In-car Trip Planner vs EV Trip Planner

[pchan]

Planning for an upcoming 500 miles trip next month and not sure if I should just depends on the in-car trip planner or the Ev trip planner website. Another thread has mentioned that the in-car trip planner does not take the elevation in the consideration while the EV trip planner site has no specific Model X entity. Any recommendation?

 

[evp]

Start with evtripplanner.com. Use the P85 metrics with 21 inch wheels. If any of the suggested legs puts you at less than 30% rated miles at the destination, you might want to try again with one of the settings suggested here. Otherwise, don't sweat it. Is your route along one of the SuperCharged Interstates? If so, they are spaced close enough that you will have plenty of buffer.

A todo item for the Tesla community -- can we get the efficiency data together for the Model X so that evtripplanner can be updated? I know Ben is busy with school and all, but maybe if we make this as easy as possible he can fit it into his schedule. (Also: donate -- EV Trip Planner)

 

[tomas]

The in car trip planner does take elevation into account. Very effectively, in fact.
What it does not take into account is load, wind, and outdoor temperature.
evtripplanner is useful for pre-planning, but after a couple of trips, I've stopped using and rely on the in-car systems using the following rules:
1) leave with full charge.
2) first stop of day should be last supercharger you can reach within your risk tolerance. Personally, I'm a 10 percent guy.
3) Use the energy app trip graph to track how you are doing. You can trust it!
4) At first SC stop, just charge enough to get to next supercharger plus your risk tolerance.
5) Repeat (4) for all subsequent superchargers on route, unless you want to take a long meal break... then you can charge enough to skip one while you eat.
6) If overnighting, book a hotel by a supercharger. Yes, they are not the most plush or fun places to stay, but you will leave with a full charge in the AM, and you can cycle back to (1) above.

 

[RiverBrick]

The in car trip planner does take elevation into account. Very effectively, in fact.
What it does not take into account is load, wind, and outdoor temperature...

+1

Nor range lost to wet or unpaved roads.

 

[pchan]

The in car trip planner does take elevation into account. Very effectively, in fact.
What it does not take into account is load, wind, and outdoor temperature.
evtripplanner is useful for pre-planning, but after a couple of trips, I've stopped using and rely on the in-car systems using the following rules:
1) leave with full charge.
2) first stop of day should be last supercharger you can reach within your risk tolerance. Personally, I'm a 10 percent guy.
3) Use the energy app trip graph to track how you are doing. You can trust it!
4) At first SC stop, just charge enough to get to next supercharger plus your risk tolerance.
5) Repeat (4) for all subsequent superchargers on route, unless you want to take a long meal break... then you can charge enough to skip one while you eat.
6) If overnighting, book a hotel by a supercharger. Yes, they are not the most plush or fun places to stay, but you will leave with a full charge in the AM, and you can cycle back to (1) above.

Great tips, thanks! How do you know how much battery you still have if you skip a supercharger? It's easy to do so on EV planner, but I don't know how to do it in car.

 

[evp]

Great tips, thanks! How do you know how much battery you still have if you skip a supercharger? It's easy to do so on EV planner, but I don't know how to do it in car.

Yeah, the trip planner in the car is a little - challenged. The simplest way is just to turn off trip planner (beta) in the controls page, then select the SC you want to try as destination and look at the energy page to get percent charge left.

 

[ReturnZero]

4) At first SC stop, just charge enough to get to next supercharger plus your risk tolerance.

What exactly do you mean by this? It looks like the car says it can go at 10%, and you said you're a 10% guy. Do you wait for 20% before leaving? That would be the car's 10% plus your 10%.

I would often lose between 10-15% from the car's original prediction on each leg, even when driving the speed limit or only a couple MPH over. It was about 85F outside though not very windy, but perhaps that's where the extra juice went?

 

[David99]

The in car trip planner does take elevation into account. Very effectively, in fact.
What it does not take into account is load, wind, and outdoor temperature.

This is true and not true. It doesn't know about wind and load, but it does know about outdoor and battery temperature and I'd assume it takes that into account. One way or another it does take everything into account once you start driving and you see the adjusted prediction and how it differs from the initial prediction. All things that cause energy usage (load, wind, rain, weather, traffic, speed, ...) are contributing to the energy usage and are accounted for and the adjusted (green line) prediction is very accurate.

I also noticed that it gets better and more accurate with every software update. It also doesn't reset and goes back to default on a long trip where Supercharger stops are calculated. It used to go back to the default prediction after each stop. Now it remembers the previous leg and predictions according to what the actual energy usage was. That leads to much better predictions.

 

[tomas]

What exactly do you mean by this? It looks like the car says it can go at 10%, and you said you're a 10% guy. Do you wait for 20% before leaving? That would be the car's 10% plus your 10%.

I would often lose between 10-15% from the car's original prediction on each leg, even when driving the speed limit or only a couple MPH over. It was about 85F outside though not very windy, but perhaps that's where the extra juice went?

Yes I take the 10% buffer you have when charging stops. Maybe a bit more. But I also come right in at the energy app projections. So if you exceed them, you'll want more buffer.

Biggest impact on mileage is speed. I seldom go over 70.

 

[tomas]

Great tips, thanks! How do you know how much battery you still have if you skip a supercharger? It's easy to do so on EV planner, but I don't know how to do it in car.

Not entirely sure I understand question. If you put new destination (next supercharger) in nav, energy graph will show you projected % available upon arrival. Does that help?

 

[bhzmark]

the following rules:
1) leave with full charge.
2) first stop of day should be last supercharger you can reach within your risk tolerance. Personally, I'm a 10 percent guy.
3) Use the energy app trip graph to track how you are doing. You can trust it!
4) At first SC stop, just charge enough to get to next supercharger plus your risk tolerance.
5) Repeat (4) for all subsequent superchargers on route, unless you want to take a long meal break... then you can charge enough to skip one while you eat.
6) If overnighting, book a hotel by a supercharger. Yes, they are not the most plush or fun places to stay, but you will leave with a full charge in the AM, and you can cycle back to (1) above.

Exactly. Except also use hotels with destination chargers -- they can range charge overnight while you sleep and not have to stop at a SC in the morning.

 

[pchan]

Not entirely sure I understand question. If you put new destination (next supercharger) in nav, energy graph will show you projected % available upon arrival. Does that help?

I see ... I was thinking I could keep my final destination in the NAV and somehow telling the car skip the SC in the app to see the % I guess there is no way to enter multiple destination/Stops in the NAV, huh? Thanks!

 

[daroon]

I am a big fan of the trip planner in the car. Around here where it is very hilly, it accounts for large elevation changes very well.

I just did a day trip to Seattle. 180 miles one way, 360 round trip. The only super charger was (exactly) halfway between both cities. I didn't have any charging options at my destination, therefore I had to charge enough at the supercharger to make it to my destination (plus some "screw-around" miles) and back again to the half way point. It was frustrating to not be able to set a "there-and-back" destination. I opted to go for a full charge (262 rated miles) to make the 180 miles round trip from midpoint to midpoint with safety. Between traffic, a bit of rain, 4 passengers, and a lead-foot, it was good that I did because I returned with 11% remaining (about 30 miles). It was a bit nerve-wracking, but as I said, the in-car trip planner does a good job, and is reliable once you take into account your own variables. If it had been able to plot the whole there-and-back trip, I would have felt much more relaxed.

 

[tomas]

I see ... I was thinking I could keep my final destination in the NAV and somehow telling the car skip the SC in the app to see the % I guess there is no way to enter multiple destination/Stops in the NAV, huh? Thanks!

OK, now I understand the issue. Using trip planner from point A to F with intermediate stops at Superchargers B, C, D, E is pretty useless, because it is not good at "in flight" adjustments. I just plug in the next supercharging I'm planning to visit as nav destination. While I'm charging, there's plenty of time to reset nav to the following one. I guess you lose the wholistic view of your trip, but that never bothered me.

 

[Phil Seastrand]

It was frustrating to not be able to set a "there-and-back" destination.

You can do this, set your destination as normal, then touch the bottom portion of the turn log (see first picture below). This shows you the round trip estimate as demonstrated in the second picture.

 

[ReturnZero]

You can do this, set your destination as normal, then touch the bottom portion of the turn log (see first picture below). This shows you the round trip estimate as demonstrated in the second picture.
View attachment 181637 View attachment 181638

Oh wow, wasn't aware of this one. Where exactly do you tap? Just on the bottom silver bar where it says miles, minutes, etc?

 

[Phil Seastrand]

Oh wow, wasn't aware of this one. Where exactly do you tap? Just on the bottom silver bar where it says miles, minutes, etc?

Correct!

 

[swesson]

For those saying the car's trip planner calculates for elevation correctly, try this trick: drive from Wichita to Denver in a Model X and only charge for the recommended times. You won't make it. Guaranteed. 1299 to 5280 in elevation gain. Adding 10-20% extra charging range does the trick, though.

 

[evp]

For those saying the car's trip planner calculates for elevation correctly, try this trick: drive from Wichita to Denver in a Model X and only charge for the recommended times. You won't make it. Guaranteed. 1299 to 5280 in elevation gain. Adding 10-20% extra charging range does the trick, though.

Well, "sorta correctly". YMMV. (This is the first time I've used Your Milage May Vary in the literal sense.) If you go from Denver to Silverthorne you'll see the slope of the energy line steepen as you approach Eisenhower Tunnel, then turn around and go backwards as you go downhill to the Silverthorne SpC (gaining 6 rated miles in the process). This seems to be substantially accurate if you stay at the speed limit. But there's a little "nipple" right at the tunnel. This is where the car thinks you're driving uphill over the mountain the tunnel goes through, then down the other side.

 

[David99]

For those saying the car's trip planner calculates for elevation correctly, try this trick: drive from Wichita to Denver in a Model X and only charge for the recommended times. You won't make it. Guaranteed. 1299 to 5280 in elevation gain. Adding 10-20% extra charging range does the trick, though.

I have driven that section a few times. Yes you need more energy to make it over the hill, then you get some back going down. But frankly, if you have the trip meter open, you can see how the graph dips down and the goes up again. So there is a clear visual indication that you need to charge a little more.