Elon: "Feature complete for full self driving this year"

[powertoold]

It's more effort to monitor Tesla's FSD + drive the car than to just drive the car as usual.

On the other hand, I'm sure Tesla will get at least 2000 drivers who'd willingly train the NN for free

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Rewatching the video a couple of times, it actually requires user input (accelerator pedal or gear stalk) to travel through green lights without stopping. So if, in any situation, the neural network accidentally classifies a red light as a green light, it will still come to a stop if the user does not acknowledge it.

I think this is a smart way to start this feature safely, and will be really good training data for the neural network. Users will give input as far away as they can, and they can start to use that input to firm up the confidence.

I wonder if this will ever get released to the main fleet. Or if it's just a feature for Early Access vehicles so they can help train the Neural Network.

It's certainly not something I'd find very useful. I might use it for a bit to simply cover the lights I typically encounter, and then I'd turn it off after growing bored of it.

 

[Knightshade]

Agreed but a "cheap" way for Tesla to train their NN. I assume the traffic light feature will be optional and this will let everyone who uses it help them train the system.

Not entirely clear on how this offers any "training" they couldn't have gotten by just recording if the driver does what the car thinks it should or not for each light without the system actively being on and requiring special added input checks?

 

[Daniel in SD]

Rewatching the video a couple of times, it actually requires user input (accelerator pedal or gear stalk) to travel through green lights without stopping. So if, in any situation, the neural network accidentally classifies a red light as a green light, it will still come to a stop if the user does not acknowledge it.

I think this is a smart way to start this feature safely, and will be really good training data for the neural network. Users will give input as far away as they can, and they can start to use that input to firm up the confidence.

Yep, I'm glad they haven't gone completely crazy. That's pretty clever, I'm not sure if any of us thought of that as a solution (EDIT: @mongo though of it). It seems like seeing the existence of a traffic control device would be almost as difficult as its state though so they must be relying on maps to know where all the intersections are.

 

[diplomat33]

That is what it seems like, but that also makes this "FSD" feature completely useless.

It's more effort to monitor Tesla's FSD + drive the car than to just drive the car as usual.

Agreed but a "cheap" way for Tesla to train their NN. I assume the traffic light feature will be optional and this will let everyone who uses it help them train the system.

I hope that once Tesla gets enough validation that the feature is reliable, we will get a "no confirmation" version.

 

[mongo]

Yep, I'm glad they haven't gone completely crazy. That's pretty clever, I'm not sure if any of us thought of that as a solution. It seems like seeing the existence of a traffic control device would be almost as difficult as its state though so they must be relying on maps to know where all the intersections are.

No one? Oh come on, remember you and me, March 19th in the FSD revenue thread?

Ha, but [t]hey do use maps, every intersection should have a traffic control device..Paranoid mode would be stop for all intersections unless green is highly 99% detected, or driver presses accelerator (in which case override if stop/red is highly detected).

 

[Daniel in SD]

No one? Oh come on, remember you and me, March 19th in the FSD revenue thread?

Dang sorry. I thought someone had thought of it so I went and checked and I missed that! Memory is going.

 

[mongo]

Dang sorry. I thought someone had thought of it so I went and checked and I missed that! Memory is going.

I'd probably be more concerned if someone did remember what i said a week ago on a different thread.

 

[willow_hiller]

I wouldn't discount the usefulness of this feature. It requires user input to proceed through an intersection on a green light. It does not require user input to stop on a red light, and will do so automatically.

This feature, even in its current form, will save lives.

 

[diplomat33]

I wouldn't discount the usefulness of this feature. It requires user input to proceed through an intersection on a green light. It does not require user input to stop on a red light, and will do so automatically.

This feature, even in its current form, will save lives.

I am curious though. What if the driver does not do anything on a green light, will AP also stop? Because stopping at a green light is a bad idea.

 

[willow_hiller]

I am curious though. What if the driver does not do anything on a green light, will AP also stop? Because stopping at a green light is a bad idea.

The vehicle coming to a stop is currently the consequence for "failing" the wheel torque check, and I haven't heard of many people actually incurring that penalty (or the people that have are too embarrassed to admit it).

I don't think there's audio in the clip of auto-stopping on twitter, but maybe if you're approaching a green light and haven't given input by 100 feet or so, it will give an audio alert as well before finally stopping?

 

[Cheburashka]

Not entirely clear on how this offers any "training" they couldn't have gotten by just recording if the driver does what the car thinks it should or not for each light without the system actively being on and requiring special added input checks?

Yeah exactly.

Hasn't Tesla been running "Shadow Mode" for all our drives?

 

[diplomat33]

The vehicle coming to a stop is currently the consequence for "failing" the wheel torque check, and I haven't heard of many people actually incurring that penalty (or the people that have are too embarrassed to admit it).

I don't think there's audio in the clip of auto-stopping on twitter, but maybe if you're approaching a green light and haven't given input by 100 feet or so, it will give an audio alert as well before finally stopping?

I get that but the car should not stop at all if the light is green. It will cause you to get rear ended.

 

[willow_hiller]

I get that but the car should not stop at all if the light is green. It will cause you to get rear ended.

Ideally the car shouldn't stop in the middle of a highway if the wheel torque check is failed either, but I was trying to say that safety mechanism hasn't caused any problems yet, so we may need to wait and see if this one causes problems.

 

[Daniel in SD]

I do wonder how well this system will work at yellow lights. Presumably you'd be confirming a couple seconds before a decision needs to be made. After that time the light could turn yellow and require a stop. Presumably the car will stop? Or will you have to press on the brake?

 

[EVNow]

That is what it seems like, but that also makes this "FSD" feature completely useless.

It's more effort to monitor Tesla's FSD + drive the car than to just drive the car as usual.

Anyone who feels that way - ofcourse, won't use it. Fair enough.

BTW, does anyone with HW3 see the stop light visualizations ? I don't in my car ...

 

[powertoold]

BTW, does anyone with HW3 see the stop light visualizations ? I don't in my car ...

I believe you have to turn it on in the settings.

 

[Snuffysasa]

Do we think this will stop at all red lights? or only the marked ones?

What will the system do at an unmarked intersection and detects a red-light or green light?

 

[Snuffysasa]

I hope that once Tesla gets enough validation that the feature is reliable, we will get a "no confirmation" version.

Of course that is for sure their plan. Might be several months or over a year though.

 

[Snuffysasa]

I wouldn't discount the usefulness of this feature. It requires user input to proceed through an intersection on a green light. It does not require user input to stop on a red light, and will do so automatically.

This feature, even in its current form, will save lives.

I think if you are approaching a light as green... I don't think it will require user input to proceed through the green light.... unless it previously decided it was a red light and started to slow to a stop...

Right?


I wonder if stops at a red light... then it turns green and the user does not indicate confirmation... I assume there will be some audible alert or warning... (green light warning).. right?