For those of you who purchased the FSD add-on when you reserved the car, what caused you to do that vs. waiting to add it later after delivery? Are you happy with your decision? What aspects of your driving experience with the FSD add-on cause you to believe you made a mistake in prepaying vs. subscribing for the FSD after vehicle delivery? Have you tried contacting Tesla or utilizing other channels to remedy the situation if your FSD experience fell short of your expectations?
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FSD - Worthwhile Investment?
- Thread starter Sappy02
- Start date
1) Subscription wasn't an option at the time.
2) Falls way short of expectations - slowly improving, keep it turned off 95% of the time.
3) Just a 'toy' to show people
4) Would recommend saving the money, going with Enhanced Auto Pilot if offered
5) Was much cheaper to add it when we bought the car over purchase later.
6) More work on my part than with EAP.
2) Falls way short of expectations - slowly improving, keep it turned off 95% of the time.
3) Just a 'toy' to show people
4) Would recommend saving the money, going with Enhanced Auto Pilot if offered
5) Was much cheaper to add it when we bought the car over purchase later.
6) More work on my part than with EAP.
Definitely less expensive at purchase than as an add-on, so there's that. Personally, I like all of the EAP features and wouldn't want to do without them, so barring an EAP option, I would likely pay for the FSD feature to get them even without the FSD beta existing. However, I don't know what they are charging now. For reference, when they raised it to $10k, I found the price-point to be more reasonable than the vocal crowd because I've seen what similar options cost on other vehicles. Most manufacturers only offer packages now and not individual options, so I figure maybe people willing to buy those packages don't actually realize how much they're paying for a given option in such packages.
I like the way you think, and appreciate yor point for the OP, but I believe a vehicle is technically an asset. Further, I'm not sure the facts that it will depreciate and that you will lose money necessarily negate the term investment in the purchase of an asset. To the extent that those facts don't negate the term, options affect the initial and residual values. As such, I'm afraid the proper word is investment, even if people need to understand that the purchase of vehicles and their options are generally losing ones.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
Actually, it is not an asset either. As brkaus says, and expense, or maybe a purchase.
When comparing terms "expense" and "investment," there are financial definitions that apply. Re: "not an asset" see What Is a Capital Asset? How It Works, With Example which includes this quote:
To be clear, yeah, purchase would be a better term for the average buyer, but the term investment isn't inherently wrong, and the term expense is (if a business attempted to expense a vehicle purchase and was audited, they would get in trouble).
I’m not an accountant, but I believe “depreciating asset” would be the best term for a car. But for most that simply equates to “expense” over years.
I just hate seeing people justify these things as investments. Sure, investment in fun perhaps. But in the same way you purchase a ticket to six flags. It’s ultimately money out the pocket.
I just hate seeing people justify these things as investments. Sure, investment in fun perhaps. But in the same way you purchase a ticket to six flags. It’s ultimately money out the pocket.
Full disclaimer: I do have season passes to six flags.
Looking at a vehicle or vehicle feature as an expense is perfectly reasonable from a personal standpoint and when not throwing other financial terms around at the same time. However, from a technical/financial accounting standpoint, when purchased with the vehicle, it is part of the vehicle. When purchased after, it is likely still an asset for business tax purposes. The link I posted earlier supports that with this quote:
There is also the fact that you still can't separate the feature from the vehicle after purchase, so it would be considered an improvement to the existing asset (still part of it even though purchased after).
In the interest of full disclosure, the omitted beginning of that quote could arguably bring treating a separate FSD purchase as capital into question, but it could also bring the treating of a vehicle purchase as capital into question using the same logic, so that logic likely isn't really valid (prhaps because, for accounting purposes, businesses don't purchase things that aren't needed in the line of business, and if something is needed in the line of business, the same income wouldn't be generated without it). Meanwhile, every accountant I have ever worked with would err on the side of caution given the price point regardless.
That having been said, it would certainly be an expense if you were referring to the subscription.
^^ I ‘ll rephrase my statement-
I’m glad I bought the car
I regret buying the FSD
I’m glad I bought the car
I regret buying the FSD
Puma2020
Member
When I purchased my 2020 Y, I knew that FSD wasn't ready. I bought it thinking, I'll invest in Tesla's trying to make FSD a reality. It was definitely an expense. I've been hearing about self driving cars since the 1980's. AI was going to take over the world. The DARPA Self Driving Challenge was interesting to watch, especially the first year. As a software engineer, I knew it was harder than most people realize, including Elon. However, I've worked for managers like Elon, who has never understood Scotty's Principle. The managers are all, "How hard can this be?" I bought it because after watching SpaceX and their silly idea for re-useable rockets. If anyone is going to make this work, it might just be Tesla. Subscription wasn't an option back when I purchased it.
I have driven across the US and back in the Y and used FSD Beta for most of the highway miles. It did provide me with plenty of conversations, ok, monologues between the car and myself over who should be in control. If they want to keep the human in the loop then auto lights and auto wipers should listen to the human!!! As an engineer, I don't trust my life to software. When I find a glaring issue with FSD, I press the right scroll wheel on the steering wheel and say "Report Bug". That will send some data to Tesla and maybe someone will look at it. Now, close to 3 years later, am I unhappy with the expense? No, not really. It helps on long drives. Really helps. I arrive more refreshed than just a standard cruise control. Normally more alert as well as I am still discussing the car's unrepentant behavior especially on back roads.
I have driven across the US and back in the Y and used FSD Beta for most of the highway miles. It did provide me with plenty of conversations, ok, monologues between the car and myself over who should be in control. If they want to keep the human in the loop then auto lights and auto wipers should listen to the human!!! As an engineer, I don't trust my life to software. When I find a glaring issue with FSD, I press the right scroll wheel on the steering wheel and say "Report Bug". That will send some data to Tesla and maybe someone will look at it. Now, close to 3 years later, am I unhappy with the expense? No, not really. It helps on long drives. Really helps. I arrive more refreshed than just a standard cruise control. Normally more alert as well as I am still discussing the car's unrepentant behavior especially on back roads.
It's a science project at this point. It wasn't purchased with my Model X, but I've tried the current beta via subscription for several months. I found that it's still beta enough, and using it is stressful enough, that I cancelled my sub. It's getting better slowly, but I'll wait for a bit.
rush6410
Member
1) Free hardware upgrades
2) Exceeds all expectations - has come a long way, keep it turned on 99% of the time.
3) No regrets and I feel safer with it
4) Would recommend getting since you get features above Enhanced Auto Pilot that you will make use of immediately
5) Having auto lane change, NOA, and FSD Beta makes long drives very easy with less driving fatigue
6) Managing expectations is key. If you enjoy innovative technology and find yourself wanting the latest innovations in life, you will get what you expect. If you lag taking the leap on innovative technologies, you probably will not appreciate it.
Are you the type of person that enjoys a new phone appreciating the changes, then you are a good candidate for FSD. If you hate getting new phones because it disrupts what you are used to, you should pass.
My wife and I are perfect examples of possible extreme expectations. I love new tech, have to have the latest phones, and appreciates change learning new efficiencies and enjoying new experiences. I use FSD 99% of the time. My wife hates change, does not like new technologies and would stay with the same phone if it would last forever. She has yet to even try FSD and hates it when I use it with her in the car.
So, the phone analogy may be a good indicator.My opinion (if it's even subjective) is that a car is an asset and a liability. Definitely not an investment, with few exceptions (e.g. rare sports cars, any Tesla in 2022 purchased at least one year before, etc).
As for FSD... no thanks. Make sure you have a good plunger if you do decide to flush $15k down the toilet.
As for FSD... no thanks. Make sure you have a good plunger if you do decide to flush $15k down the toilet.
I have it on my 2023 Model X. What ultimately got me to add it was 3 things:
1 - I had it available for $10k instead of $15k. I knew I wanted the $6k variant, and for $4k (a $5k savings off current price) I figured it was worth it.
2 - although in nearly every financial way the subscription makes more sense (unless you own the car a long time) I simply despise monthly payments. I would hate having a monthly payment for it.
3 - I love technology and I want to do my part to help make it better.
I really enjoy FSD, but you do need to manage expectations. I use it maybe 20% of the time on city streets….probably 80% of the time on the highway. It’s very cool.
1 - I had it available for $10k instead of $15k. I knew I wanted the $6k variant, and for $4k (a $5k savings off current price) I figured it was worth it.
2 - although in nearly every financial way the subscription makes more sense (unless you own the car a long time) I simply despise monthly payments. I would hate having a monthly payment for it.
3 - I love technology and I want to do my part to help make it better.
I really enjoy FSD, but you do need to manage expectations. I use it maybe 20% of the time on city streets….probably 80% of the time on the highway. It’s very cool.
I'm always amazing at people who report being able to use FSD most of the time for their drives. When I've tried it, I have several issues:
1. It frequently does really dumb and dangerous things.
2. Even when it works it stops and starts and act like a 16 year old learning to drive, annoying me and those around me.
3. It more stressful to drive with it on - when I'm driving, I know what I'm going to do. When FSD is in control, ANYTHING could happen.
I live in a suburb of Chicago, not a crazy busy place, and I couldn't count on using FSD for an entire multiple mile trip.
1. It frequently does really dumb and dangerous things.
2. Even when it works it stops and starts and act like a 16 year old learning to drive, annoying me and those around me.
3. It more stressful to drive with it on - when I'm driving, I know what I'm going to do. When FSD is in control, ANYTHING could happen.
I live in a suburb of Chicago, not a crazy busy place, and I couldn't count on using FSD for an entire multiple mile trip.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
yup. Don't disagree. Let me rephrase to say that to ME, it is not an asset
in the way I think of my other assets.