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First no charger, now no key fob, what's next??

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Sure the $375 combined for these items can easily be afforded by anyone purchasing an S or X

Then people can just buy them if they want to. And if they don't want to, they don't go to waste. I don't see what the big deal is.

I bet floor mats will soon be on the chopping block.

The floor mats are junk. They should do us all a favor and stop making them right now, just to save the landfills. Not to mention they are dangerous... carpeted mats develop folds that can mess with the pedals, people have died this way.


The fact that Tesla is not doing this (offering a credit) makes it a fact that this is about saving money and continuously decreasing value to customers to Tesla's benefit.

This is flawed logic. They're removing optional items that many customers don't use. That's just good stewardship of the planet and efficient manufacturing. But in doing so, it doesn't mean they should lower the vehicle price. Not when they have a 9 month waiting list and can't even know how much it will cost them to produce those future vehicles that they've already sold.
 
Hard to valet a car without a key fob!! I wouldn’t want to give the key card or obviously not my phone for someone else to drive the car.

?? I leave one of my key cards for the valet. Never take mine out of my wallet. What I really want is to tie the valet profile to my designated valet key card.

How hard? Model 3 and Y owners may need to know this

Not hard at all. We have a ‘22 SPlaid and YPerformance. No issues. My phone opens both cars wirelessly and my keycard works on both cars. Same for wife. Only the valet card we programmed is unique to each car.

I never thought about this until now. Is it really that easy to program a phone or spare card if a valet is given a card? That is a serious security vulnerability. It would be an easy fix on Tesla’s part to allow us to create a valet key card that does not have the privilege of allowing programming. Personally, I always put my car in Valet mode when handing off my vehicle. That should solve that problem.

Yes. I do same as you. Put in Valet mode first. Being able to tie the card to the profile would rectify it. Easy fix. Come on Tesla!

Also, added benefit to the key fob is the ability to move the car forward and back very simply with the fob. Or open the charge port door. As others noted, also very easy to open the frunk and trunk as well, rather than having to take the time to open the app, go to the correct page and open the trunk or frunk from there. It's such a useful little thing that we've taken for granted on cars for the past 30+ years. Even more so now that most are passive key fobs that don't require pushing a button to unlock the doors and for many cars, like the Tesla, also let you simply get in and drive away without having to give a thought to placing a key card somewhere.

Tesla customers made a lot of noise when the Model 3 didn't have a key fob option. It took Tesla only a few months to offer one. The customers spoke. There will of course always be a few that are satisfied with just using the phone key option. Can't imagine anyone believing the key card option is best for daily use, but there may be a couple. But the majority of owners prefer a simple key fob.
Yes. Summon with FOB is easier. But I don’t mind pulling out the phone for the app. I don’t move the car often enough to care.

Frunk too. Agree with you. But trunk? Just use the physical switch on the car. Hand in pocket to use FOB vs hand reach out to use switch. Not much difference to me. I guess one could be dirty. :)

Key card is backup for me. Phone as key works best. Hands free and I’ve only had to reposition myself once for it to work wirelessly.

And I have many friends with 3’s and Y’s. None have purchased the FOBs. Conversely everyone I know with pre refresh S and X wanted the phone key. Me too.

But we love what we have on our ‘22s. My Plaid FOBs are sitting in a zip block bag unused. She didn’t get any with her YP. And she don’t care. :)
 
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Tesla nickel and dime approach to maintaining / increasing its margins. I was told by my service advisor that the new refreshed matrix headlights and taillights are actually cheaper to manufacture despite being a modern look

That's how manufacturing is supposed to work. The goal is always about cost reduction. At a million cars a year, each nickel saved is $50k.

Taking out optional/unused components is a no brainer. The only cost reduction that's a problem is when it also results in a quality reduction. Tesla *is* guilty of that too IMO (radar, usb data). Although they removed radar because of vision only (poor choice IMO) and usb data due to supply shortage.
 
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This level of cost cutting on a 6 figure car is insulting.
Yup. And they removed the multifunction control stalks, the physical wheel buttons, and the center horn switch—all of which they replaced with cheap, horrid ‘haptics’. They removed the physical mirror controls, chopped off half the steering wheel, and made the door releases cheaper and sh/ttier by separating the electric release button from the mechanical release (like the Model 3&Y) but added an utterly useless rear passenger screen.

I hope the coming Mercedes EQE is truly great. Tesla needs a reckoning and I’m ready to try someone else’s bs.
 
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Hard to valet a car without a key fob!! I wouldn’t want to give the key card or obviously not my phone for someone else to drive the car.
It probably depends on where you live. Here in SoCal, everyone knows about the key card because of Model 3 and Y. I am not sure how they sort it out at the key hanging station though.. do they have like zip lock sandwich bags with a hole? LOL. I bought a id card holder with a key ring and put that in my glovebox. If I valet park, I put my card in there and hand the whole thing over.
 
Hard to valet a car without a key fob!! I wouldn’t want to give the key card or obviously not my phone for someone else to drive the car.
Should be easy to validate right? Get your hands on a friend’s phone and download the Tesla app. You actually need to add a driver and grant someone else access. A valet will not be able to download and create a key. Programming an blank keyfob is the more likely scenario because you can order those online from Tesla. If you put the car in valet mode, I’m sure you can’t even pair new keys as an option. Stop stressing out, keyfobs are a thing of the past and Elon and Tesla has the data to back it up. When I get into my car with my phone & keyfob, it will show both as paired. I’m sure that 98% of its customers only pair their phones and rarely the keyfob. The few will be unhappy, but there’s plenty more customers who don’t care. I hated carrying my keyfob because it’s just one more thing in my pockets. I’m also OCD and want the fob to be pristine but impossible by putting it in the same pocket as my house keys. If I would never have to carry keys ever again, I would gladly implant a chip under my skin to access my digital world.
 
Yup. And they removed the multifunction control stalks, the physical wheel buttons, and the center horn switch—all of which they replaced with cheap, horrid ‘haptics’. They removed the physical mirror controls, chopped off half the steering wheel, and made the door releases cheaper and sh/ttier by separating the electric release button from the mechanical release (like the Model 3&Y) but added an utterly useless rear passenger screen.

I hope the coming Mercedes EQE is truly great. Tesla needs a reckoning and I’m ready to try someone else’s bs.
No one is stopping you. There is the EQE, Taycan, and Lucid in that price category. Any EV is a fine EV if you’re using it as a daily driver and charge mostly at home. I still prefer the tesla because of its vertical integration and how through software you can get additional features. With the exception of Lucid, its software can’t control all the OEM components. The technology, software, and innovation is what makes Tesla great. Like I said, good product design is based on data and not opinion. You have to take risks to advance. Did you complain when Apple took away the headphone jack? Now all manufacturers are following. I first stumbled with the haptic controls and yoke steering wheel, but I now don’t even think about it and feels natural. I feel awkward going back into an ICE car and actually have to press on the brakes or get back into my Porsche where there are a million buttons.
 
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When the structural battery on the S starts to save Tesla money, good luck getting battery repair when there is a problem (according to Sandy Munro on the Y). Chances are, you junk the car and buy new?
Well, that’s on Tesla. If still under warranty and they have to get you a new car it’s not on you. Why would you junk it? The Munro video shows how simple it is to pull it out of the Y and they can easily give you a brand new structural pack without dismantling your car.

 
Yup. And they removed the multifunction control stalks, the physical wheel buttons, and the center horn switch—all of which they replaced with cheap, horrid ‘haptics’. They removed the physical mirror controls, chopped off half the steering wheel, and made the door releases cheaper and sh/ttier by separating the electric release button from the mechanical release (like the Model 3&Y) but added an utterly useless rear passenger screen.

I hope the coming Mercedes EQE is truly great. Tesla needs a reckoning and I’m ready to try someone else’s bs.
Couldn't agree with you more. I've already jumped off the train and am now checking to see if the grass is greener on the other side. I won't say it's greener, but it's certainly not brown.

For those that want the same type of company experience, LUCID is offering a very nice alternative right now. More luxurious. More functional frunk. Better range. More power. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I was never impressed with it in photos, but saw and drove one and the Lucid definitely looks much better in person than in photos.

The Mercedes EQS isn't the greatest looking car on the outside. The new SUV however, appears to look much better proportioned. But, I was never in love with the looks of a Tesla. I bought several of them for what they were, not because of how it looked. The EQS blows Tesla out of the water in terms of interior quality and actual luxury. Not even in the same category. Beautiful, luxurious interior. And, it too has more range than a Tesla.

The Cadillac due out very soon seems like a no brainer when comparing to a Model 3 or Model Y. Certainly FAR more luxurious. Now, cheaper in price. Competitive range. Supercruise in some respects is superior to Tesla's autopilot, at least on the freeways.

Personally, I was ready for a Truck. I bought both, the F-150 Lightning and the Rivian. The Ford was a great work truck and if I truly needed a functional work truck, absolutely hands down is the better of the two options. The Rivian is more of an adventure vehicle, intended for a different user.

The Ford is more driver friendly in terms of function as it has usable buttons to go along with extensive tech. The Rivian, like Lucid, puts you back in a Tesla like company. Both feel very familiar for those coming from a Tesla. The rest require the dealer experience. Which I don't miss. But, for the most part, it's just one time, so once you get past the purchase phase, it doesn't have much of an impact other than, there are usually a million of them close by.

Tesla, certainly still blows everyone out of the water with its charging network. So, if you're one that travels over 300 miles on a very regular basis, it will make a difference. For those like me, where such trips are limited to 1-3 times per year. the Public Charging networks available do get the job done. The rest of the time, I plug it in at home every night and don't notice any difference from the Tesla.

I like the party tricks the Tesla offers. But have realized since, now that I don't have them, I don't really miss them either. I didn't buy my car to watch movies or play video games. Never used those features. The FSD was cool to experience, but it's so far from being ready for regular use that I hardly ever used it if anyone was behind me, out of respect for my fellow motorists. Living in L.A., there's not many times where someone isn't close by, thus hardly got to use it. Did use it regularly on the freeway for simple lane keeping, which most cars today offer something similar.

So yes, the Tesla offers more, but most of it's "more" are things that aren't really necessary with a good number of them simply being cool party tricks to show off to your friends.

As noted, I purchased the Rivian and Ford F-150 Lightning. Had an extended test day with the Lucid (all three have key fobs and portable chargers by the way, included in the sale).

All three have far superior FRUNKS that are automatic and large enough to actually use. Versus the Tesla's delicate hood that you have to be so careful to close with two hands in the right spot to avoid bending it.

I do miss the GPS based homelink. Assuming that can be added on the others via software updates.

Only on the very rare occasions when I do a long distance trip, do I miss the supercharger network. But, the other options do get the job done and accomplish the same thing.

The rest of what the Tesla offers, which is quite a bit, but are things I have found that I really don't miss and didn't need. I will miss the "summon" feature as it did come in handy on occasion. But haven't yet.

The Audi, Porsche, Jaguar aren't up to par yet with ranges under 250 miles. But, they're coming too. As are many others. Point being. Even with the limited options available today, I've learned that I CAN LIVE WITHOUT A TESLA after having been in several of them for 9 years. Others are offering enough now to make them viable competitors. I also now have cooled seats. Could have massaging seats. Along with many other features that the competitors offer and Tesla doesn't.

For now, Tesla still has more orders than what they can produce. So they couldn't car less. But, eventually, things will catch up. By then, there will also be at least another 10 alternatives that hit the market. Tesla WILL have to come back down to earth and be competitive.

I really wanted a truck and I feel right at home with the Rivian. A similar experience. Its a truck that could have had Tesla's name on it as they did a very good job with it. The interior is far nicer than a Tesla though. Aside from the key fob and charger issue, Tesla drove me away with the direction they chose on the Model S. I had a new one for a couple of weeks to try and adapt to. Absolutely not for me. I work out of my car. Am in and out of it 10 times a day. Lots of 3-point turns. L.A. traffic, where horns are needed to prevent you from getting hit. I hated the Model 3 I had and kept for only 2 months. The Model S doubled down on all the reasons I hated the Model 3. Tesla still builds a great car, but their direction unfortunately, just doesn't work for my needs anymore. I use the hell out of the top of my steering wheel on a daily basis. Hated "looking" over to the center screen to simply shift from D to R and back to D again, Was previously a no thought instinctive action I could do by feel without having to distract myself to the screen. Constantly was turning on blinkers by accident. I really miss having the vertical screen in the pre-refresh Model S. Was so easy to see and reach everything. These big horizontal screens put things too far from the driver when on the far right of the screen. One of the reasons the Ford was attractive. Lucid, Mercedes and Cadillac all have tons of screen space and in closer reach to the driver.

As much as I love the Tesla and all the great things about it, there's now just too much for me to sacrifice in my personal use needs. I realize I'm sacrificing very little with the Rivian (of the features I actually use) and benefit from the things it offers (that Tesla didn't) far more on a daily basis to offset the 1-3 times I don't get to use superchargers. I appreciate that Rivian takes my calls to answer simple questions. I find I really benefit from having 110 outlets. I use the frunk like a regular trunk (never used Tesla's frunk). The air suspension is incredible. Rides nothing like a "truck".

If I wanted a car, I came very close to purchasing the Lucid and Mercedes. Loved what both had to offer. But ultimately, wanted the truck instead. If I were in the market for a small SUV, for $63,000, I would absolutely 1,000% choose the Cadillac over the Model Y. I love the luxury it offers. Has true hands-free driver assist on freeways. It's a love it or hate it style. Personally, I love its looks. As noted, I bought Tesla's because of what they were, not because of their "luxury", which was very little nor for their looks. Was never in love with the look of the Model S. For my personal tastes, simply did not like the looks of the Model 3 or Y or even the X. Especially the front ends of the 3 & Y.

For my use needs, the alternatives all satisfy them and they all return phone calls and they all have great attitudes towards their customers. Tesla's customer service has become atrocious over the past 5 to 6 years. They were INCREDIBLE at the start. But now, have the attitude of "don't like it, tough". I'm one that never kept cars more than 3 years. Was always ready for something fresh and new within that time frame. The fact that Tesla kept me in basically the same looking cars for 9 years is saying something.

But, now that the alternatives available are actually viable alternatives, thus far, I have zero regrets for having switched over to other side. Actually enjoying having something different and new. Great thing is, I can always go back to a Tesla if I choose to. But, with the directions they've gone, primarily with the interior and minimalism, and what's now available as alternatives for much more reasonable pricing, I don't see it happing anytime soon unless they do a complete 180 on several things.

I loved my years in the Tesla, am very appreciative that Elon Musk almost single-handedly created this category and will never regret that ride. I am also very thankful for now having a choice of competitive offerings that allow me to finally chose a vehicle that I am actually excited about how it looks and has driver friendly functions that suit my needs. Tesla will still be the first choice for many, and rightfully so. But, there are now alternatives available that equally allow families to choose an EV as their only vehicle.
 
Maybe someone can explain it to me. When I had a loaner M3, I had to take the card out and place it at/near the driver's pillar to access the car. With the card, it this the only way to access the vehicle aside from opening the app and hitting the button? Is an alternative via continuously on bluetooth connection via the phone? Thanks for the education!
 
Maybe someone can explain it to me. When I had a loaner M3, I had to take the card out and place it at/near the driver's pillar to access the car. With the card, it this the only way to access the vehicle aside from opening the app and hitting the button? Is an alternative via continuously on bluetooth connection via the phone? Thanks for the education!
The app must stay open in the background and the car will automatically unlock on proximity if Bluetooth is enabled and the phone is paired.
 
it May be more convenient for you to use the card then
Really? Take the card out of your wallet and tap the pillar? what I do is just take the phone out of my back pocket for it to wake the screen or tap the power button to wake it while in my butt pocket and the doors unlock. We all have our cell phones with us at all times and readily available. Phones are designed to multi-task btw, Android and iOS. If you have the Tesla app widget on your screen, then it ensures that it's always on in the background. When an app is in the background, it just means that you've opened it once and it's in the stack of apps in your phone history. Hearing people struggle with the convenience of a smart phone and not knowing how a phone OS works is puzzling especially when they are Tesla owners.
 
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