwall individually?

Overall I'm satisfied with the system and pleased with my results thus far.

 

[BrettS]

That looks great, congrats on the install.

You can’t view data for each powerwall in the tesla app at all, but I believe there are some options through the API. @gpez might be able to help with that.

 

[zƬesla]

API info:

State And Settings

vloschiavo/powerwall2

 

[marklin]

I am planning to move to Norwalk or Danbury, CT. Which electric company has the best rate for charge electric vehicle at home? Or there is only Eversource that service the area? Thanks.

 

[coney27]

I live quite a distance away from those areas. Further down, in Fairfield County, there are more options than just Eversource. A simple Google search will tell you.