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EVSE Necesarry?

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by Sacrament055, Feb 25, 2013.

  1. Sacrament055

    Sacrament055 Member

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    From what I'm reading I'm getting the impression that all I'll really need is a NEMA 14-50 wall outlet installed in the garage to plug into. I'm just trying to confirm from people on this board that I won't actually need an EVSE to power my Model S.

    Thanks for your help
     
  2. mnx

    mnx 2013 P85

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    Yes, a 14-50 will work well for charging your Model S at home. The car comes with the cable to plug into a 14-50.
     
  3. stevezzzz

    stevezzzz R;SigS;P85D;SigX

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    Most people will never need anything more than a 14-50 at home for overnight charging. I've owned both a Roadster and an S and have never been limited by having 'only' a 40a charge capability. The only use case that makes sense for a HPWC at home is one where your daily drive requires more than a single charge AND you have a route that includes a stop at home in the middle your day.
     
  4. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    I am going with 14-50. 40a is more than enough.
     
  5. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    Another "14-50 is good enough". There's another thread somewhere asking about twin chargers vs. single charger and my answer there is much the same for the same reasons.

    When would you need more than 25-30 miles/hour in charge rate? Overnight, that's more than enough to completely fill a drained battery. There's just not much occasion to want a higher charge rate. For me, there are really only 2 use cases:
    1) daily driving => overnight charging
    2) road trip => supercharging

    If you frequently were driving more than a charge worth of battery daily and didn't have access to a super charger, that'd be the only case where I'd see you needing a faster charge rate. That's a fairly unusual usage profile for a driver though and I'd guess you'd know if you were in that category.
     
  6. jomo25

    jomo25 P4398

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    Yes a 14-50 is all that is normally needed. The UMC supplied is technically an EVSE. And it comes with the MS, so another isn't needed.

    The only reason I am looking into other EVSEs is that (a) I have a Volt also and want something I can share between the two, so I don't have to keep plugging/unplugging either and (b) my HOA is being a major PITA. Note that the UMC is not UL approved, thus it doesn't meet one of their conditions. The HPWC is UL approved, but its useless for my Volt.
     
  7. HFh

    HFh Member

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    14-50 is almost certainly enough. I get 24 miles / hour. That's sort of a worst case for a 14-50. You do the math for your situation. In my case, I end up completely recharged after my daily drive in less than 3 hours. It isn't useful to be twice as fast.

    Having said that:

    - I will get an HPWC when my wife gets a Model X because I'll need two outlets so I might as well have one of them be an HPWC for that one time in six years I'll wish I had it.

    - I did get twin chargers because why not?
     
  8. Sacrament055

    Sacrament055 Member

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    Thanks to all of you for the answers. Here is a new question based on the last response: What does the letter after the NEMA 14-50 mean? I'm seeing 14-50r and 14-50p for example and I'm really just looking at what material I'm going to need to buy (Receptacle/Outlet, Wire, Circuit Breaker)
    Here's what I think I need and you can tell me if this will or won't work.
    1. Amazon.com: Leviton 279-C00 50A, 125/250V, NEMA 14-50R, 3P, 4W, Flush Mtg Cheetah Receptacle, Black: Home Improvement
    2. Southwire 125 ft. Black 6-3 Romex NM-B W/G Wire-63950002 at The Home Depot
    3. Amazon.com: Siemens Q260 60-Amp 2 Pole 240-Volt Circuit Breaker: Home Improvement

    thanks
     
  9. Plug Me In

    Plug Me In Member

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    The R is what you want. "L" designations I believe are for twist lock connections; not sure what the P is.
     
  10. markb1

    markb1 Active Member

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    NEMA 14-50R is the receptacle, and 14-50P is the plug. You want the 14-50R.
     
  11. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    You need to get a 50A breaker to match the NEMA 14-50 plug. Putting a 60A breaker on the same circuit as the 14-50 is a code violation, unnecessary, and somewhat dangerous.
     
  12. AMPd

    AMPd Active Member

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    My work commute to and from equals to about 160 miles, I live 30 miles away from my parents house where they have a family gathering every Sunday for dinner.
    If I'm working Sunday I have enough time to stop by the house for a shower and a change of clothes before heading out to dinner,
    having an 80amp charge during that time is very helpful

    But that's just my case :)
    everyone has different needs
     
  13. Sacrament055

    Sacrament055 Member

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    Ok that's a good point so then my next question is could I use: Amazon.com: Siemens Q250 50-Amp 2 Pole 240-Volt Circuit Breaker: Home Improvement
    I notice it's a 2 pole solution but it appears the nema connector is 3 pole.
     
  14. shokunin

    shokunin P85 & S40

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    that's fine, you only need breakers on the two "hot" 120v lines providing 240v. The 3rd pole is neutral and you also have a ground.
     
  15. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    3) road trip where there is no supercharging => dual chargers

    But for your garage, I completely agree. 40A is completely sufficient. That's what I use, and I have 70A available.
     
  16. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Make sure your breaker takes that type of breaker (Siemens Q style). But as for rating it looks right. There are numerous types of breakers. I took some close up pictures of my breaker panel information sheet, and the breakers themselves and then went down to Lowes. I picked up a NEMA 14-50 receptacle, a breaker, a face plate and junction box all for about $20. I whipped out my phone and matched the breaker information on my pictures to the correct breaker at Lowes.

    You only need a 2 pole breaker, you only need to break the hot feeds. Your neutral and ground go back to your bus bars in your main panel.

    As for wire I got some free THNN wire from work, and some scrap conduit. So I had 4 sepearte wires. Your wire is Romex 6-3 with ground. It actually has 4 wires in it. You have 3 wires at 6 gauge which are for you two hots and neutral. There will be another ground wire which will be smaller. Your neutral and ground skip the breaker in your panel and tie directly into the neutral and ground bus.
     
  17. gregincal

    gregincal Active Member

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    To me that equals "not gonna happen" (charge an hour to drive an hour). But to each his own.
     
  18. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    Yea, thought about mentioning that. I did mention that >40A would be someone with a pretty atypical usage scenario and that such a person would likely know if they're in that category.

    I won't take a road trip without super chargers. How many people are willing to wait ~5-6 hours even with 70A charging? Obviously it's been done, but I suspect I'm fairly "typical" in my reluctance. Presumably Tesla thinks folks willing to do that are pretty rare too or they wouldn't be investing in superchargers.
     
  19. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    I routinely do a modest road trip, where I need one hour of topping up to complete it.
     
  20. Alpha

    Alpha Member

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    The breaker needs to be 50A, not 60A, and that's important!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Sorry, answered that before I realized several other people already mentioned that!
     

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