Emergency Lane Departure - False Positives

[Az_Rael]

As with most of these situations, failure to follow what other humans consider to be the “correct” behavior is what opens you to road rage. And road rage could put you at risk both due to drivers near you undertaking even more risky maneuvers or even taking it out on you.

It’s unfortunate but a reality of the social aspect of driving a car.

Yes, I think the Waymo cars get subject to a lot of road rage in Phoenix for similar reasons. Moving to more automation in cars is going to be an interesting transition. One of the main reasons I don't use NoA is because it does things a human wouldn't and seems like it will eventually get me subject to road rage. Decelerating entirely in the fast lane before changing into the slower lane is one of those odd NoA behaviors that may be technically correct, but not what normal humans do.

 

[diamond.g]

FWIW I did actually send an email to Tesla regarding the behavior of some of the user-selectable preferences. My argument is that we own the cars, we have the right to have a permanent preference setting so our cars can be predictable each day. Turns out you can not even disable WiFi beyond the next time the car starts (I can change passwords etc but..). I believe is a temporary indication at startup could be a reasonable compromise for some of the 'nanny' features ..

I am curious what will be the reply to my email.

I wonder if track-mode disables the nannies..

From my understanding track mode turns all autopilot features off, safety and convenience.

 

[mblakele]

I'd put it down as a small bit of evidence that Shadow Mode is only a hypothetical possible, a myth that Tesla is using it.

Not a myth: listen to the Autonomy Day presentation. They discussed shadow mode.

 

[chillaban]

Yes, I think the Waymo cars get subject to a lot of road rage in Phoenix for similar reasons. Moving to more automation in cars is going to be an interesting transition. One of the main reasons I don't use NoA is because it does things a human wouldn't and seems like it will eventually get me subject to road rage. Decelerating entirely in the fast lane before changing into the slower lane is one of those odd NoA behaviors that may be technically correct, but not what normal humans do.

Yeah there were some interesting articles about the Waymo cars in AZ. Some of the interviewed were Uber drivers afraid of robots replacing them. Others mentioned that the Waymo cars drive badly — stopping for no reason, refusing to make turns that seemed safe, etc.

Regardless of whether or not you’re legally in the right, humans are extremely temperamental about things in irrational ways. Like slowing down to let someone in during a merge causes seconds of inconvenience. Or getting behind someone going 68 when you really want to go 72. Even on a 5 hour road trip that might cost you a whopping 10 minutes, less than a single bathroom stop.

 

[Camera-Cruiser]

Moderators. This post should be a big fat sticky at the top of all pages and forums. I can’t imagine what would go through the mind of a 70+ year old driver getting a Tesla with this feature enabled after driving themselves for 50 or more years themselves.

Actually, I can imagine. My father would shoot it and drive over it with his bulldozer as a start, then drag the carcass back through the service center, and I do mean through the service center.

 

[Msjulie]

Alright I sense this is potentially provocative but.. does anyone think Tesla opens themselves up to class action or other messy affairs because these new features default to on regardless of how well (or not) they work now or in the future?

I think of how many didn't immediately welcome ABS as example, but importantly (I think) it's a passive system in the sense nothing happens until you touch the brakes. These car-takes-control features strike me as a new paradigm and one that could have unintended, negative consequences for Tesla.

 

[rrsurfer1]

Came to see if anyone else was experiencing issues, and woah!

I had a bit of a unique experience. I was driving in a residential neighborhood with no line markings at all. I made a left hand turn and as I came out of the turn my M3 decided I was too close to the road edge, took over and guided me around a gradual bend in the road. The whole time it was showing the road edge as a red line. This despite the fact that the road has no lines at all. I was not going to hit the side of the road so I would call it a false detection but I can also say the car took the curve perfectly so although it was startling, I wasn't in any danger.

I had thought the feature would only steer if you were in danger of hitting another car, but it appears to be more than that. Thinking this still needs work...

 

[rogersen]

We were driving up in the mountains in Norway with our Model 3 this weekend. LDA disabled. ELDA enabled, since it's the default. No AP or Adaptive Cruise.

ELDA has been OK the first few days we had it, but up in the mountains there is lots of narrow roads with only one lane in total (bi-directional) with no center markings. The speed limit is mostly 50mph/80kmhThere are side-markings, and there is some extra space outside the side markings. The idea is that you try drive in the right side of the only lane, and then go a bit outside the side markings when meeting another car. With ELDA enabled, this can soon become deadly in my view.. When meeting a car, I would try to steer slightly outside of the right side-markings of the road, as would the car from the opposite direction. If there was high grass or boulders on my side of the road, the car would start beeping loudly and try to steer directly into the oncoming car! After two near-death experiences, I disabled ELDA. I also disabled it on our way back home. I will now have to rember to disable this dangerous feature every time we drive on these kinds of roads..

If the car knew that it was in a "single lane/bi-directional road" it should disable this feature automatically. But I don't think the poor Model 3 even knows this. I'm OK with the AP being "beta", but Tesla should really test mandatory emergency features better before release..

 

[SammichLover]

Moderators. This post should be a big fat sticky at the top of all pages and forums. I can’t imagine what would go through the mind of a 70+ year old driver getting a Tesla with this feature enabled after driving themselves for 50 or more years themselves.

This isn't the first vehicle I've owned to do this, basically "out of the box". It is the first one to do it that I've not been provided the option to turn it off indefinitely, rather than needing to manually disable it each time I've put it into Park and then back to Drive.

It is possible there are other vehicles that do this, not providing an indefinite opt-out. A pox on their house, too.

 

[SammichLover]

Not a myth: listen to the Autonomy Day presentation. They discussed shadow mode.

Could you please provide a more specific citation, the timestamp would be great? That's a near 4 hour long video.

 

[sixela]

When meeting a car, I would try to steer slightly outside of the right side-markings of the road, as would the car from the opposite direction. If there was high grass or boulders on my side of the road, the car would start beeping loudly and try to steer directly into the oncoming car! After two near-death experiences, I disabled ELDA. I also disabled it on our way back home. I will now have to rember to disable this dangerous feature every time we drive on these kinds of roads..

Welcome to the Netherlands ;-). Most of the smaller roads are like this, with two fat bike suggestion lanes that confuse ELDA.

 

[CarMAN3]

Just adding another negative to the ELDA feature here. We live on one-lane roads and ELDA freaks out when it sees grass on the side of the road or when I have to get off to let someone pass. The biggest issue isn't just the nudging but the loud as hell warning that makes you lose concentration on whatever you were doing (i.e. driving..).

This needs a permanent off switch, pronto..

 

[SystemDisc]

If you're posting here about how dangerous ELDA is, make sure you also call or email Tesla. They need to know it's not just a handful of people.

 

[dloop]

Could you please provide a more specific citation, the timestamp would be great? That's a near 4 hour long video.

~2:02:07

 

[dschase]

Just been updated to 2019.16.2 yesterday. I have had 3 false positives of the Emergency Lane Departure feature panicking.

Twice yesterday panicking at vehicles clearly in another lane. One of which sent me outside of my lane, and very close to a Semi.

Today, it panicked at an incomplete Arrow in my lane. Got this one on camera, I;m definitely in my lane and it flinches at this arrow.

View attachment 411400

Anyone else had any false positives?

Yes -- it's crazy -- I've had it happen multiple times in different scenarios. In a couple cases I was driving on/near the white line on the right side of a 2 lane road in order to avoid pavement bumps in the main part of the road. Even though I'm going completely straight and not going off the road, the warning will come on. I tried to disable this feature but the next time you start the car, it turns it back on. What is the best way to report issues like this to Tesla?

 

[Msjulie]

Yes -- it's crazy -- I've had it happen multiple times in different scenarios. In a couple cases I was driving on/near the white line on the right side of a 2 lane road in order to avoid pavement bumps in the main part of the road. Even though I'm going completely straight and not going off the road, the warning will come on. I tried to disable this feature but the next time you start the car, it turns it back on. What is the best way to report issues like this to Tesla?

In general, you can send email to customer support or call service - though in the 2nd case, they reminded me the software is beta.

[email protected]

 

[rogersen]

Beta software shouldn't be mandatory/default to use.. Mandatory safety features should never be beta. If it's beta, it should be opt in, not opt out.

 

[bwilson4web]

Fine with all that except for the fact that it is right now tugging at my wheel to ram cars driving in the opposite direction. They made the red light detection warn only for now, so they can learn and improve before it actually brakes. Why not the same for ELDA?

Just a humble suggestion, you might tune the feature to match your driving style?

I did and other than the noise, it had no effect.

Bob Wilson

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

you might tune the feature to match your driving style?

What do you mean by this?

 

[TheLocNar]

Ran into an issue with this today. Oncoming traffic needing room to get past a cyclist, so I would always hug what shoulder on my side I can. Well. The car didn’t like that. Glad I was paying attention or it could have been ugly.