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Runarbt
Active Member
the same goes for tolls as for the bus lane access.
imo, it would be rather stupid to demand city tolls from EVs when there are a airpolution problem in the cities.
ev-enthusiast
Active Member
The situation in Norway and Germany might be difficult to compare as there are very different prerequisites.
BTW thanks for reporting directly from Norway Yggdrasill!
For example in Munich in Germany there tends to be some traffic jam in the inner city during rush hour.
Going north from the city center there is a very busy street (Leopold street) and unfortunately only a tiny part of let's say 300m is avaliable as bus line.
Makes absolutely no sense to allow EV driving there, you will be part of the traffic jam before these 300m and after these 300m;(
In general there are so few bus lines in Munich that it is no incentive if you could use these with an EV to my opinion.
BTW this is just one lever showing why EV adoption in Germany is a bit more difficult in Germany compared to other countires.
What about keeping the benefit of using bus lanes / car pool lanes in countries where this makes sense and just increasing the requirements for using them during the next years?
I could imagine simply requireing an EV to be zero emissions and using energy more efficient than a certain threshold that might be reduced during the next years.
To my opinion the issue is not that there are some vehicles using bus lanes / car pool lanes in countries where this makes sense but too many.
This tells me that people like this incentive, should not be discarded for the future!
Good idea / bad idea?!
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Access to the bus lanes is only for zero emissions cars (BEVs) and has never been open for PHEVs. The discussion is about make the requirement (as Yggdrasill mention) to zero emission and 2+ people in the car.
Btw: here you see a part of the most discussed bus lane: Oslo, Norway. Electric Car in bus lane - YouTube
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RobStark
Well-Known Member
Norwegian Krone seems to be rebounding in conjunction with oil markets.
5/7/2015 NOK/USD close:0.13413
Bus lanes need to be prioritized for buses, which save far more CO2 than EVs. If those lanes become congested, buses slow down, removing one of their key advantages vs. driving private cars. So it's inevitable that, as EVs become more popular, their use of the bus lanes must be restricted. Taken to the logical extreme, if everyone drives EVs, allowing them to use bus lanes has effectively ended bus lanes. You actually get to that point well before 100% EV penetration.
The idea of allowing only HOV (2+ occupants) EVs in bus lanes is a good one.
Note that this reasoning re bus lanes can't be used to support removal of the toll waiver for EVs. To the extent these tolls exist to reduce in-city air and noise pollution, EVs should continue to be exempt.
The idea of allowing only HOV (2+ occupants) EVs in bus lanes is a good one.
Note that this reasoning re bus lanes can't be used to support removal of the toll waiver for EVs. To the extent these tolls exist to reduce in-city air and noise pollution, EVs should continue to be exempt.
In all probability, the logical extreme with everyone talking the bus (diesel buses) would entail far greater CO2 emissions than if everyone drove EVs or even fossil cars. This is because with each bus route you add, the amount of passengers per bus will decrease, given you start with the best routes first. But on the other hand, if you go from no diesel buses to one diesel bus, the CO2 savings would be significant.
Buses can be good and they can be bad. Every empty seat on a bus represents unnecessary emissions of PM, NOX and CO2. A bus will use 5-10 times more fuel than a fossil car, and an electric car running on clean hydropower will have a lifetime carbon footprint in the area of 30% of a fossil car. That means CO2-wise, a bus needs 5-10 passengers to be better than a fossil car, and about 17-33 passengers to be better than an electric car. Studies show that in Norway, the average bus has around 12 passengers, so, most likely, single occupant electric cars are better for the environment than diesel buses.
Buses are really primarily intended to deal with the congestion issue, not to be good for the environment. And I think buses don't make a huge amount of sense, until they are electric.
Yes, it's certainly a good way to cut down congestion in the bus lanes.
This is not the only thing that should be done. Currently, both taxis and buses are allowed in the bus lanes. I would like it to be so that only *electric* taxis and buses are allowed in the bus lanes. We already have a few electric taxis and buses, so this is proven technology. Taxis and buses cover vast distances in a year, most of it in urban zones, so the emission cuts will be very significant.
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Oh, you use diesel buses in Norway? Ouch. The cities I know in the U.S. switch to CNG years ago, and I had assumed as much in Norway. Diesel would change the equation, as you point out.
mta.info | Facts and Figures
MBTA Events
MBTA Events
Maine transit agency spurs wider adoption of alt fuels - Metro Magazine
Here in Portland we're even shifting over the school bus fleet to CNG:
Portland transitions to compressed natural gas school buses to save money, lungs BDN Maine
mta.info | Facts and Figures
MBTA Events
MBTA Events
Maine transit agency spurs wider adoption of alt fuels - Metro Magazine
Here in Portland we're even shifting over the school bus fleet to CNG:
Portland transitions to compressed natural gas school buses to save money, lungs BDN Maine
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The only place I know that use a significant number of CNG buses in Norway is Trondheim. I'd guesstimate that 95% of buses use diesel.
CNG is better, of course, but it's still not a slam dunk for the buses.
Sorry, wrong link
France - Avril 2015 : un mois record pour les ventes de véhicules électriques
Belgium - http://febiac.web4pro.com/nl_mon_brand.xls
France - Avril 2015 : un mois record pour les ventes de véhicules électriques
Belgium - http://febiac.web4pro.com/nl_mon_brand.xls
Oslo has quite a few testbusses of different types. They have single digit H2 Fuelcell busses, some ethanol-based biofuel busses, some CNG busses, and some local Oslo busses are mild hybrids as well. They usually also mix some biofuels into their diesel. Looking at Ruters webpage tells of all their different projects.
Cobos
Cobos
Updated the Wiki - especially Switzerland looks good, with 117 new Model S in April (30/19/149 for Jan-Mar).
Total is 669, so more than Jan/Feb but only about half as much as one third of Q1 totals - looks like they still need some end-of-quarter-rush even though Elon hinted in the ER CC that they would try to do without that in the Future. But there are some countries missing still.
Total is 669, so more than Jan/Feb but only about half as much as one third of Q1 totals - looks like they still need some end-of-quarter-rush even though Elon hinted in the ER CC that they would try to do without that in the Future. But there are some countries missing still.
Italy - 3 cars - Focus2move| New Car Sales in Italy -April 2015
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hobbes, thanks. Agree. The one "major" market missing is UK.
According to the data here: http://www.smmt.co.uk/2015/05/new-car-buyers-go-to-the-polls-confident-as-april-registrations-hit-10-year-high/
"other imports" is 179. For Jan-Mar, "other imports" is 510, while Tesla numbers according to Wiki table - 280. So ~54% of "other imports" were Teslas
If roughly the same proportion holds, we are at about 100 cars in UK for April.
All markets combined, probably around 800 cars in April, much more than in January, but below 1100-1200 Q1 monthly average
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hobbes, thanks. Agree. The one "major" market missing is UK.
According to the data here: http://www.smmt.co.uk/2015/05/new-car-buyers-go-to-the-polls-confident-as-april-registrations-hit-10-year-high/
"other imports" is 179. For Jan-Mar, "other imports" is 510, while Tesla numbers according to Wiki table - 280. So ~54% of "other imports" were Teslas
If roughly the same proportion holds, we are at about 100 cars in UK for April.
All markets combined, probably around 800 cars in April, much more than in January, but below 1100-1200 Q1 monthly average
Thanks! Added.
If you find more numbers, you can also add them to the table yourself:
1. Go to Europe Q1 2015 Model S sales - Tesla Motors Club - Enthusiasts & Owners Forum
2. Click edit
3. Add the number (only if you have a good source to link!)
4. In the column Source, put the month name and link it to your source for the data
5. Put your name and date in the "Last Update" column
5. Update the totals
6. Add a small note into the field "Reason for editing" below the table (like "added number for Cuba April 2015")
7. Hit "Save Changes"
Car4CivilizedAge
Member
I think numbers are looking good. Seems sales are picking up across the continent. Isn't the first month of quarters usually lot slower than last two? For Norway i think numbers will be substantially higher in May and June.
Just realiced that no official numbers was posted for Norway in April, so here it is:
230 (one less then my count)
http://www.ofvas.no/bilsalget-i-april/category659.html
Wiki updated.
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