Green New Deal

[ggies07]

Sometimes I wonder if the name automatically throws people off because the first word is "Green". Maybe another name like 21C New Deal for 21st Century. Meaning we are in a new century that has progressed and will progress faster and farther than anything in the past.

For short it could be called the 21C deal, or, just 21C. "yeah, did you hear about 21C? Oh man, it's going to change our country for the better and once it's complete, energy will be practically free!"

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

The true cost of nuclear is only so high here in the US because of all the regulations and delays. The cost to build nuclear plants in China is about 1/2 of what it costs here.

The cost to build everything is lower in China.
And still renewables are cheaper than Chinese nuclear power, which is part of the reason why, despite official policy for expansion of nuclear power generation, they haven't started building any new nuclear power plants since 2016.

 

[ohmman]

I worked for a grocery store and was in a union (UFCW) when I was a teenager. I busted my butt and was rewarded for it. I made $12 an hour as a teenager in the late 80s, which gave me purchasing power and ability to save up for college. It was my favorite job to this day. I had a blast there and was always happy to get things done.

That store is still there, they weren't crushed by the union wages.

 

[mspohr]

Back to the GND

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez explains why the Green New Deal is about more than climate

 

[SageBrush]

In spite of the history and reputation, when NUMMI reopened the factory for production in 1984, 85% of the troublesome GM workforce was rehired,

That is the key point I think. The union was protecting 15% of the workforce that turned the factory into a basket case.

 

[rays427]

I worked in both union and non union shops, and I did not put up with shoddy work or employees who did not pull their own weight. I fired anyone who did not meet this criteria and no matter which employee you had you had to show cause and be diligent on your documentation. I usually had a book on those employees and never was questioned about the firing by either the union rep or the state. Not something I enjoyed doing but if you let one employee get away with bad behavior others will follow then you have a mess. Unfortunately their are many managers at various levels that do not want to deal with what it take to fire an employee therefore you end up with dead weight and poor performers.

OK, you fired folks that did not pull their own weight. However a number of unions make that almost impossible. Remember in the New Green deal it's the government is guaranteeing the jobs not private industry. As an example the it's almost impossible to fire a bad teacher in New York. The difference to me is guaranteeing a job versus providing the opportunity of a good paying job. If you end up paying people more than what they can contribute you are going to go out of business unless it's backed by the government. If it's just backed by the government then it just means that taxpayers are subsidizing it.

 

[juliusa]

What's the ROI on immigration, legal or illegal? Do you know the answer? There is an answer. It's less than one generation. How does that compare to native born Americans? I'm so glad you asked.

So are we being selfish with immigrants? We are a VERY rich country - wouldn't it be better to have them immigrate to poorer countries so they could have a positive ROI there, where it is needed?

 

[mspohr]

That is the key point I think. The union was protecting 15% of the workforce that turned the factory into a basket case.

Really?
How would they know?
GM is notorious for bad management. Toyota is famous for good management.

 

[mspohr]

Another state goes for the Green New Deal (lead by young people).
https://thinkprogress.org/minnesota-green-new-deal-youth-activism-cities-states-trump-f6e8a0b23086/
Minnesota is taking a first step toward enacting legislation inspired by the Green New Deal Wednesday, with lawmakers set to introduce a bill that will put the state on a path to 100% clean energy by 2030 while also creating green jobs and protecting vulnerable communities.

The “Minnesota Green New Deal” draws inspiration from the federal Green New Deal resolution introduced in February by Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY) and Sen. Ed Markey (D-MA), akin to other policies introduced in cities and states across the country. But unlike other states, Minnesota’s lawmakers actively engaged with young people in crafting their bill.

 

[mspohr]

https://thinkprogress.org/green-new-deal-twitter-google-ocasio-cortez-98909437a5d8/

Green New Deal sparks viral conversation via Twitter and Google
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez jumpstarts the most important discussion of our time: How to prevent catastrophic climate change.

One measure of that interest is the spike in online conversations documented in a new report from online communications expert Tim Weinheimer. Using Brandwatch Analytics, Weinheimer found that between November 1, 2018, and April 1, 2019, some 821,000 unique social media accounts mentioned the Green New Deal four million times. More than 95% of the mentions have been on Twitter.

Weinheimer told the Austin American-Statesman that these numbers are “very high compared to many other general business interest topics.”

Significantly, the report also analyzed word choice “sentiment” in the online conversations and found that 88% of the discussions were neutral in tone, 6% were positive, and another 6% were negative. This may suggest people are mostly searching for or circulating information, rather than voicing strong opinions.

 

[juliusa]

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez jumpstarts the most important discussion of our time: How to prevent catastrophic climate change.

Yes!! I would like her to expand beyond the 16% the US produces, and propose a green deal for the world.

There are young people in other countries too. I think she could do it, and I think people would listen and be inspired.

 

[mspohr]

Could a Green New Deal Make Us Happier People?

From carbon taxes to consumption cuts, climate policy has long been framed as an issue of stiff-lipped sacrifice: What will we have to give up to save our skins? The right takes this characterization to extremes, accusing climate hawks of wanting to ban cars and hamburgers and throw civilization back into the Dark Ages.

But could a plan to curb emissions also make us happier? Could the things we cut back also be the things that make us miserable?

“We have gotten ourselves entrenched in a cycle of work and spend — a cycle of long hours and consumer mentality as a way of life.” As Schor’s recent work has pointed out more directly, all that manufactured consumption comes at a high carbon cost.

“Most high-income countries have substantially shorter work hours and significantly smaller carbon footprints than the U.S. For example, the average German worker toils 23 percent fewer hours than their American counterpart, and the average German emits 46 percent less carbon.”

Happy countries are doing well on measures outside the report’s bounds too. On average, the carbon footprint of the average American is more than twice that of residents in the world’s happiest countries. They also work 330 hours less each year — about 41 fewer days for those working eight hours a day, owed at least partially to the European Union-wide mandate that workers get four paid weeks off per year and high levels of union density.

But less obviously green investments also go a long way toward their residents to live less carbon-intensive lives, and creating a built environment to make them both possible and pleasurable. State-supported dense and affordable housing, for instance — critical to building a low-carbon world — can encourage people to work and learn closer to where they live. Well-funded public housing in other parts of the world includes things like kindergartens, bars, and restaurants — the kind of “social infrastructure,” as New York University sociologist Eric Klinenberg calls it, that enable hyper-local communities to grow and thrive. Just 7 percent of Americans currently use public transit to commute.

(Lots interesting ideas in this article)

 

[mspohr]

A new Bretton Woods conference for the environment?

World leaders ignore David Attenborough at their peril
World leaders ignore David Attenborough at their peril | Larry Eliott

History provides a lesson of what ought to happen. Seventy five years ago this summer a gathering at a hotel in New Hampshire led to the creation of the IMF and the World Bank, and helped shape the global economy for decades to come. The Bretton Woods conference essentially took the principles of the New Deal – full employment, shared prosperity, government intervention – and internationalised them. The summits at Yalta and Potsdam established the framework for postwar international politics, Bretton Woods did the same for economics.

 

[mspohr]

Renewable Energy Could Save $160 Trillion In Climate Change Costs by 2050

 

[mspohr]

Maine’s Green New Deal bill first in country to be backed by labor unions

Maine’s Green New Deal bill first in country to be backed by labor unions
"It's basically an economic and job growth strategy for Maine."

 

[oneday]

Green New Deal sparks viral conversation via Twitter and Google

Green New Deal sparks viral conversation via Twitter and Google
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez jumpstarts the most important discussion of our time: How to prevent catastrophic climate change.

One measure of that interest is the spike in online conversations documented in a new report from online communications expert Tim Weinheimer. Using Brandwatch Analytics, Weinheimer found that between November 1, 2018, and April 1, 2019, some 821,000 unique social media accounts mentioned the Green New Deal four million times. More than 95% of the mentions have been on Twitter.

Weinheimer told the Austin American-Statesman that these numbers are “very high compared to many other general business interest topics.”

Significantly, the report also analyzed word choice “sentiment” in the online conversations and found that 88% of the discussions were neutral in tone, 6% were positive, and another 6% were negative. This may suggest people are mostly searching for or circulating information, rather than voicing strong opinions.

If you look at AOC’s twitter today, GOP and climate denying trolls have descended upon her twitter. The comments range from bizarre to uninformed to disgusting. It appears to me that many are likely bots and/or emanating from some Russian troll farms, though maybe it’s just MAGA trolls and FoX News consumers. Hard to tell, but certainly easy to get disillusioned by reading the comments.

 

[Mader Levap]

certainly easy to get disillusioned by reading the comments.

I do not lose faith in humanity.

After all, you can't lose what you never had in first place.

Generally, I consider things like care for environment being political issue at all as sign of human suicidal madness powered by certain deranged ideologies out there.

 

[mspohr]

AOC has a short video about the Green New Deal.

 

[ggies07]

AOC has a short video about the Green New Deal.

For those on here that don't know or haven't read it, the part where she talks about Exxon is pulled directly from internal memos:

Exxon's Own Research Confirmed Fossil Fuels' Role in Global Warming Decades Ago

 

[mspohr]

Joseph Ellis: The Green New Deal isn't socialism. It's what the Founding Fathers wanted (Opinion) - CNN

The Green New Deal is a bold and controversial legislative initiative proposed by the progressive wing of the Democratic Party, designed to address four pressing challenges facing American society that have thus far eluded solution.

They are: reforming our extremely expensive and inefficient health care system; reducing our currently unprecedented levels of economic inequality; rebuilding our aging infrastructure; and recovering our global leadership role to combat the existential threat posed by climate change. If we fail to address and resolve these problems, all talk of America as a "city on a hill" needs to cease.

At present, however, critics on the right are attempting to short-circuit that debate by arguing that the Green New Deal is socialism, a loaded label with potent un-American associations for many.
Whatever you might think about the Green New Deal, it is not socialism. As Casey Stengel loved to say, you can look it up. Pick your dictionary: the Oxford English Dictionary, Merriam-Webster, Random House. They all say the same thing. Socialism is a political theory based on the principle of government ownership of the means of production; in short, the abolition of private property.