Kevin's "data"

[dsm363]

You didn't answer any of our questions. What level of disclosure do you require? How do we verify people are telling the truth? Will we have to pay for independent auditors who will verify that we hold X% of holdings in Tesla stock and how much of our financial history do we need to disclose to you, a stranger on the Internet? Seriously flawed arguments. If you expect 'full transparency' and verification that is reliable on an Internet forum then think you will be very disappointed. Will we get to see your financial statements for the last decade to make sure you have no financial conflict of interests?

We wish you the best on your endeavors. Good luck.

 

[ElSupreme]

I've been making several posts about Nokian tires recently and have been negligent about this but would like to make amends by adding full disclosure here that I have no positions in Nokian or any of its affiliates.

Crap, I have Nokia stock (well the NOK ADR), they used to own Nokian, do I need to disclose that. I also have some F (Ford) stock should I disclose that also? I have some GE stock, but the GE dishwasher I have is pure CRAP! Do I need to disclose them because they probably make something for Tesla, or something that goes into a Tesla. I am pretty sure they have a big input in the power that gets to my house to charge my Tesla also.

Does it matter that all that stock is tied into a IRA and I can't really touch it for another 35 years?

 

[Al Sherman]

It's sad but not surprising that many people here do not value transparency.

Who said people here don't value transparency?


IMO attacking someone (like Mr Broder) who challenges a company you own stock in, should result in full disclosure by all participants.

We've beaten this to death. If I review toilet paper on Amazon should I disclose that I own stock in P&G? Why don't you just assume we ALL own Tesla stock? Wouldn't that be easier?


I think this article says a lot about recent behaviour that we have witnessed - The Agony Of The Fanboy

My experience is that the vast majority of folks on this forum get the article and already live by it. I for one spent hours and hours researching and learning about the Prius on the Toyota forum for years. I've driven the car for 5 years and loved it. I'm unceremoniously getting rid of it in a couple of weeks because the Model S is the obvious next step for me. I love Tesla and what they're trying to accomplish. If Toyota (or anybody) leapfrogs Tesla in 5 years I'll move along to that.

Besides, your initial posts clearly implied that there is some kind of organized dishonesty happening regarding folks who like Tesla, and there car who also own stock trying to manipulate share prices by attacking anyone who says anything negative. That's just silly.

 

[ElSupreme]

For me, this site was historically more about "TMC" than "Tesla Motors Club", and that's why I have participated in many discussions. However, the site now seems to attack anyone who raises a modicum of complaint or challenges the perceived wisdoms that Tesla can do no wrong.... here's a typical example from today NOT happy.

He got attacked for not telling anyone WHY he was not happy! Not that he was unhappy.

I suggest you go to VW Vortex or another car forum and start spouting untold problems/issues with their cars and see what happens. Probably the same thing. Say "Not HAPPY" VW is such a pain to deal with. Their car is crap, and not what I wanted. Why don't they listen to me? I just want to deal with my Dealer" You'll get pretty much the same response. Pretty much every car forum HATES DEALER, so criticizing them is fine.

 

[Kevin Sharpe]

You didn't answer any of our questions.

I've done my best but didn't expect to change any hearts or minds here... I wish you luck with your investment, must be an exciting day for you :wink:

 

[AnOutsider]

It's sad but not surprising that many people here do not value transparency. I have no problem with anyone owning Tesla stock but do think it's relevant when attacks are made on the credibility of third parties. IMO attacking someone (like Mr Broder) who challenges a company you own stock in, should result in full disclosure by all participants. I generally find that professional motoring journalists working for respectable publications are ok with disclosure.

For me, this site was historically more about "TMC" than "Tesla Motors Club", and that's why I have participated in many discussions. However, the site now seems to attack anyone who raises a modicum of complaint or challenges the perceived wisdoms that Tesla can do no wrong.... here's a typical example from today NOT happy.

I think this article says a lot about recent behaviour that we have witnessed - The Agony Of The Fanboy

While I can agree with you one the level of... "enthusiasm" lately on the forum, the fact that this is a TESLA fan forum should be more than enough of a disclosure of most of the posters interests. Requiring them to divulge how much stock (or how many Tesla vehicles) they own is just silly Kevin, and I think you know that. Valid complaint, absurd way of making it.

 

[dsm363]

Yes because we here managed to make the stock jump 6% through our deception I guess.

You say we have to be fully transparent but don't explain how that works on an Internet forum. If someone says 'I don't own Tesla stock' you can't verify if they are telling the truth or even if they own a car. Just ask any Notre Dame football player. You must be careful on the Internet.

 

[richkae]

It's sad but not surprising that many people here do not value transparency. I have no problem with anyone owning Tesla stock but do think it's relevant when attacks are made on the credibility of third parties. IMO attacking someone (like Mr Broder) who challenges a company you own stock in, should result in full disclosure by all participants. I generally find that professional motoring journalists working for respectable publications are ok with disclosure.

For me, this site was historically more about "TMC" than "Tesla Motors Club", and that's why I have participated in many discussions. However, the site now seems to attack anyone who raises a modicum of complaint or challenges the perceived wisdoms that Tesla can do no wrong.... here's a typical example from today NOT happy.

I think this article says a lot about recent behaviour that we have witnessed - The Agony Of The Fanboy

A professional journalist has a responsibility to his colleagues and employer - that responsibility is to present facts in a manner unnassailable by both the partial and the impartial. He also has an ethical responsibility to all the peers in his profession, lest his sloppiness damage them all.
Broder has done a poor job in all of the above.
I have no such responsibility, I am happy to take the part of the partial and to point out the flaws in his article and speculate on his bias while beholden to no one. People here are free to downvote my reputation. I do not worry about damaging the brand of TMC with my bias, nor being a black mark against the internet fanboy industry.

I believe the quality of the debate here, while sometimes not as high as it could be, is frequently higher than that presented by the professional media.

 

[Laumb]

Stupid:
- This thread.


Tapatalkin' from iTalatut...

 

[dpeilow]

We are getting away from the original point.

Broder put himself up for ridicule and deservedly got it. If an away player antagonizes the home fans they aren't going to sit in their seats silent. Not only did they shout back but the home team won 7-0.

What are we going to do next, stick up for Jeremy Clarkson?

If some of the members made a little money when the shares bounced, great. I hope the shorters got stuffed.


I for one would like to thank Broder for restoring some of the community spirit here. It was about time we had another high profile roadtrip to cheer on.

 

[Kevin Sharpe]

We are getting away from the original point.

Not of this thread... presumably someone wanted to discuss further non-disclosed Tesla stock ownership and it's impact on the NYT debacle. Here's the question that I asked;

do you have any idea which stock holders are most prevalent in these threads or the external campaigns against the NYT and Mr Broder?

Seems like a perfectly reasonable question to ask

 

[rolosrevenge]

Full disclosure, I have between 100 - 200 shares of Tesla stock, wrote my Ph.D. on electric car integration and V2G, and have 3 patents pending related to vehicle-to-grid systems. I still think Broder's data discrepancy was deplorable.

 

[Kevin Sharpe]

I still think Broder's data discrepancy was deplorable.

Great, and now we all know where we stand and can take a view based on that knowledge. Everyone is happy!

 

[Al Sherman]

Full disclosure, I have between 100 - 200 shares of Tesla stock, wrote my Ph.D. on electric car integration and V2G, and have 3 patents pending related to vehicle-to-grid systems. I still think Broder's data discrepancy was deplorable.

I have at least 10 times that amount of stock left after I sold enough to buy the MS after the TMC forum (obviously) caused it to double in price. My wife has a Ph.D. I have no idea what electric car integration is or V2G and have no patents. Unless you count the little doohicky I invented and fabricated so that my ice fishing pole wouldn't get dragged down the hole by a big fish. Which I expressly told my fishing buddies that I wanted credit for if they used it.

But as DSM363 pointed out a few pages ago; I could be lying so what's the point?

 

[qwk]

This has got to be the most ridiculous thread I have ever come accross. It's very clear that Broder lied. I don't think that any rational person would hesitate calling him an idiot if he had started the same trip in an ICE with 3 gallons of gasoline in the tank, ran out, and then cried about it in a national newspaper article. Why is it any different in an EV? Plain silly.

 

[NigelM]

This has got to be the most ridiculous thread I have ever come accross.

But no-one can resist posting here.....:wink:

 

[Norbert]

Kevin, I trust that in a few years, when you look back at what happened (and will happen) this year, you will look at it in a different light.

 

[Kevin Sharpe]

But as DSM363 pointed out a few pages ago; I could be lying so what's the point?

Sure you can lie but that won't get you far in a community for long. Obviously, it's also possible for an external organisation to verify a lot of what you claim about yourself. If you don't believe or care about transparency then this is all irrelevant. Personally, I'm interested in the motives behind the people that attacked the NYT.

 

[ElSupreme]

Personally, I'm interested in the motives behind the people that attacked the NYT.

Uhh. The truth?

 

[Kevin Sharpe]

Uhh. The truth?

I'm not going to turn this into a NYT thread but can I suggest that your 'truth' is not universally accepted?