Further discussion and analysis on why the yoke is not good

[Pdubs]

Should just bump all the yoke-hate threads so the mods feel compelled to close the newest ones, like... this one.

I wish FSD had Rainbow Road.

I need more cowbell.

 

[Plaid to Mod 3]

Sarcasm over science. You still haven’t addressed the variable ratio part of the equation. If you do not hold a steering wheel properly, then you might be uncomfortable.

So the only proper way to hold a steering wheel is with two hands 100% of the time at 9:00 and 3:00. I have yet to read an operator's manual that mandates this but it seems to be what all the the people who love the yoke want to talk about. Not buying it

 

[Hayseed_MS]

I wish FSD had Rainbow Road.

I need more cowbell.

 

[Pdubs]

So the only proper way to hold a steering wheel is with two hands 100% of the time at 9:00 and 3:00. I have yet to read an operator's manual that mandates this but it seems to be what all the the people who love the yoke want to talk about. Not buying it

 

[Silicon Desert]

Discussions like this one are always intriguing to me regarding adoption to change. My grand-dad is long gone, but when he got his first car, I can still hear him saying "What's with this damn circular thing in the car. The reins on my horse are just fine navigating. Why doesn't this thing have them?"

 

[Pdubs]

Discussions like this one are always intriguing to me regarding adoption to change. My grand-dad is long gone, but when he got his first car, I can still hear him saying "What's with this damn circular thing in the car. The reins on my horse are just fine navigating. Why doesn't this thing have them?"

Then take somebody like your granddad, god bless him, and listen to him apply pseudo engineering logic and heightened emotional responses in a thinly veiled attempt at sounding reasonable and, “just offering my opinion” to save the countless lost souls who have it wrong and will go down in flames.

I’d hit my ignore button, but I swear reading his posts make me feel like I have a 190 IQ. Bless his heart.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Then take somebody like your granddad, god bless him, and listen to him apply pseudo engineering logic and heightened emotional responses in a thinly veiled attempt at sounding reasonable and, “just offering my opinion” to save the countless lost souls who have it wrong and will go down in flames.

I’d hit my ignore button, but I swear reading his posts make me feel like I have a 190 IQ. Bless his heart.

Actually it was just supposed to be funny. I guess not to some folks. And maybe you do have a 190 IQ. It's ok to hit the ignore. I do it all the time.
And to add, frankly I love the yoke, but sure, some folks don't.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Likes/dislikes are very helpful when they are kept factual and personal. It is obviously something the OP could not utilize it and he articulated the reasons for him. That is where he should stop - not questioning the integrity or validity of those of us that do like it.

I have almost 41k miles in 18 states (many trips of 2k miles) and it is one of the best features of the car for me. I was skeptical waiting for the car until June 2021 - almost cancelling it. Since I had one of the first ones, I had no one telling me that I would like or dislike it. I drove it and within the first 5 minutes fell in love with the yoke, I am naturally a 9/3 driver and rest my arms down on the wheel so this was a nothingburger. Roundabouts, 3pt turn into/out of the garage, downtown parallel parking, evasive manuevers, etc. Put one of those epoxy buttons on the horn. No wrecks, curbs, issues., etc..

Cannot say if you will like it or not. Drive it and see. Take my comments and the OP's comments for ramblings of a stranger on the internut and make your own open mind conclusion. If you do not like it, that is fine - move on to another solution. For me it is near perfect.

Gee, I couldn't have said it better. I would just ALSO add that if someone is uncertain about driving a car with a yoke, then test drive one first rather than listening to people in a forum with a personal bias either way. As for me, I like it, then again, I once had to fly with a stick so I guess I will adapt to anything.

 

[father_of_6]

Gee, I couldn't have said it better. I would just ALSO add that if someone is uncertain about driving a car with a yoke, then test drive one first rather than listening to people in a forum with a personal bias either way. As for me, I like it, then again, I once had to fly with a stick so I guess I will adapt to anything.

That makes you a *very* biased opinion though... having been a pilot. I'm biased too though, since I think we've already invented the best steering device and it's round.

For sure I think the yoke wins for visibility, and it's got a cool factor since it's rare. I can't see it ever winning the safety argument though. And from reading, sounds like long road trips are more fatiguing on the arms with the yoke.

 

[Silicon Desert]

That makes you a *very* biased opinion though... having been a pilot. I'm biased too though, since I think we've already invented the best steering device and it's round.

For sure I think the yoke wins for visibility, and it's got a cool factor since it's rare. I can't see it ever winning the safety argument though. And from reading, sounds like long road trips are more fatiguing on the arms with the yoke.

Oh sure, I agree and admit I am biased Thus, why I say people should take opinions here with a grain of salt because it comes down to personal preference. Having said that, most of my trips are very long ones and I just don't notice a difference in any more fatigue compared to my older MX. I guess I just hold the yoke differently. I think you are aware that flying a plane with a yoke is a LOT different and much easier than a yoke on a car. That is not the reason I like the yoke. I don't know about the safety argument. That might be or might not be an issue. I guess we will find out over time.

 

[father_of_6]

I think for most daily driving, the yoke is fairly safe. It's that one disastrous scenario where you're in the middle of a turn and you have to turn back the opposite way quickly... and grabbing the wrong part of the yoke makes you miss that turn that would've steered you away from an accident.

Truly, I think driving with a stick might be better than a yoke. It's definitely something I'd be interested in trying. Not the yoke though

 

[Big Toys]

With any change to form factor there’s going to be some who do not want to change adapt. And that’s perfectly OK and common historically.

That bias is not a correlation to ‘sound reasoning’

Is part of it marketing? Of course! This is the automotive business.

We are talking about a over 1000hp family sedan and the steering wheel is the point of issue here? As noted some will not find this form factor suitable-frankly due to poor driving habits. And again that is OK. Such is the beauty of choice.

Change and adaptation is wonderful. Change for the sake of change is dumb unless there is an advantage, and adaptation based on FOMO is a psychological trick. Again, this seems like a classic FOMO "choice", much like the "white phone". Use it if you like it, I guess. But, how would "poor driving habits" factor in to loss of part of the steering wheel?

 

[jebinc]

Got yoke?

 

[Pdubs]

Actually it was just supposed to be funny. I guess not to some folks. And maybe you do have a 190 IQ. It's ok to hit the ignore. I do it all the time.
And to add, frankly I love the yoke, but sure, some folks don't.

It was funny. I was comparing your granddad to somebody posting lol. I thought it was obvious

 

[TessP100D]

Discussions like this one are always intriguing to me regarding adoption to change. My grand-dad is long gone, but when he got his first car, I can still hear him saying "What's with this damn circular thing in the car. The reins on my horse are just fine navigating. Why doesn't this thing have them?"

That's the best you got? Come-on man. You know the yoke sucks. Just admit it

 

[TessP100D]

Gee, I couldn't have said it better. I would just ALSO add that if someone is uncertain about driving a car with a yoke, then test drive one first rather than listening to people in a forum with a personal bias either way. As for me, I like it, then again, I once had to fly with a stick so I guess I will adapt to anything.

Safe? Are you gonna bet your life on this dumb idea?

 

[Silicon Desert]

It was funny. I was comparing your granddad to somebody posting lol. I thought it was obvious

Don't mind me. My brain is dead this week. I didn't take it as snippy, but thanks for your confirmation.

 

[ForDesign]

Change and adaptation is wonderful. Change for the sake of change is dumb unless there is an advantage, and adaptation based on FOMO is a psychological trick. Again, this seems like a classic FOMO "choice", much like the "white phone". Use it if you like it, I guess. But, how would "poor driving habits" factor in to loss of part of the steering wheel?

What’s the advantage of a over an 1000hp sedan? That’s a ‘change’ vs norm in the luxury sedan category. Can you list the precise advantages if you don’t categorize is as ‘dumb’?

For the record-I classify ‘change’ as ‘potential progress.’ Per my profesional experience and observation.

There were people who thought replacing V8s with forced induction engines with less cylinders were ‘dumb.’ Those earlier engines did suffer from turbo lag, carbon buildup etc. But such is progress and transition.

There were those who thought carbon ceramic brakes were ‘dumb’. As of today, there still exists a delta in which a properly set up six piston braking system and pads will match the performance of the former for most users.

There were those who thought cruise control was ‘dumb’ and dangerous-an earlier innovation not coincidentally to process (time/refinement/customer adaptation etc). There was a spike in deaths at times with the varying levels of added autonomy to cruise control.

Such is progress. There are some (most) that lament changes that don’t line up with their perspective bias.

My inherit bias as a someone who works in the industry is that I’m aware of the process of industrial design and automotive design on quite a few levels. There is a tremendous amount of planning, engineering, data, discussion and validation that goes into the creation of every part within an automobile, which add up into the thousands vs other disciplines, like CP (consumer products, even though the modeling of some detergent bottles are pretty sublime).

Most consumers who actually care enough about a, um, consumerable will fall into a few vocal camps. I know that from a historical perspective, consumers will complain and adapt. Such is life. But the value I’m attempting to bring onto this platform is an insight into how things actually work within the industry and I stand by my assertion that the OP ‘scientific’ approach was bias driven more than process driven. Your free to scan this thread for his/her responses to those challenges. All have been literally challenged those points with data.

The response ‘I’m not buying it’.

If that brings value to you, that’s awesome. But again, that doesn’t have to be accepted/agreed upon by all. But outside of validation of bias, what other value is that bringing to this discussion?

 

[ForDesign]

Are you offering data here?

Are you hurt?

 

[Wol747]

OK. I'll declare a bias.
It's a bias against change that's made in order to be different, but which presents nothing that's better and several things which are significantly worse. Especially when you're not talking about an iPhone or a handbag, but a lethal machine.