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Destination chargers are mostly worthless

Discussion in 'Charging Standards and Infrastructure' started by azred, May 29, 2017.

  1. azred

    azred Member

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    :)OK, now that I have your attention, I seriously do questions their value. My limited experience with destination chargers is that they are too slow and too restricted to be part of my trip planning. I would drive my ICE rather than counting on destination charging and when we get rid of our last ICE this Fall, I would rent an ICE rather than counting on destination charging for my Model 3 and Model S.

    I am sure this thread will generate negative reactions and hopefully not just a bunch of lazy, worthless thumbs down. If you believe I am wrong, tell me what I don't understand. I am interested in hearing how great destination charging is.
     
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  2. Canuck

    Canuck Active Member

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    When I travel I pick hotels with destination chargers since it saves me from hanging around a supercharger for 40 minutes or so, and longer if it's out of the way. As to being slow, my 80 amp chargers can charge to full in a few hours. I sleep longer than that in a hotel. Plus, if I arrive with a low charge and want to move the luggage into the room, shower and get ready to go out on the town before returning to sleep, in an hour or so at 80 amps I can add enough miles for the night out, then get the rest when I return to sleep.

    I stayed at the Best Western in Kelowna, BC recently which has superchargers and destination chargers. I used the destination chargers since they are always empty and I could leave my car plugged in overnight, then in the morning I used the app to charge it from 90 to 100%. So even with superchargers, the destination charger served a good purpose.
     
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  3. cpa

    cpa Active Member

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    Like many things in life, it depends.

    I agree that for a day's drive on a road trip, a destination charger will take 3-4 hours to receive enough charge to drive another 200+ miles, and this assumes that you have the old-fashioned dual chargers or the new-fangled 72A charger and the destination has 64-80 amps available.

    However, consider this:

    (1) You can charge overnight at your destination. This obviates the need to plug in at the SC at or nearby the hotel before departing.

    (2) You can reach a destination that is ~50+ miles away from the nearest Supercharger and charge there while you do your destination thing.

    (3) You can plan a trip over a 300+ mile distance that is not on the SC highway. You can stop at a destination charger somewhere in the middle for 60-90 minutes, grab a bite or see a sight and add 50-75 miles to your battery and reach your next charging stop.

    From personal experience:

    Spent two nights at the Pfister Hotel in Milwaukee. That hotel has them. Charged overnight. Drove around Wisconsin the next day going to a brewery and a cheese factory. Returned, went to a ball game, plugged in overnight and left the following morning at 90%. Drove over back roads to the Mauston SC in northern Wisconsin.

    Spent two nights in Phoenix. Hotel has destination chargers. Upon departure, charged overnight to 90%, then upon waking and packing the car, moved the slider to 100%. We departed about 90 minutes later for the Kingman Supercharger, and skipped Wickenburg.

    I needed to drive from Boise to Winnemucca. Even with a range charge at Boise, a non-stop drive is touch-and-go, especially with the 65/70 MPH speed limits in Oregon and Nevada. The Say-When Casino at the Oregon/Nevada line has a destination charger (provided by others, not Tesla, but it makes no difference.) I stopped for about 45 minutes, slugged down a beer, won $4.40 on the slots, added 33 range miles and arrived in Winnemucca with 15 range miles remaining.

    So, much depends on your travel plans. But I think for most of us, destination chargers are a blessing! :)
     
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  4. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

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    I'm confused about your stance. The reason they are called "Destination" chargers rather than "along-your-route-weaker-than-SpC-chargers" is because it provides a host ample ability to charge your vehicle during your stay. They are NOT supposed to be en-route chargers. ANY 40-80 amp charging outlet will have your vehicle topped off long before dawn, and that's precisely what Destination chargers are.

    Now, if there were a situation where someone motions you to a 12-amp 120V receptacle and calls that a Destination charger, then your case holds water. But I'll be a dry oyster if someone can provide evidence of that!
     
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  5. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    Slow chargers have been very useful when I need to stay at least an over night in different cities.

    When there was no Supercharger in Las Vegas in January 2013, I successfully traveled there with my 2012 Model S85 and charged slowly over there when I was sleeping with no problem.

    I have done the same in San Diego, CA nowadays without the need to wait at its Supercharger. It's a waste of time just to wait for super fast charger while I could enjoy my sleep in my hotel with a slow charger.

    I have done the same with Sacramento, Oakland, San Francisco... without a need for waiting at a super fast Supercharger.

    However, slow chargers would certainly not work for a quick turn-around time like going for Fremont Factory Tour for 1 hour and then a quick full charge to get back home right away.
     
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  6. kort677

    kort677 Active Member

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    destination charging is just what the name implies, arrive at your destination and charge. for me on the trip that I just completed it worked out just fine. plan your trip and arrive at the place you are going to stop for the night, go to sleep and awaken to a fully charged car.
    if you think that these chargers are to be used as range extenders on a trip like a supercharger you are mistaken.
     
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  7. TexasEV

    TexasEV Well-Known Member

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    I don't understand the OP, or perhaps the OP doesn't understand the purpose of destination charging. If it's a destination, meaning you're going to be there overnight (or at least most if the day if it's a day trip), then there is plenty of time to get a significant charge. It is useful for trip planning in choosing a place to stop for the night.
     
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  8. Lon12

    Lon12 Member

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    I'm currently in Vancouver BC and not able to trickle charge overnight where I'm staying. So I use a destination charger (80 amp) at a shopping mall that is not to far away. So after a one hour lunch at the mall I have enough to do my days driving around town.
    Just like Canuck, I try and stay at hotels that have destination chargers.
     
  9. Solarman004

    Solarman004 Member

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    Not a "negative reaction" because I realize everyone's situation will be different, but I have found destination chargers to be valuable. Two examples...
    Monarch Mountain Ski area on CO is far enough away from SCs that day skiing was impossible until they added an HPWC. Charge while skiing and the car has enough energy to make it home by the early afternoon.
    2. Seattle has no SC. On a trip there we needed enough trons to make it back to the Ellensburg SC east of Seattle and over the mountains. An HPWC in a public parking garage, while eating dinner, did the trick.
    Rather than say destination chargers are mostly worthless, I would submit that their value depends on the type of traveling one does, and the locations to which they travel.
     
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  10. Az_Rael

    Az_Rael Supporting Member

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    We did our first road trip in our S and stayed at a hotel with destination chargers. There were two plus 1 Clipper creek which was OK, since there were 2 Teslas and more than 2 other EVs staying. Hotel policy was first come first served.

    We arrived early and got a spot at the destination charger. Only issue for me was I didn't want to block it all night in case another Tesla arrived, so I had to go down at 1AM when the car finished charging to move the car. So it was an annoyance since I had to keep track.
     
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  11. azred

    azred Member

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    If most hotels/motels had destination chargers, I could probably join the fan club. (Ditto for restaurants and malls.) But I think limiting my choice of hotels/motels to places with destination chargers is not something I'd want to do yet. (The obvious exception is Custer, SD, which largely due to the Tesla rally apparently has plenty.) I realize the plan is to greatly expand destination chargers and obviously that will make a huge difference. I only hope growth of destination chargers doesn't happen at the expense of Supercharger expansion.
     
  12. Lasttoy

    Lasttoy Member

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    Really funny, 2 in LA place La, belonged to Sun country, worked great, 200 miles per hour
    3 in downtown houston were junk, only charging at 10 miles an hour, I thought my car was broke, I called factory, he said no, it was only putting 20amps. Idiot installation.
     
  13. bhzmark

    bhzmark Active Member

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    OP, you would really be better off with a Cadillac or Lexus ice. Some people just don't get it.
     
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  14. ReddyLeaf

    ReddyLeaf Member

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    Just returned from two week trip where destination charging was instrumental in bringing 50 Teslas into Custer, SD. I also used 120V plugs at hotels overnight after a quick 15-20 min supercharge. If I had found 240V destination chargers in between the SCs, I could have skipped a SC stop the next morning. Absolutely worth it. Personally I would like to see multiple 20 amp J1772 stations at every hotel-sponsored SC. I'd rather charge at 20 amps overnight than SC for an hour then move the car.
     
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  15. NikeWings

    NikeWings Active Member

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    OP - think of them as an added convenience for fabulous get-away weekends without being tethered to a SC. Arrive at your hotel "destination", charge at night during your stay and explore the radius during the day. If you get stuck during your travels, consider them a few extra mile continegency plan to get you to a SC, but they are not a replacement. Enjoy!
     
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  16. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    I'm puzzled why waking up with a 'full tank' sucks at a hotel, but is wonderful each night at home.

    In any case, they are voluntary. You will not get a ticket for not charging at a hotel with EV charging. So it's sort of a weird thing to complain about.
     
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  17. Dwdnjck

    Dwdnjck Member

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    I have a trip planned from San Diego to Brookings, Oregon in a 60. I will be staying in 8 hotels along the way, all with destination charging. I will only need to supercharge once per day, at lunch. Destination chargers will make this trip easy.
     
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  18. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Well-Known Member

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    #18 ItsNotAboutTheMoney, May 29, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017
    You're right that it's not dependable unless you're visiting friends or family, or it's at a hotel that will manage it. To be completely dependable you'd need to be able to reserve it. But at the very least destination charging is a bonus that can reduce the amount of on-the-road charging that people need, reducing trip times.

    I mentally separate what people normally consider destination charging into overnight charging and destination charging
    (1) Overnight charging would be at hotels or houses where you're staying.
    (2) Destination charging would be at a destination such as a friend/relative's house, park, entertainment venue or tourist spot where you aren't staying overnight

    (2) is likely to be a bigger issue (other than a friend/relative's house) : destination charging like that is likely unmanaged, and therefore you're less likely to be able to rely on it. I understand that concern. Fortunately, as fast, on-the-road charging increases in density there should be less dependency on destination charging.
     
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  19. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

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    Hmmm....gives me an idea.

    Rather than "crowd funding", this would be sorta-kinda "crowd pushing" - and with it I hope this Mod doesn't run afoul of any Admin's eagle eye here:

    I - yes, even I - have been unsuccessful at persuading Tesla to install Destination Chargers at our Lodge. We have everything: just the right kind of clientele; a long-standing and highly acclaimed remote location begging to have high-amp charging (this junction eventually will have to be on any Alaskan SpC network, though I hold not my breath); a willing and knowledgeable host...

    ...but so far, crickets. If anyone wants to chime in from afar, send 'em recommendations! Maybe that would work. I'll let you figure out what bread crumbs to follow - it's ridiculously obvious.
     
  20. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    Don't forget about Roadsters. We can't supercharge and many of us passed on buying a S/X for various reasons I won't bore you with. We often stay or patronize Destinations because it's convenient to use their chargers.
     
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