EMF Radiation

[nwdiver]

.... I personally think

That's why we invented science and double blind studies. No one has ever demonstrated the ability to sense EMF from any everyday appliance. They had plenty of motivation. If you could prove you could sense the presence of EMF you could have won $1M. Once controls are set in place it's not better than chance. EMF sensitivity is 100% placebo.

You need magnetic flux levels far higher than an efMRI for any biological effect and an efMRI is orders of magnitude more powerful than anything we interact with regularly. Think about it... if you could sense the 0.001µT from an electric motor wouldn't the 1-3T; >10M times greater from an efMRI be excruciating or lethal?

I'm always amazed about how hard it is to kill a demonstrably wrong idea once it gets out. Must be something about human nature. I wonder what things I believe are in fact entirely idiotic.

No kidding

 

[bak_phy]

Sometimes, at night, I can sense high frequency EMF coming at me from the front of my MX when I'm standing outside it. It's like a blinding light.

 

[Destiny1701]

At the risk of inflaming the discussion.... I personally think there is a lot of validity to EMF/EMI sensitivity. Many of us have different sensitivities to temperature, noise, flavors, etc. The most interesting and relevant to me has been BioGeometry. I've found Dr. Karim's BioGeometry tools and emitters make a noticeable health improvement for my family when measured/calibrated/installed and used per his methods.

Short summary: "BioGeometry is the only science that has been effectively applied on a wide scale for the harmonization of the effect of electromagnetic fields (EMFs) and geopathic stress (Earth energy grids) on biological systems. The environmental energy harmonization of the Swiss town of Hemberg in collaboration with mobile telecommunications provider SwissCom was the first successful application of its kind in the world. The residents of Hemberg suffering from the condition of electro-sensitivity reported to the independent monitoring institution and the media that their suffering was alleviated by the implementation of the BioGeometry solutions. A second project commissioned by the Kanton of Appenzell for the town of Hirschberg confirmed the successful application with regards to electro-sensitivity, and also focused on the positive effects on the ecology, and the project was documented by Swiss TV in a documentary that was aired on Swiss national TV channel SF1."

"Better Call Saul", a sort of prequel to "Breaking Bad", is great to watch, and has a major sub-plot about EMF sensitivity.

In the meantime, the very first post in this thread has some measured numbers for the Roadster. I know, you're asking about dual motor details, but it seems to me that you aren't prepared to take "irrelevant" for an answer. Or you could be answering the question for yourself for (US)$13.99. If the car is new it's more likely to be outgassing ("new car smell") than EMF.

It’a not that I’m unprepared lol, I’m absolutely ready for ‘irrelvant’ based on hard testing and empirical evidence...not because advocates of ‘EMF irrelevant’ say so. Or because of a test on one vehicle made with a far less powerful motor, battery etc.

Yes I’m quite curious about the dual motor cars with larger batteries/motors with higher voltage, capacities, amperage, induction, etc as they seem to be the standard these days.

Anyone taken the time to test out the D Tesla yet?

 

[pilotSteve]

That's why we invented science and double blind studies. No one has ever demonstrated the ability to sense EMF from any everyday appliance. They had plenty of motivation. If you could prove you could sense the presence of EMF you could have won $1M. Once controls are set in place it's not better than chance. EMF sensitivity is 100% placebo. ]

I assume you didn’t read the link in my post to Dr. Karim’s work. We can disagree yet consider other evidence.

 

[nwdiver]

I assume you didn’t read the link in my post to Dr. Karim’s work. We can disagree yet consider other evidence.

I ignore 'Drs' that ignore the laws of thermodynamics... you can't 'disagree' on the law of conservation of energy... you're right or wrong.

'Dr. Ibrahim Karim offers BioGeometry advice to Free Energy companies to mitigate EMF pollution'

 

[ohmman]

I assume you didn’t read the link in my post to Dr. Karim’s work. We can disagree yet consider other evidence.

OK, I took the bait and read his stuff and what others have to say. We can disagree, but we have to agree it’s not science. It’s a belief system not rooted in evidence. He’s a favorite of dowsers among other pseudoscience groups.

I’m happy you’re able to feel better due to this belief system, but I argue that it falls into the same realm as healing prayer.

 

[pilotSteve]

Quantum thermodynamics with “spooky action at a distance” etc was slow to be accepted by science defined thru mechanistic rather than probability frameworks. Perhaps it’s not useful or is harmful IDK but it has created positive health results for me.

Peace

 

[nwdiver]

Quantum thermodynamics with “spooky action at a distance”

Quantum entanglement was an observation that couldn't be explained. EMF sensitivity is speculation that has never been observed. Nobody wrote a paper about how they 'felt like' particles were mysteriously connected by an unknown force...

 

[buttershrimp]

I knew it! Thanks Elon!

 

[ggr]

Quantum entanglement was an observation that couldn't be explained.

While I agree with the rest of what you say, this is exactly backwards. Entanglement was a theoretical prediction by Einstein, Podolsky and Rosen in 1935, which Einstein himself poo-poohed as "spooky action at a distance" and didn't believe in; he thought that there was something missing from the then-expounded quantum theory. It was many years later (~1972) that it was experimentally verified. Quantum entanglement - Wikipedia

 

[nwdiver]

While I agree with the rest of what you say, this is exactly backwards. Entanglement was a theoretical prediction by Einstein, Podolsky and Rosen in 1935, which Einstein himself poo-poohed as "spooky action at a distance" and didn't believe in; he thought that there was something missing from the then-expounded quantum theory. It was many years later (~1972) that it was experimentally verified. Quantum entanglement - Wikipedia

Ah... true... if my interpretation is correct this is one of those...
- Predicted Mathematically
- Thought to be impossible because it violated something seen as universally true
- Confirmed experimentally
- Still unexplained...

Not sure if that's really 'backwards' but I was certainly missing a piece... it was predicted by Einstein before it was observed but my understanding is that there is still no theory that explains quantum entanglement since it requires information to travel faster than light...

 

[bak_phy]

it was predicted by Einstein before it was observed but my understanding is that there is still no theory that explains quantum entanglement since it requires information to travel faster than light...

Quantum entanglement does not require information to travel faster than light. As with all things QM the details matter tremendously.

Ask Ethan: Can we use quantum entanglement to communicate faster-than-light?

Quantum mechanics are quite well understood, but like all things there comes a point at which we have to say "because." Like when a child keeps asking "why?" or better yet this clip with Feynman.

 

[nwdiver]

Quantum entanglement does not require information to travel faster than light. As with all things QM the details matter tremendously.

I've read that there are factors which would prevent the use of quantum entanglement for FTL communication but changing one entangled particle alters the other instantaneously regardless of distance. That's what I was referring to. I don't think we have a explanation for how this occurs so quickly yet.

 

[bak_phy]

That's what I was referring to. I don't think we have a explanation for how this occurs so quickly yet.

It truly is weird, but then again so is everything else in QM.

 

[S'toon]

Free energy (pseudoscience) - RationalWiki

 

[Gery]

I have 2010 Roadster and love it, even though we owners were collateral damage when abandoned at the super charging stations. But, Elon personally gave me the keys at Newport Beach, I like the man and what he is doing.
Having said that, am I the only one deeply concerned about this wonderful "interconnectivity" convenience? Tesla Central command can trace me wherever I go, so therefore, so can the bad guys. If TSA malevolents decide I am a problem....well, the car may mysteriously go out of control on a bridge. Yes, it is fantastic to have automatic upgrades. But I think it much more important for the owner to have a manual switch to completely turn off any and all wireless.

When Elon passes the gavel, as all of us must eventually, the corporate giant may not be so benevolent. In any case, CIA and its bedfellows can figure out a way into any, even encrypted signals.

As to the public's present love affair with wireless, its well documented biological issues are huge, preventing me from buying a second Tesla. Should Elon want to build another "moat", I suggest he confront the wireless health issue. Could a different RF bandwidth prove beneficial instead of damaging? 5G is a killer. Elon and his people are genius; they could do it and further distinguish Tesla.

 

[nwdiver]

its well documented biological issues are huge,

... documented where?

Here?

'A lot of research has been done on this. The general picture is that there is no or a very weak relationship between health and ELF. ' Hmmm.... Nope

Here?

'Unlike x-rays and other forms of ionizing radiation, non-ionizing radiation does not have enough energy to remove electrons from atoms and molecules.' Hmmm... Nope

Here?

'Some experiments have suggested that there may be biological effects at non-thermal exposure levels, but the evidence for production of health hazard is contradictory and unproven' Hmmm... Nope...

If a photon cannot move an electron it cannot cause a chemical reaction => it cannot have a non-thermal biological effect. The few experiments that have shown a biological effect of non-ionizing radiation have not been replicable and were poorly controlled.

 

[hydro]

I found this link relating to EMF and nnEMF's (non native EMF):

EMF 5: What are the Biologic Effects of EMF?

I also read all the other EMF links :

• EMF 1: Does Your Rolex Work?
• EMF 2: Einstein, Meet Leptin
• EMF 3: The Origin of Life
• EMF 4: Why Might You Need Carbs for Performance?

I found the information fascinating.

 

[nwdiver]

I found this link relating to EMF and nnEMF's (non native EMF):

EMF 5: What are the Biologic Effects of EMF?

I also read all the other EMF links :

• EMF 1: Does Your Rolex Work?
• EMF 2: Einstein, Meet Leptin
• EMF 3: The Origin of Life
• EMF 4: Why Might You Need Carbs for Performance?

I found the information fascinating.

I appreciate that the author saved me a lot of time reading since the first sentence was

'Today’s blog is not long on science.'
​

Really not much need to go further. The plural of anecdote is not data.

 

[ohmman]

I found this link relating to EMF and nnEMF's (non native EMF):

EMF 5: What are the Biologic Effects of EMF?

I also read all the other EMF links :

• EMF 1: Does Your Rolex Work?
• EMF 2: Einstein, Meet Leptin
• EMF 3: The Origin of Life
• EMF 4: Why Might You Need Carbs for Performance?

I found the information fascinating.

From the beginning of the post:

Today’s blog is not long on science