Electricity too expensive with PGE for EVs

[Uncle Paul]

The take away is that every Tesla owner should take a look at their charging options and plans. Go with the system that will work best for them.

The California utility ($1,000 for SCE) rebates help make EV ownership simple the first year. Next year I will look into solar.

My SCE bill runs $1,500 annually for my 3,000 sq ft home. $1,000 rebate makes my net cost $42 monthly first year. Less than renting Solar.

 

[jkdman123]

The take away is that every Tesla owner should take a look at their charging options and plans. Go with the system that will work best for them.

The California utility ($1,000 for SCE) rebates help make EV ownership simple the first year. Next year I will look into solar.

My SCE bill runs $1,500 annually for my 3,000 sq ft home. $1,000 rebate makes my net cost $42 monthly first year. *Less than renting Solar*.

As a side note, never lease solar.

 

[miimura]

Why not just not switch to one of those plans. It’s not required.

PG&E is forcing people off the EV-A rate plan onto the EV2-A rate plan. This is a forced change that will happen starting when your November billing cycle starts. If you have recent (since 2016 or 2017) NEM interconnection (new solar) then you will be grandfathered for 5 years. Those of us with older solar are pretty much screwed. I'm a little less screwed because I have Powerwalls and can mostly avoid paying the Peak prices. However, I will still be generating 1:1 with EV charging on EV2 whereas I am generating 2:1 kWh versus EV charging on EV-A.

 

[AdamVIP]

The take away is that every Tesla owner should take a look at their charging options and plans. Go with the system that will work best for them.

The California utility ($1,000 for SCE) rebates help make EV ownership simple the first year. Next year I will look into solar.

My SCE bill runs $1,500 annually for my 3,000 sq ft home. $1,000 rebate makes my net cost $42 monthly first year. Less than renting Solar.

Have you successfully got your SCE rebate? I applied and its still sitting at documents received since August.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Only sent mine in a couple weeks ago. Believe they do them in batches.

 

[KSilver2000]

Even with high city energy costs, driving my Tesla M3 costs about half the cost per mile of my wife's (economical) 4 cylinder Honda, at current gas prices. And that's not including maintenance, or rising petroleum costs.

What kind of maintenance are you doing for a 4-cyl Honda? The difference in maintenance costs between a 4-cyl Honda and Tesla should be quite small. DIY oil change for $25 every ~4 months. She's probably not racing the car to require brake pad changes every year.

And, factoring in much higher insurance costs for the Tesla, any savings in gas and maintenance over a Toyota/Honda is more than wiped out based on my calculations when we first bought a Tesla.

Note: I'm paying $0.14/kWh off-peak.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Everyone's cost differential will be different, depending on their own individual circumstances.
Perhaps his wife does not want to jack up her car and crawl underneath to DIY an oil change
Currently gas has gone over $4.00 gallon for premium, with a new refinery fire just announced, it may go even higher.

No matter. Even if the running cost were the same, many would still prefer driving a clean Model 3 over a polluting Honda.
Others would prefer to plug into their garage chargers rather than stand out in the dark, pumping smelly petrol.

Honda's require many oil changes, constant petrol pumping, tune ups, brake jobs, muffler replacements, tune ups, engine air filter changes, spark plug replacements, burnt out light bulbs, etc.

By comparison, a Model 3 is much more pure. Safer for the children as well.

 

[liuping]

However, switching over to an EV charging plan EV2-A appears to decrease the amount of time that solar production is being credited to the account at higher tier levels, leading to a bill increase to $1255 per year assuming unchanged consumption patterns.

I have SDG&E, but it's new TOU peak periods are similar to PG&E I believe.

We maximize the amount of solar credit with our Powerwalls. All our solar production from 4-9pm goes to the grid (during that time our house runs 100% off the Powerwalls).

Since the rate during 4-9pm is extra high, we accrue enough credit to offset a lot of EV charging after midnight.

 

[Dan203]

Here we have a flat rate plan that’s $0.09/kWh or a TOU plan that’s only $0.06 off peak and $0.11 most of the rest of the time. But in June-Aug from 1:00pm-5:00pm it’s $0.46. That alone is enough to make my bill go up.

Even a small solar array to help offset that high rate might save me money. But not sure I want to spend $10k to find out.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Tesla rents a small solar installation for $50/month. Might be just the thing for you. Would generate significant energy during the expensive time.

You could rent it for a while to see how it is working out,

 

[RaplhCramden]

Wow! I'm at 13¢ overnight and I thought THAT was high.

20 cents/kWh at lowest TOU rate in San Diego. I think we are paying for the worlds most expensive paperweight, which is the San Onofre nuclear power plant which was misrepaired at a very high cost and then decertified.

 

[St☰v☰]

20 cents/kWh at lowest TOU rate in San Diego. I think we are paying for the worlds most expensive paperweight, which is the San Onofre nuclear power plant which was misrepaired at a very high cost and then decertified.

You're getting hosed... this is right off PG&E's website:
Making sense of the rates

 

[miimura]

You're getting hosed... this is right off PG&E's website:
Making sense of the rates]

What does PG&E rates have to do with his situation? He is probably in SDG&E territory.

 

[Daniel in SD]

20 cents/kWh at lowest TOU rate in San Diego. I think we are paying for the worlds most expensive paperweight, which is the San Onofre nuclear power plant which was misrepaired at a very high cost and then decertified.

EV-TOU-5 is 9 cents/kWh + $16 a month.
Electric Vehicle Pricing Plans | San Diego Gas & Electric

 

[St☰v☰]

What does PG&E rates have to do with his situation? He is probably in SDG&E territory.

You're right, my mistake, here's SDGE's rate page:

 

[MD JD]

In my city, I pay $0.27/kwh, no discounts for evenings, etc. My city is not covered by PGE.

 

[ucmndd]

You’ve unfortunately discovered the reality that EV2-A is a terrible bullshit rate plan. I’m not sure what I’m going to do when my EV-A grandfathering expires.

 

[ElectricOrgan]

You're getting hosed... this is right off PG&E's website:
Making sense of the rates


View attachment 467140

Holy crap! I don't think I pay 14 cents/kWh on the regular plan here. I'm currently on a TOU plan that gives me about 8 cents/kWh off peak and either 38 cents in summer or 20 cents the rest of the year at peak times. Summer peak is 3 to 7 PM and otherwise 6 to 9 AM and 5 to 8 PM. I have my outlet for the car on a timer that shuts it off during peak times. But I'm not charging at the moment. My driving is such that charging at home buys me nothing in terms of convenience, so I just Supercharge. My problem is charging when I'm not at home. My usage is rather the poster child for not buying an EV lol.

 

[jjrandorin]

You're right, my mistake, here's SDGE's rate page:

View attachment 467209

Did you miss the $16 a month that goes with that plan? Thats $192 a year that is not offset by anything, solar, powerwalls, net metering... nothing.

The cheap overnight rates come with a mandatory daily charge. I am in SCE (Southern California Edison) territory, on an old school tiered rate (one where you simply pay more as you use more) plan. Because of solar net metering (on NEM 1.0) I have saved a TON of money because I was always in "tier 4" previously, and never leave "Tier 1" now, prior to getting the tesla.

They are forcing me off that rate next year, and even their online "rate plan comparison tool" states that I will pay $1000 more a year than I do now, on any plan they currently offer... even the specific EV one that has $.13 per kW charge from midnight to 6am. That plan comes with a mandatory $12 per month charge. Right now, my charges are offset with credits from the utility, and that goes away.

I got my Model 3p last december, so this year is the first one I have with EV charging. I used to end up with about 400-500 in credit at the end of the year that edison would then pay me about $50 for, but I will owe this year... still cheaper than buying gas for my BMW though, by a lot.

I am getting 2 powerwalls to time shift and prepare for being forced off my plan, but thats pretty much the only real solution for the devaluation of solar power that is happening in CA by the CA utilities.

 

[Daniel in SD]

Did you miss the $16 a month that goes with that plan? Thats $192 a year that is not offset by anything, solar, powerwalls, net metering... nothing.

It does count toward the $10 minimum monthly bill so for people already at the minimum bill it only adds $6 a month. Obviously this calculation only matters for those thinking of adding an EV since if you're already at the minimum bill then your rate plan doesn't matter.
Adding more solar is probably more economical than powerwalls right now but I wouldn't be surprised if solar becomes even less valuable in the future. It feels like we're in a utility death spiral in San Diego. SDG&E wants to raise the minimum bill to $38 a month.