EV parking priority

[Robert.Boston]

@vfx: Sounds like it's still in the planning stage. I'm always happy to see business owners exercise their freedom to set prices in a competitive market. I don't think that SUV-owners are a protected class, so as long as their pricing policy is clearly posted, I'm all for this.

There's even a general reasonableness about the approach, from a cost perspective: as the photo accompanying the article points out, there's a correlation between vehicle size and energy consumption. In a postage-stamp-sized parking lot like this, I'm sure that space is at a premium, and parking an F350 or an H2 may cause problems.

 

[spatterso911]

What if you drive a Chevy Traverse? Big SUV, but gets >15 mpg.

 

[bonnie]

What if you drive a Chevy Traverse? Big SUV, but gets >15 mpg.

There are always going to be outlying examples, but this seems like a good approach. Big vehicles take up more space than small vehicles. They should pay for the real estate they use in a small parking lot.

I grumble at work every morning because the spots outside the front door are clearly marked 'compact only' and filled with large SUVs that don't understand the concept of 'between the lines'. Twelve compact spots will be filled with 7 or 8 large vehicles. So I have no sympathy if they're actually (the horror!) asked to pay a little more for their fine parking skills, irregardless of mpg.

I would definitely patronize that parking lot, if it were a little closer.

 

[Dan5]

Those SUVs should pay more, in all actuality, the infrastructure had to be modified for those- larger parking spots, increased height of garage in some extreme examples.



In terms of EV parking priority, I'm wondering what the protocol would be:
Lets say you have 6 EVs and PHEVs and 3 spots, lets say the 6 cars are as follows

Roadster or Model S
Volt
Leaf
Fusion EV
PIP
MiEV

Who gets the spots? I say the Volt or PIP don't, but it still leaves 4 cars and 3 spots. I would think it would be interesting if you had to enter your phone number or something in the charge station and when someone else wanted to charge the station would alert you. I can see the MiEV/Leaf/Fusion EV owner calling the Tesla owner names for charging when they need to charge their more limited range vehicles.

 

[NigelM]

I can see the MiEV/Leaf/Fusion EV owner calling the Tesla owner names for charging when they need to charge their more limited range vehicles.

And' I'd let them have priority if I was able.

 

[Lloyd]

All the more reason for higher amperage Level II charging to 80 amps. They need to start producing these units!!! To date Clipper Creek is the only one!!

 

[vfx]

There's even a general reasonableness about the approach, from a cost perspective: as the photo accompanying the article points out, there's a correlation between vehicle size and energy consumption. In a postage-stamp-sized parking lot like this, I'm sure that space is at a premium, and parking an F350 or an H2 may cause problems.

And as the article points out heavier cars give more wear and tear to the pavement to mention dripping oil softening the asphalt.

I'd be interested in any followup on this site and how it's working. BEVs would get priority and that's a good thing. The lot may end up being a "safe have" for efficient vehicles.

Anyone else amused the company is called "Dinosaur"?

http://www.bostonherald.com/busines..._pay_more_to_park/srvc=business&position=also

BTW the article says CA HOV lanes allow one passenger when it's actually BEV's OK with no passengers.

 

[Robert.Boston]

BTW the article says CA HOV lanes allow one passenger when it's actually BEV's OK with no passengers.

I expect that the author meant "one occupant" rather than "one passenger and the driver". And, yes, I agree that the "Dinosaur" name was a fun, ironic twist.

As to priority among the list of EVs/EREVs/hybrids -- first come, first serve.

 

[SByer]

It's going to be an interesting experiment at work. Rolf is determined that any vehicle that plugs in should be able to. Parking at Google is, uhm, competitive. Until the PiPs and ActiveEs started arriving, I felt secure getting in past 11 knowing there would be an EV-only spot waiting. Not so much anymore, but I'm trying to embrace the attitude. I plug-in every day I drive to work to try and raise the usage stats earlier (moar plugs pleez!).

(I still want to castigate the PiP owners for buying such a lame lack-of-effort come-up-short vehicle - I'm hoping that will pass, but after reading the Toyota double-speak FAQ where they try and justify wimpy-ass sized batteries, I doubt it).

 

[Robert.Boston]

(I still want to castigate the PiP owners for buying such a lame lack-of-effort come-up-short vehicle - I'm hoping that will pass, but after reading the Toyota double-speak FAQ where they try and justify wimpy-ass sized batteries, I doubt it).

John Petersen thinks the PiP's battery is just the right size -- or maybe too large by about 8kWh.:tongue:

 

[daniel]

... Who gets the spots? I say the Volt or PIP don't, but it still leaves 4 cars and 3 spots. ...

First come, first served? As for Volt and PiP, I agree with you. But if you go to Prius or Volt chat boards you will find people very angry at the idea that they should not qualify. EV drivers will talk about who "needs" the spot more. PHEV and REEV owners will talk about saving gas, and that their shorter electric range means that society benefits more if they can top off and use less gas, and that not every EV needs a charge to get home.

I will not use a public charge spot unless I need it and since I never drive far enough from home to need it, I won't use them. And I prefer to park farther out and stretch my legs.

... I still want to castigate the PiP owners for buying such a lame lack-of-effort come-up-short vehicle...

For long trips, where a Leaf will not suffice, the Prius gets better FE than a Volt, and costs much less than a Tesla. A lot of folks are less interested in eliminating gas usage than in getting the "best" car for their driving habits. I am not willing to add 4 hours to a full day's driving. So if my Roadster won't make the drive I'll take the Prius. And the PiP has two advantages over the regular Prius: Somewhat better mpg, and there's less wear and tear on the ICE because it need not start for trips so short that it would not warm up completely. I know a guy who bought one for exactly that last reason. He can't afford a Model S, he doesn't trust GM, he is wary of the Leaf because it lacks active cooling and there's no warranty on battery life (only against defects). The PiP is the only choice for a lot of people.

But it definitely deserves to be at the bottom of the priority list at public chargers.

 

[jerry33]

(I still want to castigate the PiP owners for buying such a lame lack-of-effort come-up-short vehicle - I'm hoping that will pass, but after reading the Toyota double-speak FAQ where they try and justify wimpy-ass sized batteries, I doubt it).

In my opinion, the PiP was designed to solve these shortcomings that people complained about in the 2004 Prius:

1. The engine starts when I do the driveway shuffle. This has almost as many posts as the centre console in the Model S.

2. In a really bad stop-and-go situation the engine starts after about 15 minutes just to charge the battery. The amount of EV range should prevent this from happening in almost all cases.

3. Living in a small town or not driving more than ten minutes kills the mpg.

The PiP solves these problems and my guess is that development (at least the goals) really started on this in about 2005. It wasn't meant to be a mostly electric car, just a car that overcame the worst of the complaints (Toyota has consistently shown that they dislike electric cars and make them under protest).

However, it also means that if you aren't affected by at least two of the three shortcomings, you're better off with a standard Prius.

 

[SByer]

Yeah, I get why the PiP exists. It's not engineering driven, to be sure. It's frustrating that it so stubbornly doesn't move the line, well, at all, really. I think I wouldn't be nearly as upset if they didn't qualify for the green sticker, which thy most certainly do not deserve (but, yeah, I know where that program is run out of and the myopic, non-forward-thinking view CARB has).

Really, it's the only car I have trouble with seeing in the charging spots, currently. And of course, when I get stuck behind one going only 60mph on the freeway to stay in EV mode, it'll tick me off even more. Sigh.

(I think, at the core, I'm pissed because Toyota engineering was so #*$&*$#!!! spineless to not stand up and say with just this little bit of improvement we could do highway speeds and have an AER>0. Not true engineers if you don't yell at the marketing folks for lame decisions).

 

[ElSupreme]

Really, it's the only car I have trouble with seeing in the charging spots, currently. And of course, when I get stuck behind one going only 60mph on the freeway to stay in EV mode, it'll tick me off even more. Sigh.

I have this problem with non Plug in Priuses. And for some reason they get into the leftmost out of 4-6 lanes.

 

[TEG]

One nice thing about CHAdeMO right now, is there really isn't much other than a LEAF (or stray iMiEV) using them... So less 'competition' for the spots.
No concern about a Volt or PiP trying to use that charge spot. Imagine if Volt or PiP had QC (like CHAdeMO) to charge their pack in a couple of minutes...

 

[Dan5]

One nice thing about CHAdeMO right now, is there really isn't much other than a LEAF (or stray iMiEV) using them... So less 'competition' for the spots.
No concern about a Volt or PiP trying to use that charge spot. Imagine if Volt or PiP had QC (like CHAdeMO) to charge their pack in a couple of minutes...

But the kicker would be that they would charge it, and leave their car in the spot long after it is charged. I would go as far as to say that charging stations should make you put you cell phone number in them to initiate charging, then when you are done it calls you are texts you. And also have a little button on the charger that other ev owners can push and it would ONLY send out the text if you were fully charged

 

[Lloyd]

Remember that the batteries need to still conform to proper "c" rates for charging. Even though the battery is smaller does not necessarily mean if there is a ton of power availabe that they can take it and store it as fast as is availabe.

One nice thing about CHAdeMO right now, is there really isn't much other than a LEAF (or stray iMiEV) using them... So less 'competition' for the spots.
No concern about a Volt or PiP trying to use that charge spot. Imagine if Volt or PiP had QC (like CHAdeMO) to charge their pack in a couple of minutes...

 

[rabar10]

For L1/L2 charging spots, the cars will remain for some number of hours, most likely unattended. Any rules on accessibility would need to be posted and then enforced by someone.

L3 (CHAdeMO etc.) occupancy should be measured in minutes, and I'm guessing the vehicle will be attended or the driver at least close-by... If drivers are present and friendly, then the option is at least there for negotiations.

 

[Robert.Boston]

I predict the creation of a new profession: charging valet.

 

[DuncanWatson]

I predict the creation of a new profession: charging valet.

I could see that. A limited number of charged parking spots for a restaurant parking (or theatre, event, whatever) has the owners decide to portion them out on a first come first charged basis with valets shuffling the vehicles around as needed. Pretty cool, nice thought.