I appreciate your question. You're right that It was a fringe case (the current tesla word) ...but a very valid case none the less if this vehicle is going to be relevant in our lives. It's really not dismissive if it's simply just not available...
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Info on non-Tesla superchargers
- Thread starter cstork
- Start date
I appreciate your question. You're right that It was a fringe case (the current tesla word) ...but a very valid case none the less if this vehicle is going to be relevant in our lives. It's really not dismissive if it's simply just not available...
He mentioned Bucees, so Texas maybe? I know there are Bucees in other states, but I usually hear them mentioned by Texans.
I get that, but tbh, I don't find it more complicated than a gas car. Try thinking through all the things that you'd have to explain to someone who was completely new to ICE cars. Fuel grades? Oil changes? Diesel vs Gas? Brake jobs? Various emissions additives that have to be changed for the diesels? Planning ahead so that you have time to refuel for an emergency? Keeping gas in the tank for hurricane season so you don't get stuck in line for an hour? Some aspects actually kind of stink (literally).
In the EV, you just hop in and start off with a full charge every time (obviously this assumes you have home charging).
I get this part, though. The Supercharger network is great, but the gaps here are less rare than people seem to realize. I haven't noticed hours of detours, but I definitely have a major interstate route that almost need 20+ minutes of detours. It gets worse when looking at rural areas.
TomServo
Active Member
I’m doing something wrong, this 68 disabled veteran has no troubles driving my Model Y ANYWHERE we need to go, be it around town or cross county. Maybe the military toughens is up.
I'll agree -there are still areas that are not properly serviced. I wanted to go to a ski hill in a rural area, but in winter the car probably won't go there and back from the nearest supercharger. The Plugshare options are campgrounds, which probably are not even accessible in winter(Who ploughs the private roads?) But in the last few years, the TransCanada and I94 across the west were finished. There are still stretches where getting through is impossible or iffy in winter going south from Western Canada to the northern USA. (Such as from Calgary). So for a certain number of the North American population, EV's are not the best choice.
Another point to add to the OP is the cost and reliability of Chademo charging. I've seen reports on Plugshare etc. of these chargers being down, or failing to start charging; plus assorted different methods of paying for charging that sometimes don't cooperate. (Use Plugshare to determine what charger network or membership or payment option will be needed) As demand for these chargers increases, I suspect maintenance will be better. Also, quirky chargers will probably adhere to standards more exactly as demand increases. Another problem is that often there are only 1 or 2 chargers at these locations, unlike Tesla superchargers with 6 stalls or more. If you have the bad luck to encounter another vehicle using (or blocking) the charger, your wait may be extended.
My Chademo experience (once to test the adapter) was so-so. I had to struggle to get everything properly connected (stiff connections) then found that I had to prop the cable up on a bollard to prevent a sideways strain on the car port before it charged; even then, the best I got was about 37kW. A good option in a pinch, but not regularly for long distance trips.
Another point to add to the OP is the cost and reliability of Chademo charging. I've seen reports on Plugshare etc. of these chargers being down, or failing to start charging; plus assorted different methods of paying for charging that sometimes don't cooperate. (Use Plugshare to determine what charger network or membership or payment option will be needed) As demand for these chargers increases, I suspect maintenance will be better. Also, quirky chargers will probably adhere to standards more exactly as demand increases. Another problem is that often there are only 1 or 2 chargers at these locations, unlike Tesla superchargers with 6 stalls or more. If you have the bad luck to encounter another vehicle using (or blocking) the charger, your wait may be extended.
My Chademo experience (once to test the adapter) was so-so. I had to struggle to get everything properly connected (stiff connections) then found that I had to prop the cable up on a bollard to prevent a sideways strain on the car port before it charged; even then, the best I got was about 37kW. A good option in a pinch, but not regularly for long distance trips.
I'm finding this is the biggest part of the learning curve for non-Tesla networks. They don't seem to realize that they are a critical piece of infrastructure for their users, and their maintenance policies and procedures lack this insight. Hopefully they will get better, but I think it might take another couple of years.
To their credit, I'm increasingly seeing an emphasis on dependability in EVGo's presentations, so they at least seem to realize the importance. Now to see if they follow through with actually doing the work.
Yeah, getting that thing plugged in is a chore. Its much harder than the really easy process for J1772. 37KW is a pretty typical experience. You can still gain ~20% in 30 minutes with an LR 3/Y, which is often enough to fill in a supercharger gap.
With a conservative range of 200 miles, and a 20 min stop (which are on major roadways, so maybe 3 miles out of your way) to add 100 more miles, AND your use of the words "print out the directions" and "a few hours late" makes me think that, perhaps, you don't own a Tesla.
I would say there are many CHAdeMO and CCS chargers out there in the USA. Many are older installations that are mostly urban and either single or in pairs unlike Superchargers which have more chargers per location. These older non-Tesla sites are almost always limited to 50 kW or less.
There are also many newer non-Tesla locations with larger clusters of chargers supporting 150 kW or more. EVgo has a few of these and are planning on ramping up their locations with recent funding from GM but they are mostly in urban locations.
Electrify America has 600 locations now which is not that much less than the number of USA Supercharger locations. The EA sites are largely 150 kW. Some older urban locations are limited to 50 kW and ~3 chargers but most locations have at least 4 chargers. EA sites have one charger supporting CHAdeMO. EA has many highway locations across the country in all states except a few rural ones like Wyoming, the Dakotas, and West Virginia. These EA Highway sites are 150 kW with a couple of 350 kW chargers and like Superchargers are usually spaced no more than ~120 miles apart. Aside from some reliability issues, it’s now very possible to drive to many destinations across the country using CCS. The latest cars like the Mach-e and ID.4 are beginning to have reasonably competitive charging speed (120 kW+).
For USA Tesla drivers, there is now a 3rd party CCS adapter, Setec, although it is limited to 50-75 kW (125-200A) depending upon the Tesla model and is relatively new and doesn’t always work with all CCS chargers. Tesla itself is doing a Type 1 CCS adapter (“USA CCS”) which will be sold soon in South Korea and then almost certainly in North America soon after.
Also, the existing Tesla CHAdeMO adapter is now priced at $400, not $450 or $500 and us popular enough that it is currently on backorder.
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As of March 2020 Tesla had 908 Supercharger locations in the US. As of January 2021 there were 7600 Supercharger points in North America compared with 1400 charging points for the Chargepoint network and 1600 charging points for Electrify America. That is quite a bit more.
The next competitive frontier for DC Fast Charging versus Supercharging is the cost of charging, i.e. cost per kWh or cost per mile to charge.
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Actually, Supercharge.info says as of May 12 there are 1163 open Supercharger sites in the US. Tesla has really been ramping up site installations to try to match the quick ramp is new car sales.
I’m not sure about ChargePoint stats offhand, but Electrify America hasn’t had 1600 chargers in quite a while. It is now about 2600 chargers at 600 sites with a target of 3500 “open or under development” at 800 sites by the end of 2021.
Still, I agree that my Supercharger site numbers were a bit old and that Tesla has now zoomed away from EA with close to twice as many USA locations and often twice or more chargers per location.
The good news is that charging coverage is getting to be much better across the country although there is still room for improvement in rural areas including recreational sites like forests and parks.
North American Tesla drivers get the best of both worlds with a Tesla CCS adapter.
TomServo
Active Member
"4) When using the trip planner, by default it only shows superchargers >100 Kwatts. You have to change an easy setting to see the slower ones."
How do I do that?
How do I do that?
While I'm reading this, CNN in the background is playing the Progressive Insurance commercial "...we can't stop you from becoming your parents..." and the presenter in that seminar is saying:
"How many of you printed out directions on how to get here?"
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