Isn't that why they call it lunacy, or are you just being too subtle again for a dimwit like me. (I'm so old I can see only out of one ear, that's where the trumpet is.)
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Long-Term Fundamentals of Tesla Motors (TSLA)
- Thread starter Robert.Boston
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- elon is an ass investing TSLA
MitchJi
Trying to learn kindness, patience & forgiveness
I believe that we are overlooking the impact of the Solar Shingles. It's very small sample size, but when the M3 was revealed I recommended to all our neighbors that they make a reservation. I said that if there's even a small chance that you'll want an M3 it's a smart decision to make a $1k deposit that could save you 7.5k. Nobody I know except my sister heeded my advice.
We are planning to get a Solar Roof. We found out that a neighbor is already planning to get the Solar shingles. I just sent another neighbor this link:
Project Sunroof Data Explorer by Google
This is our ensuing conversation (neighbors replies in bold):
Thanks!! That's great info! We've been wanting to look into that
Check the video here:
Tesla Solar
I'm sold! Great video!
No deposit, and a tiny sample size but it's an indication that there might be more demand for Solar Shingles than the M3.
We are planning to get a Solar Roof. We found out that a neighbor is already planning to get the Solar shingles. I just sent another neighbor this link:
Project Sunroof Data Explorer by Google
This is our ensuing conversation (neighbors replies in bold):
Thanks!! That's great info! We've been wanting to look into that
Check the video here:
Tesla Solar
I'm sold! Great video!
No deposit, and a tiny sample size but it's an indication that there might be more demand for Solar Shingles than the M3.
A primer for the younger set on the forum and appropriate context to understand why CA has special rules (that should not be repealed)
and a long standing special battle that leads the nation.
And in no small way, why Tesla founded itself and its manufacturing there.
This post is to help provide a quick historical perspective that many have forgotten or were never privy to, being lucky enough to enter the world after much of the hard work of others had taken hold.
Those efforts were the precursor of the efforts today being applied for the benefit of future generations- and puts the efforts of Musk and others into a proposer perspective for the younger of our investor group.
I'll keep it short with some pics (1948-1970s general timeframe) and graphs (LA and California) and a link for further reading
A recently published historical article
Progress from all those laws and regulations you hear so much about--
L.A.'s Smoggy Past, in Photos
It really did happen here (I was there for much of it)-
it can easily happen here again,
and is in fact happening around the world with affects that reach us all
and our children and our grandchildren
Just as some of you may be too young to fully appreciate the work of your elders
Thanks for your time....
and a long standing special battle that leads the nation.
And in no small way, why Tesla founded itself and its manufacturing there.
This post is to help provide a quick historical perspective that many have forgotten or were never privy to, being lucky enough to enter the world after much of the hard work of others had taken hold.
Those efforts were the precursor of the efforts today being applied for the benefit of future generations- and puts the efforts of Musk and others into a proposer perspective for the younger of our investor group.
I'll keep it short with some pics (1948-1970s general timeframe) and graphs (LA and California) and a link for further reading
A recently published historical article
Progress from all those laws and regulations you hear so much about--
L.A.'s Smoggy Past, in Photos
It really did happen here (I was there for much of it)-
it can easily happen here again,
and is in fact happening around the world with affects that reach us all
and our children and our grandchildren
Just as some of you may be too young to fully appreciate the work of your elders
Thanks for your time....
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DragonWatch
Small FootPrint
Yes, lived the worst of it plus ran track & cross country from '63 to '68 at Hawthorne High. Surprised I lived to talk about it. Now I enjoy life on the lake in the northwest and sadly see the clearcut across the lake, another man made hell.
I was never much of an athlete, but I grew up in the soup that was Los Angeles too. East LA (Monterey Park actually, though right on the border) and I remember smog days as a kid where we couldn't go out for recess because the air was so toxic. Part of the smog in Los Angeles is a natural phenomenon, the Spanish initially named San Pedro Harbor the "Bay of Smoke" when they first discovered it, but the tailpipe emissions from cars made it monumentally worse (by at least an order of magnitude).
I grew up with constant sinus problems and sinus headaches. They cleared up when I finally moved away when I started at Cal Poly, SLO in the mid-80s. I too live in the NW now, I tell people I can see Oregon from my window.
I've been in Portland and Seattle since the late 80s and it's still kind of a marvel that the worst air days here are about on par with the best days in Los Angeles when I was a kid.
In 1964, in Analog magazine, a story by Walt and Leigh Richmond, called "Short Stack" poisited 1,000+ ft "stacks" (tubes) to move air UP and create electricity. in the fictional story, one was built in LA (Hell'A) and it accidentally reversed and brought, fresh clean air from above and replaced the polluted air below (conveniently ignoring where that went, but it was a short story)(wife and i drove thru LA in 74 and were amazed by orange "speckles" hanging in the air, that hid a mountain right next to us)(we both have mild asthma and difficulty breathing that 'soup'I was never much of an athlete, but I grew up in the soup that was Los Angeles too. East LA (Monterey Park actually, though right on the border) and I remember smog days as a kid where we couldn't go out for recess because the air was so toxic. Part of the smog in Los Angeles is a natural phenomenon, the Spanish initially named San Pedro Harbor the "Bay of Smoke" when they first discovered it, but the tailpipe emissions from cars made it monumentally worse (by at least an order of magnitude).
I grew up with constant sinus problems and sinus headaches. They cleared up when I finally moved away when I started at Cal Poly, SLO in the mid-80s. I too live in the NW now, I tell people I can see Oregon from my window.
Technology, however, uses science fiction to do "what if I try that?" SO......
Arizona Solar Updraft Tower By 2015: Science Fiction in the News
larmor
Active Member
Looks like its time to invest in sunscreen and a boat...
DragonWatch
Small FootPrint
I found this a reasonable read http://www.investors.com/news/techn...ent-that-makes-tesla-model-3-a-giant-success/
Safety is what drove us to buy our first, second and third Volvo starting in 1984. Yeah, a few years back. We bought the first and second while stationed in Germany. Ultimately we knew of three families that were involved in major accidents and because they were driving Volvo's they walked away with only bruising and minor cuts. We left the Volvo family because they failed to improve their gas mileage, maintenance costs were $2,000 a year back in 2010, and other manufacturers were finally stepping up to the safety plate. We owned one of the very first 960s and B4 getting to 50,000 miles the engine blew and was replaced under warranty including a loaner car for the two months it took to send a new one from out of country ~ outside the US. So early Tesla owners I feel your pain
Bottom line ~ Tesla leading the charge (charge ~ get it) on auto safety puts them in a unique leadership role. People that care about safety will be drawn to Tesla.
Ford, Toyota and GM (pretty much all other than Volvo) never put their customer's safety above all else ~ otherwise someone or insurance or media would have put it on my radar.
To the best of my knowledge Tesla has not only sought to improve our environment they have sought to design for safety and quality. From my observations they have identified early most issues, or tried to get out ahead of the problem and provide the best possible solution. Cannot say that about others blaming tires and tires blaming the SUV Remember that MajorBS from the early eighties, while families died in auto accidents.
Safety is what drove us to buy our first, second and third Volvo starting in 1984. Yeah, a few years back. We bought the first and second while stationed in Germany. Ultimately we knew of three families that were involved in major accidents and because they were driving Volvo's they walked away with only bruising and minor cuts. We left the Volvo family because they failed to improve their gas mileage, maintenance costs were $2,000 a year back in 2010, and other manufacturers were finally stepping up to the safety plate. We owned one of the very first 960s and B4 getting to 50,000 miles the engine blew and was replaced under warranty including a loaner car for the two months it took to send a new one from out of country ~ outside the US. So early Tesla owners I feel your pain
Bottom line ~ Tesla leading the charge (charge ~ get it) on auto safety puts them in a unique leadership role. People that care about safety will be drawn to Tesla.
Ford, Toyota and GM (pretty much all other than Volvo) never put their customer's safety above all else ~ otherwise someone or insurance or media would have put it on my radar.
To the best of my knowledge Tesla has not only sought to improve our environment they have sought to design for safety and quality. From my observations they have identified early most issues, or tried to get out ahead of the problem and provide the best possible solution. Cannot say that about others blaming tires and tires blaming the SUV
Remember that MajorBS from the early eighties, while families died in auto accidents.
Bottom line ~ Tesla leading the charge (charge ~ get it) on auto safety puts them in a unique leadership role. People that care about safety will be drawn to Tesla.
Ford, Toyota and GM (pretty much all other than Volvo) never put their customer's safety above all else ~ otherwise someone or insurance or media would have put it on my radar.
To the best of my knowledge Tesla has not only sought to improve our environment they have sought to design for safety and quality. From my observations they have identified early most issues, or tried to get out ahead of the problem and provide the best possible solution. Cannot say that about others blaming tires and tires blaming the SUV
For most car companies, they make their cars safe enough to get past the regulators and everything else is weighed by cost. GM with the ignition switch thing, they figured they would let it go because their costs for a few accidents would be less than the cost for replacing all the switches. Ford dragged its feet on the Pinto and Chevy the Corvair. The problems were eventually fixed, but the companies were not very proactive about it.
Volvo is one of the leaders in safety. Though I would say Mercedes puts a lot of effort into safety too.
Tesla's drive to be the safest cars on the road may come from real concerns about public safety, or it may have been a calculated ploy. I think the design leaders of the Model S knew that the sharks would be out and attacking Tesla for every little problem. They designed the car to minimize every potential problem. Range was the one problem they were going to be stuck with, so they came up with the supercharger network to compensate. Without an engine or gasoline, there was an opportunity to make something very safe in an accident and they took it.
Tesla has also been very quick to address any issues that do come up. Far faster than most companies.
Whether a calculated business decision, a humanitarian decision, or both, Teslas are amazingly safe cars from a company that is very proactive at fixing problems.
Elon Musk often talks about the 'S' curve of BEV adoption. Ark-invest estimates we'll hit the knee of the curve, just before the slope gets steeper, in 2022. The key data point they use is the date when a "200-mile range EV with the same amenities as today’s best-selling Toyota Camry will sell at a lower price point".
However, they go on to state: "Incorporating the EV savings associated with lower maintenance and fuel costs, ARK anticipates that the crossover point will occur even sooner, perhaps before 2020, as is illustrated below."
Here's the article and their charts:
However, they go on to state: "Incorporating the EV savings associated with lower maintenance and fuel costs, ARK anticipates that the crossover point will occur even sooner, perhaps before 2020, as is illustrated below."
Here's the article and their charts:
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That's very interesting. I believe that the base Model 3 will have enough amenities (including electric drive) to be considered better than a Toyota Camry, and it'll sell for $35K in 2018, so I think their estimates are a tad off... anyway, 2019 is a good guess for the acceleration year based on supply-side evidence (lots of manufacturers are promising 2019 cars or 2020 cars, few are promising 2018 cars)
Morgan Stanley's Adam Jonas sees Tesla eventually launching a sharing model
Yeah, we've all heard Adam Jonas express his fascination with his own ideas before, but I'm getting a strong sense there's something big, as in highly leveragable, tied to Tesla's lead in SAFETY as the single biggest industry-wide differentiator in automotive design moving forward. Clearly, safety design focus is moving to software & autonomy. We'll see if the talk of tenfold safety improvements will actually be realized, but it may already be a done deal in Elon's view. Just how does he plan to leverage Tesla's ever-accelerating lead in data-miles...can it be bigger than just Tesla Network (which will be huge)? If the adoption of sustainable transport remains limited by TA's manufacturing growth rate, as incredibly rapid as that is, conceivably it could scale much faster; how?
If Tesla SAFETY levels in a few years achieve the perception of de facto industry standard because no other provider comes close to matching it, who else but a uniquely experienced engineer/physicist & entrepreneur, free of legacy counterweights, could pull that off? In his 3-D chess view, can this level of SAFETY be canned & universally implemented? Not really sure why I'm thinking it's even possible, but this whole safety aspect is a very powerful force driving the whole industry. It's interesting that autonomous driving is one innovative design aspect that auto makers have unanimously jumped into - it's directly tied to their ability to compete for future market share on the basis of SAFETY, and it's an incremental technology, so they can keep making ICEs during transition to EVs.
Aren't the EAP & FSD engineering input parameters mainly specific to a vehicle's envelope geometry, determining the placement of cameras and sensors? I'm wondering if Elon hasn't already determined if it is technically possible to create an engineering template/platform on which any vehicle designer could build their own designs, and license a Tesla EAP/FSD ecosystem. Wouldn't Elon do everything he could to get other car makers scaling as fast as possible (making Tesla a ton of licensing profits), once they finally succumb to the inEVitable, and look for ways to profitably utilize mfg capacity vs. writing off stranded assets?
Yeah, we've all heard Adam Jonas express his fascination with his own ideas before, but I'm getting a strong sense there's something big, as in highly leveragable, tied to Tesla's lead in SAFETY as the single biggest industry-wide differentiator in automotive design moving forward. Clearly, safety design focus is moving to software & autonomy. We'll see if the talk of tenfold safety improvements will actually be realized, but it may already be a done deal in Elon's view. Just how does he plan to leverage Tesla's ever-accelerating lead in data-miles...can it be bigger than just Tesla Network (which will be huge)? If the adoption of sustainable transport remains limited by TA's manufacturing growth rate, as incredibly rapid as that is, conceivably it could scale much faster; how?
If Tesla SAFETY levels in a few years achieve the perception of de facto industry standard because no other provider comes close to matching it, who else but a uniquely experienced engineer/physicist & entrepreneur, free of legacy counterweights, could pull that off? In his 3-D chess view, can this level of SAFETY be canned & universally implemented? Not really sure why I'm thinking it's even possible, but this whole safety aspect is a very powerful force driving the whole industry. It's interesting that autonomous driving is one innovative design aspect that auto makers have unanimously jumped into - it's directly tied to their ability to compete for future market share on the basis of SAFETY, and it's an incremental technology, so they can keep making ICEs during transition to EVs.
Aren't the EAP & FSD engineering input parameters mainly specific to a vehicle's envelope geometry, determining the placement of cameras and sensors? I'm wondering if Elon hasn't already determined if it is technically possible to create an engineering template/platform on which any vehicle designer could build their own designs, and license a Tesla EAP/FSD ecosystem. Wouldn't Elon do everything he could to get other car makers scaling as fast as possible (making Tesla a ton of licensing profits), once they finally succumb to the inEVitable, and look for ways to profitably utilize mfg capacity vs. writing off stranded assets?
Here's a good cause and effect rundown on the EPA change to integrate into your thinking on TE implications
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/27/...r-to-dismantle-the-clean-power-plan.html?_r=0
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/27/...r-to-dismantle-the-clean-power-plan.html?_r=0
Driver Dave
Member
Pretty easy questions to answer...
> What was the primary reason for the Tesla/Mobileye breakup?
Autonomous driving tech is extremely valuable. Why should Tesla enable a third party when they can build and own the value themselves.
> Why would Tesla want to have both Mobileye and "Tesla Vision" active on new vehicles?
Takes time to have the new system eat up data and learn, so while it is learning, why not have AP2 cars using Mobileye and then when Tesla is ready, switch over.
> Is there a better way to play the autonomous driving revolution?
No. Mobileye is now Ford, aka, its over.
US nuclear developer Westinghouse Electric to file Tuesday for bankruptcy: Sources
"Pittsburgh-based Westinghouse, crippled by cost overruns at two U.S. projects in Georgia and South Carolina, will file for protection under Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code, the people told Reuters on Tuesday."
"Pittsburgh-based Westinghouse, crippled by cost overruns at two U.S. projects in Georgia and South Carolina, will file for protection under Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code, the people told Reuters on Tuesday."
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