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Full self driving capability

Sans-gas

Member
May 1, 2019
131
55
NW WA
I ordered a Model 3 Standard Range + last week for delivery in the January-February 2021 time frame. I'm trying to decide whether to order the Full Self-Driving option. Is it worth the $7,000?
It depends on the kind of driving you do. I love the basic version I have. I use it almost every time I drive over 40 mph.

If I did a daily commute, I would definitely want it. Look at comments and there are some YouTube videos to view. Are you close enough to a dealership for a test drive?

It’s a wonderful car without FSD, but it really shines with it.

I love my car, which has 20K on it, and drive whenever I can. Either way, you’ll love your car.
 
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Shiva

Member
Dec 20, 2018
28
60
Colorado
Thanks.


Well, I am a techie; former Apple and other Silicon Valley companies employee, yada yada. :)

I'm retired, and with rare exceptions, my freeway driving is about 20 miles each way three or four days a week. Once or twice a month, I'll drive 100 miles round trip on freeways.

Hi Michelle, congrats on your decision to purchase a Tesla! I think you will really enjoy it. Regarding FSD vs Autopilot, a few things to consider:
-Ownership: If you are planning on keeping your car for a long time, FSD is definitely worth it, especially as Tesla keeps raising the price.
-Technology: Since you are a techie, there are multiple features that aren't available in regular autopilot (granted they might not be perfect yet)
-Value retention: My friend and I recently did a trade in quote together with Tesla for our Model 3s (both same Trim, color, bought a week apart, have about 1,200 miles difference). His only has Enhanced Autopilot and mine has FSD. Mine came out $4K higher than his. I called Tesla and they said FSD was considered for this evaluation. Again, this is just based on a single case.

Lastly, I recently did a detailed demo of each features you get with all 3 autopilot packages in my channel. I am also attaching a FSD guide with cost and every single features listed.
 

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Toysla

Member
Sep 19, 2018
101
56
East Bay, CA
I don't need the extra 70something range, nor all wheel drive, so the extra $9,000 isn't worth it to me.
There in lies the beauty of choice. Everyone, right or wrong, reasonable or extravagant, makes or justifies their choices to meet their wants and needs. Basically, it’s the same as why the color or option Model3 you like or chose, wasn’t the same as I chose. The beauty of FSD is that if I really changed my mind and want it badly, I won’t need to trade in my Model3 to have it. I just have to pony up the current $10000 asking price (before sales tax...).
 

TLCTimFL

Member
Apr 27, 2020
31
27
Bradenton, FL
You don't want half a Tesla. Get it and finance it. End of story.
@Michelle_eriw Here's my take (63yo male; test engineer in Silicon Valley for over 43 years but now semi-retired, no military experience):

I rented a Model 3 through Turo.com in January 2018 and posted about it here in the forum. I ordered my LR RWD car June 2018 without EAP or FSD and received it in July. I initially said to everyone here that I wanted a car I drove myself and wasn't interested in something that would chauffeur me around. After having the car for several months, Tesla offered a two week free trial of EAP. I ended up liking it so much that I bought it ($5500, excluding tax). Almost a year later there was an announcement that the FSD price would increase soon (from $3K). A major benefit was that the hardware upgrade to HW3 (from 2.5) would be included. I figured that the price would never come down (it did at one point), and as I had just got an MBO payout at work, I caved and purchased the option. So I went from "no way I'd buy those things" to "yup, here's my credit card" in less than a year.

Was it worth it? At just slightly more than $9K when you include CA sales tax, I think it was. Although I'm not driving as much as I used to I do appreciate the Navigate on Autopilot (NoA) function, as well as Auto Lane Change (ALC) every time I'm out on the highway and the wifey is not with me; she is still not a convert to the technology. I've used Auto Park a couple of times to impress my family, but otherwise think I can park the car myself a bit faster than the AI. Smart Summon is a gimmick to me and have never used it but I have used the regular Summon to fit the car into a tight parking space at work several times. I have currently enabled the traffic light visualization function but NOT allowed the car to automatically stop at signs and lights. I'll leave it up to others to teach the AI to be smart enough to correctly handle 99.99% of the times that the car needs to be aware of its surroundings. That the technology should only improve over time and be downloaded into the car for free, convinced me to buy in.


If that's your normal usage then I'd say yes, the FSD option is probably useful to have. It will make even longer trips more relaxing, if you don't mind keeping your hands on the steering wheel and foot hovering over the brake. I've taken my car from San Jose to Disneyland via I-5 once and last year I went up to Squaw Valley and skied the 4th of July. Both trips were easy to do using the Supercharger network and NoA/ALC functions. If you haven't already, try to rent or borrow a Model 3 with the FSD package and try it out yourself. That should give you enough information to see if it's something you like/want or not.

I love the FSD! I use it all the time traveling on I-75 and I-4 frequently. But what really pisses me off about Tesla, is that they are replacing the 2.5s in other cars when purchasing the FSD after the sale and say they don't have any 3.0 available to replace mine after I've owned it for 15 months (paying for EVERYTHING upfront). So no offense to you, but that really sucks that you got yours before mine and I've been requesting the retrofit for months!
Model 3 25 percent.png
 
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busterdan1

Member
Mar 16, 2020
13
9
Millersville, Maryland
I ordered a Model 3 Standard Range + last week for delivery in the January-February 2021 time frame. I'm trying to decide whether to order the Full Self-Driving option. Is it worth the $7,000?

For me it is worth it. I am watching the potential development of FSD. FSD on the highway is amazing. Works quite well and takes the load off me. Congrats on the M3 choice. I have one and now i need (not a want) a Cybertruck and a model Y. Roaster if someone leaves me a pile of cash. With or without FSD this is the best car i have ever owned and i'm looking forward to my next one.
 
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petecrayton

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Apr 26, 2019
86
89
jacksonville, florida USA
I ordered a Model 3 Standard Range + last week for delivery in the January-February 2021 time frame. I'm trying to decide whether to order the Full Self-Driving option. Is it worth the $7,000?
Would you use it? I enjoy driving my S and even found the lane departure vibration significantly more irritating than helpful. Do you envision yourself in the driver's seat while otherwise occupied or simply sitting there "hands off"? Around town I am doubtful either is possible, so that leaves expressway trips. Some say it reduces fatigue but I don't think that comes from steering, it comes from constant vigilance and I am not prepared to surrender that to the auto pilot. If I get tired, I can use some of the $7k for a hotel and a cocktail.
 

ucityglass

Member
Sep 21, 2016
5
12
University City MO
We are driving our second MS, acquired specifically because we wanted FSD. Worth $7000? Depends on point of view. We are both techies and have appreciated the value of AutoPilot on our cross country drives. FSD adds some value, more and more.
But we both greatly enjoy participating in what we view as Musk's great experiment and seeing new features and capabilities as they are added to the package. We look at each update to see what new goodies we might have. So for us, YES!
 

Scott_Weidig

Member
Jun 9, 2020
5
8
Chicago
@Michelle_eriw Here's my take (63yo male; test engineer in Silicon Valley for over 43 years but now semi-retired, no military experience):

I rented a Model 3 through Turo.com in January 2018 and posted about it here in the forum. I ordered my LR RWD car June 2018 without EAP or FSD and received it in July. I initially said to everyone here that I wanted a car I drove myself and wasn't interested in something that would chauffeur me around. After having the car for several months, Tesla offered a two week free trial of EAP. I ended up liking it so much that I bought it ($5500, excluding tax). Almost a year later there was an announcement that the FSD price would increase soon (from $3K). A major benefit was that the hardware upgrade to HW3 (from 2.5) would be included. I figured that the price would never come down (it did at one point), and as I had just got an MBO payout at work, I caved and purchased the option. So I went from "no way I'd buy those things" to "yup, here's my credit card" in less than a year.

Was it worth it? At just slightly more than $9K when you include CA sales tax, I think it was. Although I'm not driving as much as I used to I do appreciate the Navigate on Autopilot (NoA) function, as well as Auto Lane Change (ALC) every time I'm out on the highway and the wifey is not with me; she is still not a convert to the technology. I've used Auto Park a couple of times to impress my family, but otherwise think I can park the car myself a bit faster than the AI. Smart Summon is a gimmick to me and have never used it but I have used the regular Summon to fit the car into a tight parking space at work several times. I have currently enabled the traffic light visualization function but NOT allowed the car to automatically stop at signs and lights. I'll leave it up to others to teach the AI to be smart enough to correctly handle 99.99% of the times that the car needs to be aware of its surroundings. That the technology should only improve over time and be downloaded into the car for free, convinced me to buy in.


If that's your normal usage then I'd say yes, the FSD option is probably useful to have. It will make even longer trips more relaxing, if you don't mind keeping your hands on the steering wheel and foot hovering over the brake. I've taken my car from San Jose to Disneyland via I-5 once and last year I went up to Squaw Valley and skied the 4th of July. Both trips were easy to do using the Supercharger network and NoA/ALC functions. If you haven't already, try to rent or borrow a Model 3 with the FSD package and try it out yourself. That should give you enough information to see if it's something you like/want or not.

My M3 LR AWD is a week and, and I did not purchase FSD with the vehicle. My three thoughts on this were:
  1. I can upgrade down the road - yes it will be a bit more money - it actually makes me cringe thinking that a couple of years ago it was only $2k... now it is $7 and will be $8k starting July 1, 2020. But, I really did not want to add another $120 into an already high car payment.
  2. The 2020 M3 comes with Advanced AutoPilot the leverages both speed and lane keeping, and I wanted to see if this was real enough for me, and if I would actually use it at all. I have had cruise control obstruction detection in my other cars for years and years, and I almost never use it... Would AP make things different for me was a question I wanted to answer first without the big additional FSD investment up front.
  3. WIth Level 2 driving being the only approved form of self-driving at this time, to get the full capabilities, we need to get to Level 5 for real "Full Self-Driving". We may not get there for a long time. Investing up front just didn't seem practical right now as the real capabilities desired are not going to be there. As RayK said, I will let others play with their lives while seeing if we can trust the car to be accurate 99.99% of the time. There are a number of incidents that the accident reports are still being evaluated to see if human reaction or intervention could have prevented the incident.
With all of that said, the built in AP in the M3 LR AWD is really cool. As I continue to build trust in it, I believe I will use it more and more for specific situations: Long road trips, (depending on sun location and height... the sun can mess with the cameras and tracking at certain angles", bumper to bumper, heck even drive thru's are a great use, it is also great when you are fiddling with the panel for music to setting nav, etc. and no more knee driving when eating... :0). That said, I find myself more hyper-aware and alert when I have AP controlling the car because there is still a trust level regarding if the car will break quickly enough (it reacts to slowing and stopped traffic a lot slower than I would as a 30 year experienced driver). It also brakes harder than I do as I use regen more than I actually brake. I almost never step on the brake and that is only after a week and a half of owning. I do love the lane keeping, but again I am hyper-aware when using and less relaxed overall when it is in control.

The parts of FSD I like "summon" (I hate walking in the rain) are not fully baked right now - full nav and light/stop sign are just baked enough to cause worry for me. So, I feel that I would let nav start the trip or be in control on the highway, but when it came to turns or offramp, I would most likely take control back anyway defeating the FSD benefit...

Again, your mileage and thoughts may vary, but I wanted to share and hope this helps in some way.
 
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dropgems

Member
Jan 11, 2020
260
216
New Jersey
I just ordered a m3p and picking up Friday. Didn’t order FSD because it affects my 5k rebate so gonna to order it right when I get in the car. Does my car have the hw3.0 or will I have to go back and get that installed? Thx
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
11,372
13,213
Riverside Co. CA
I just ordered a m3p and picking up Friday. Didn’t order FSD because it affects my 5k rebate so gonna to order it right when I get in the car. Does my car have the hw3.0 or will I have to go back and get that installed? Thx

its likely that your car would have HW3.0, but if on some very strange reason it doesnt, you will be entitled to it with a FSD purchase anyway as you likely know.
 

Anne C

New Member
Jul 18, 2019
4
3
Mahone Bay, NS
Hi, Michelle,
This is the first time I have posted here. I am retired and bought my M3 SR last September with FSD. I live in Nova Scotia, Canada, so do very little multi-lane highway driving. The largest highway in Atlantic Canada is 4 lane. There is only one Supercharger in Nova Scotia so far. So, if I had it to do over again, I would probably trade the FSD for LR although I really think that, if you can afford it at all, it is not an “either/or” but a “both/and”. I love using AP and find that even on 2 lane rural roads it is useful, and becoming more so all the time. The car seems to learn everyday (or maybe it is that I am learning and trusting it more) about the strange turns and twists along our coastal roads!
I found the discussion on range to be very interesting and in accord with my experience. Cold really does cut down on range; not being very techie, I don’t have figures and percentages at my fingertips, but one early winter day I drove to Halifax about 100 km (65 miles) from my home and to my dismay, the NAV told me I did not have enough range to get home. I tried to charge up at a “destination charger” in the city only to discover it would take almost 24 hours to charge at its rate. So I ended up driving to 20 kilometres in the opposite direction from home to charge up at the only supercharger in Nova Scotia! Not a great experience! On the other hand, I did the same trip last week on a 99% charge and had 34% left when I got back home.
I could go on a lot longer about my experiences with my Tesla, but the most important thing to me is the most basic: it is such a fun car to drive; whether under my control or with Autopilot, it is one of the secret pleasures of my day. It makes the trip to get groceries (one of the few places I have been recently, due to Covid) exciting!! And I am looking forward to longer road trips once the provinces bring down their barriers.

Anne C
Nova Scotia
Canada
 

StellarRat

Active Member
Jan 8, 2014
1,524
1,511
Pacific
If you do a lot of freeway driving it might be worth it. It does a pretty good job on the freeway, but even than you have to keep an eye on it and sometimes take control. If you're actually thinking the car will be able to take you from point A to point B without you touching the controls anytime soon I wouldn't hold your breath. That's the end goal of FSD. My experience in software development is that you can put a lot of major features in quickly, but the handling the special (corner) cases takes a long all time. When you're talking about people's lives on the line you HAVE TO handle ALL the special cases and I think that's where Tesla is now. It's going to a long time before true FSD is fit for human consumption. If they do get it working my guess is that for long time it will be restricted to certain "easy" routes i.e. you won't be able to go anywhere you want on FSD.
 

Imwinniesdad

Member
Mar 30, 2020
5
4
Whitmore
I ordered a Model 3 Standard Range + last week for delivery in the January-February 2021 time frame. I'm trying to decide whether to order the Full Self-Driving option. Is it worth the $7,000?
I have poor night vision, especially after staring at the computer at the end of the day. There is just 2 turns and 1 stop sign on my 30 minute commute. Having FSD take me to the gate in snow and fog is priceless.
 
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StellarRat

Active Member
Jan 8, 2014
1,524
1,511
Pacific
I have poor night vision, especially after staring at the computer at the end of the day. There is just 2 turns and 1 stop sign on my 30 minute commute. Having FSD take me to the gate in snow and fog is priceless.
FSD is going to be severely hampered in fog and heavy snow just like a human. Telsas rely heavily on optical sensors to drive just like a human. My guess is that it's going to tell you to do the driving.
 
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Billbob777

New Member
Dec 3, 2019
4
0
La Mirada, CA
Hey 1st time posting here. These forums are soooo helpful. Appreciate everyone's comments. I'm a 63 yr old small business owner with a techie/Silicon Valley background. I bought a used/ex-Enterprise car rental 2018 MS 75D that was (unbeknownst to me) stripped out without even basic Autopilot with auto steer and traffic aware cruise. I had to pay $3K just to upgrade to get that. Was contemplating another $7K for FSD (so $10K for me!) but wasn't sure so I read through this forum. I'm now reminded the reason I bought this 1st Tesla was because I wanted a car smarter than me. I previously leased a KIA K900 that I loved because it was so quiet. Problem was that it's a huge car and not very nimble, and have had 6 accidents in 5 years, the last one totaled both vehicles (ruled not my fault, but still sucks). After reading through this thread, though I'm not crazy about putting another $7K down for a few features and a promise, I finally realized that I'm going to need FSD so I can keep my license (and my insurance costs under $5K/yr). Thanks everyone!
 

Fonguy

Member
Sep 22, 2014
36
58
Sarasota, FL
I upgraded our Model 3 to FSD to get the new processor board and ordered FSD with a Model Y, promised in a couple of weeks.
(Ancient, retired EE). The hope is that it will add to the resale values for my heirs. :))

I am certain that FSD won't work really well for many years, if ever. The corner cases, as unhinged Elon likes to call them, are many and some are brutally difficult to handle. His position is that, it doesn't have to be perfect. It just has to be maybe 10 times better than driving by humans.
That shouldn't be too difficult, you might say but the first deadly FSD crashes will go viral and will be difficult to erase from memories no matter how good FSD is. Just my opinion.

Corner case. You are driving in FSD mode behind a big semi, approaching an intersection controlled by overhead stoplights.
Just before the semi gets to the intersection, the light turns to amber and the truck driver ignores it and continues through the intersection. Your car is unable to see the traffic light, blocked by the semi. The light turns red just before your car enters the intersection. Your car continues through the intersection while the light is red. Good luck. Maybe the dump truck that jumps the light won't T-bone you...
 

MrDee

Member
Jun 17, 2019
5
7
Roseburg, Oregon
Go with FSD . My M3 is 13 months old today. I have over 40,000 miles and love it.
I ordered LR,Dual motor since I do drive alot,FSD , Premium Connectivity and red paint. I am retired and drive mountain roads on Autopilot and usually drive the same way. I drive on Autopilot probably 85-90% of the time. Since this will probably be the last car I will buy I got everything except for the Performance model.
In my experience FSD is worth the extra $7000.00 as well as the Premium Connectivity. The car is so fast and quiet.
And the Dog mode is a lifesaver for me. I drove a Prius for 11 years and had to determine if I could take the dog with me because of the weather. Did I pay too much for my model 3? Nope! It just keeps getting better and better. OTA updates make it a pleasure to drive to find out what is new and better.
 
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