Dedicated Quick Chargers (time limited) SCs

[nightfly]

Playing around with ABRP last night and noting that most if not all trips along freeways only require ~15 minute stops to charge up to be able to get a couple of hours or so down the road. Some SC's along I40 only have 4 SCs, many only 6. I suspect that common in more rural areas of the freeways.

What if one or two SCs at a SC site were dedicated to quick charges, i.e. max charging time of 15 or 20 minutes and then that was it for that car on the quick SCs for 12 hrs or some such.

For most M3s and newer Xs and Ss that's all they would need to move on. The throughput would dramatically increase at SC sites.

Thoughts?

 

[Big Dog]

^^some folks prefer to get more than "a couple of hours down the road..."

 

[MorrisonHiker]

Playing around with ABRP last night and noting that most if not all trips along freeways only require ~15 minute stops to charge up to be able to get a couple of hours or so down the road. Some SC's along I40 only have 4 SCs, many only 6. I suspect that common in more rural areas of the freeways.

What if one or two SCs at a SC site were dedicated to quick charges, i.e. max charging time of 15 or 20 minutes and then that was it for that car on the quick SCs for 12 hrs or some such.

For most M3s and newer Xs and Ss that's all they would need to move on. The throughput would dramatically increase at SC sites.

Thoughts?

Sounds like you are only looking in California. The Superchargers I use in the West and Plains are much farther apart than Superchargers in California. Sometimes I need to go off the Supercharger network to drive hundreds of miles to cross the states north/south instead of east/west. Such long drives can require a 90%+ charge. Seeing as many of the locations I go to only have 6 Supercharger stalls, that wouldn't work in the states where I Supercharge.

 

[nightfly]

No I looked primarily in Az and NM and CO and KS, generally the mid-west.

This would only work for 300+ mile range cars - which is the trend for Tesla.

 

[nightfly]

^^some folks prefer to get more than "a couple of hours down the road..."

Yeah, but would you rather wait an hr+ for a SC to open up? or get a quick charge to get to your destionation/next SC?

 

[swaltner]

I understand this in principal, but don’t see it working in reality.

The biggest issue is the people using the stations. There are an amazing number that don’t even understand the pairing of stalls. What would happen for those folks that accidentally plug in to one of the time-limited stalls.

 

[srs5694]

There's also this: If a driver really only wants to plug in for 15-20 minutes, then that's what they'll do, even on stalls that aren't time-limited. I suppose time-limiting some stalls might serve to encourage such use, but I suspect that, for the most part, such a policy wouldn't really have much effect on charging behavior. OTOH, it would annoy drivers who really do need to charge more, and who plug into such a stall accidentally or who arrive only to find all the other stalls occupied.

 

[nightfly]

I envision of the feature would be analogous to the quick checkout in the grocery store: yes, some people will ignore the limitation; many folks will not be happy. It's simply about increasing the throughput at smaller/busier SCs.

There's other issues too, like simply how would queueing up work? That's already haphazard, especially in places like Kingman with multiple entries into the area and no clear way to queue up.

I think from Tesla's perspective, it could be a revenue generator by pissing off those older S & X owners as they wouldn't/couldn't benefit from quick charging and they would perhaps upgrade.

I rarely SC, just thinking of the future. Seems like SC deployment is lagging user base - especially on popular routes. Perhaps the only solution is the cont' expansion of providers like "Electrify America" so that we simply have more choices on the road.

 

[VinnyS]

One of the issues here is if someone is planning their own route and charging stops or are they using the Tesla navigation systems to plan everything. I have always just used the Tesla navigation system. On Saturday I drove form North-east Pa to North Carolina. First SC stop was Scranton, then Frederick, MD. I had to charge for an hour (and over 90%) to make it to South Hill, VA which was the next charging stop that my M3 had me going to. There were other SC along my route, could have charged in Harrisburg, Pa, would have cut down on the time in Frederick, MD or could have charged in northern Richmond as well. But using the Tesla navigation system is just easier sometimes. Also a route you can drive in the summertime and charge of only 15-20 minutes may require a lot more time in cold and wet conditions.

 

[dgatwood]

The biggest issue is the people using the stations. There are an amazing number that don’t even understand the pairing of stalls. What would happen for those folks that accidentally plug in to one of the time-limited stalls.

The right answer here is for the cars and the charging network to be a lot smarter. In particular:

• When you arrive at a supercharger, your car should ask you on the screen if you plan to charge now. If you say "YES", it should talk to Tesla's servers. Then:
  • If there are multiple stalls available, it should route you to the charger that will give you the best possible charge speed, factoring in any limits imposed by your current state of charge and battery type, and assigning you the slowest charger that will give you the best possible charge speed.
  • If there is only one charger available, it should determine whether the car in the adjacent slot just got there, and determine whether it would be faster for you to wait for another slot or charge immediately. It should ideally then tell you that it would be faster to wait, but give you the option to decline and then charge immediately.
  • If there are no chargers available, or if you choose to wait because it would be faster than using any open stall, it should add you to a queue.
• If you have a route already set, it should use that as a hint about when you are likely to stop charging, under the assumption that you'll charge only enough to get to the destination.
  • And it should use that in deciding which stall to route you into, and who should get the first stall that opens up, i.e. people with closer destinations should get slightly elevated queueing priority, within reason.
  • It should also use the vehicle's maximum charge speed and current state of charge, i.e. if your car is closer to being full and has an older pack that takes a lower maximum charge current, and there are two spots likely to become available, with two cars waiting, it should schedule you for the one that is across from a car that is earlier in its charge cycle, because your car will start out at a lower charge rate.
• If you plan a route that involves a supercharger, it should use that information to allow you to pre-reserve a spot in the queue, and it should give you an indication of the expected wait time and charge time. It should also present an approximation of your wait time and charge time when you're looking at the map, so you can make the most efficient decision possible, as early in your trip as possible.
• If it proves useful, Tesla could also dedicate a couple of chargers for use by people who only need a quick charge. You could indicate this by setting your charge limit lower, and it would then give you access to those charge spots. However, I'm not convinced this will really work all that well on V2 chargers, because of the power sharing involved.

And all of that behavior should be clearly documented so that people understand why they are sometimes being serviced in an out-of-order fashion. And ideally, the system should let you park your car in a nearby spot, and should automatically drive across the parking lot to charge at the appropriate time in the appropriate stall, though I guess that would require an attendant, at least for now.