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Mileage calculations don't make sense

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In preparation for our first long trip in our 2023 MYLR, we entered a routing to see our first charging stop. Warm day, 83% battery showing. Routing said that we could hghway drive 1 hr 20 min (~75 miles) before recharge and that our battery status would drop to 47%.
What?
Does that mean we only have an actual range of ~150 miles instead of the promised 250+? Gonna be a terrible trip if true. Car is still under warranty, so do we need to talk to Tesla Service? Or am I missing something here? I know that ranges are an estimate but this seems way off the mark. TIA
 
83% to 47% is 36%. 75 miles divided by 0.36 is 208 miles.

It's most likely stopping you (very) early because of a dearth of superchargers between your first and second stop. If you start with more like 95-100% and can therefore go further you might get an entirely different routing. Try www.abetterrouteplanner.com and make sure to tell it you only want superchargers.
 
Wamoosh: What's your proposed route? If it's interstate, SCs are perfectly spaced, IMHO. I keep % between 10-70%, which means charging is the fastest possible. Less convenient than ICE range of 350-500miles, the trip WILL take longer, but walking/stretching...etc...more frequently is healthier, for me at least.
 
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In preparation for our first long trip in our 2023 MYLR, we entered a routing to see our first charging stop. Warm day, 83% battery showing. Routing said that we could hghway drive 1 hr 20 min (~75 miles) before recharge and that our battery status would drop to 47%.
What?
Does that mean we only have an actual range of ~150 miles instead of the promised 250+? Gonna be a terrible trip if true. Car is still under warranty, so do we need to talk to Tesla Service? Or am I missing something here? I know that ranges are an estimate but this seems way off the mark. TIA
  • Whats your route? How far to the next charger?
  • What software are you using? I hate A Better Route Planner, it makes a lot of unnecessary stops.
  • Charge to 100% before starting a trip. I’m assuming you charge at home.
Yes, Tesla’s estimated mileage is very over estimated. At highway speeds I’d think a LR would get 230/240 miles on a 100% charge.
 
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The "range" value advertised for the car is based on ideal conditions at moderate speeds. If you're on the interstate your actual range will be less because drag goes up with the square of speed.

For planning purposes I use a very rough ballpark of about 3mi/1% for local driving or state highways, 2mi/1% on the interstate. Assuming you're talking interstate with the AC running that sounds about right.

I find the trips don't really take us much longer (if at all) than in ICE since we're stopping every 90-120 minutes anyway to use the bathroom. If you're an iron-butt gallon-bladder type who insists on driving as far as you physically can before stopping, you're going to need to change your habits a bit. But it'll be healthier in the long run...
 
The EPA published range is if you drive 55 MPH 55% of the time, 45 MPH 45% of the time. The EPA performs this test on a dynamometer in ideal temperature conditions. Then they derate by 30% and that's the number you get on your window sticker. The wind resistance on your car is a function of the square of your speed, meaning driving at 75 MPH requires WAY more energy than 45-55 MPH.

For our 2023 MYLR, when I charge to 100%, I get very close to 200 miles of usable range at 75 MPH in the winter driving over mountainous roads, heating the passenger compartment with driving lights on for the trip. That leaves me with about 8-15% remaining charge when I reach the supercharger at 200 miles from our start point. So I always do the math figuring 2/3 of the rated miles: 330 mile initial charge will get me 220 miles of actual range in the winter. This rough approximation has worked very reliably for me with 6 years of Tesla ownership. Interestingly, with our previous Model X, I used 3/4 of the rated miles since the Model X is a heavier car with a larger battery pack, it didn't need quite as much real world derating.

So, by my experience, your 2023 MYLR has around 200 miles of practical range when starting at 100%, allowing for hilly roads, driving in the winter, lights on, warming the passengers and arriving to the supercharger with enough remaining charge cushion to make me feel comfortable. The great news is the MYLR charges so fast at 250kW superchargers that I only have enough time to hit the head, walk the dogs, check my emails, relax for a couple minutes and we are ready for another 180-190 miles or so of practical range (leaves cushion 'in the tank'). This is such a relaxing way to drive that I now cringe if I need to take our gas-guzzler pickup instead of the Tesla.

As a new EV owner, the other main learning experience is that if you have to make a long road trip as quickly as possible, it can actually be faster overall to charge more often to ensure you are always charging in that 10-75% range where you maximize the supercharger kWh at every charge. On road trips, the only time I bother charging above 80% is when I am busy eating (or checking my emails) - which, ironically, is almost at every charging session. I have gotten so used to multitasking while charging that it is now the way I prefer to travel long distances. So its about changing habits, enjoying this new relaxing form of road tripping, when you first start driving an EV longer distances.
 
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@Wamoosh, welcome to the forum!

So, let's take this from the top. When routing a trip with the NAV, the Tesla software in there has a couple-three requirements about how to do this:
  • Get you to your destination as fast as possible
  • Get you to your destination without you running out of charge somewhere (a related, but significant requirement)
  • Get you to your destination so you're not bone-dry when you get there
Let's take these one at a time.

As "fast as possible" runs right up against the fact that a Tesla, when supercharging, charges at its fastest rate when it's near dead empty. If one plugs in a Tesla at, say, a 250 kW charger, one will get that charge rate when the car is down below 20% of full charge or so. After that, it ramps down the rate so, at 80% or so, it's down to 70 kW. So, on long trips with multiple Supercharger stops, with a sufficient number of superchargers around, the NAV software's route planner has one showing up with less than 10% charge (going for that sweet fast charging rate) and has one leaving with 80% or less.. because that last 20% of full charge takes longer than the first 80%! And they're trying to minimize one's time on the road.

Sometimes this seemingly gets a bit ridiculous: One will get to a Supercharger with a low charge and the software will suggest charging for ten minutes, then continuing on to the next, ad infinitum. That's barely enough for a bathroom break. But it does get one to one's destination fairly quickly, that being the point. Mostly it's not like that, though: I just got home from one of my periodic trips to Boston and the NAV had me stopping in Charlton for 30 minutes for about a 70% charge, then told me to continue, which I did. That was just enough to get me home with 10% charge remaining, which was why it did that: I didn't have to stop anywhere else, so it took that into account.

Now, onto the next requirement: Not Running Dry Somewhere. That's not so much a factor on the East Coast, where it's getting to the point where if one throws a rock, hard, a few times, one will hit a Supercharger somewhere. But if one is starting off without a full charge, the NAV software is perfectly capable of figuring out where one would run dry and Strongly Suggesting that one stop short of the Run Dry location, or even detour somewhere (not as common as that used to be, thanks to Tesla's gangs of SC installers) in order Not To Run Dry. All this poking around the landscape is still subject to the idea of getting one somewhere as quickly as possible, so if the trip router can avoid detouring, it will do so.

This kinda feeds into Tesla's printed suggestion that, if one is going on a trip, and in particular if one has home charging set up, charging up to 100% just before one leaves is a Right Good Idea. First, home charging is typically 2X to 3X cheaper than a Supercharger, so kind of avoiding Supercharging is a no-penalty kind of thing if one has home charging. Second, this gives the NAV more flexibility as to where one's first stop might be. It's not a big deal, since the NAV will get one to one's destination anyway, but what the heck.

Minor point: Tesla's Big Mothership runs an Operations Center. To the extent that they can, they know which Superchargers are full of cars, which are empty, and rough estimates of when all those Teslas roaming the landscape are going to congregate, and where. They'll try to route one to non-full SC's.

In this short list, there's the idea of Not Being Dry when one gets to one's destination. Generally, when one leaves it up to the NAV, it'll tend to get one to one's destination with just enough charge left, for, I dunno, 50 miles or so. Or at least to get to a Supercharger or destination charger somewhere. This is where one's brains are typically called into use. For an (obvious) example, I can make it from NJ to Boston, with a 100% charge, since the M3 I'm driving has a 330 mile range, and it's 250 miles or so from here. But if I get there with 50 miles (or whatever) left over, that means running around visiting relatives is going to get awkward in a hurry.. so I usually stop at some Supercharger within spitting distance of the city and gas up to 80% or so.

Which brings up a minor point: From 0% to 80% on a Supercharger is about 20 minutes. That's not a whole heck of a lot of time, just enough to hit the bathrooms and get a cup of coffee. So that quick stop when one hits one's destination isn't a big deal.

By the by: ABetterRoutePlanner's main claim to fame is that, if one uses the tool, one can put in one's desired charge level when one gets to one's desired destination, and the ABRP will make that happen. I don't use the tool, myself, but there are definitely people out there who are enamored of its features. (ABRP doesn't have the Tesla Mothership's Operations Center.. but it works anyway.)

Finally: You asked about Mileage. Sigh. On Ye Typical ICE car, the usual thing one gets, and the only thing one gets, is a DTE value (Distance to Empty). These are notoriously inaccurate, so much so that hardly anybody uses them seriously. Going up a mountain? Down a mountain? Against a headwind? With a tailwind? Cold weather? Hot weather? None of that is in there. Most people just keep an eye on the gas gauge and try not to run dry in Wyoming somewhere. (I don't want to count the number of cars I've owned over the years where one discovers, over time, that there's one or two gallons of gas in the tank when the gauge reads empty. Sigh.)

Tesla's aren't like that. In spades. Nobody is saying that a Tesla's equivalent of a gas gauge is infinitely accurate - but the collection of stuff presented is good to within +/-2% to +/-5%, which is much better than what an ICE has to offer.

First, there's the Mileage number at the top of the screen. Tesla gets this by multiplying the amount of charge in the battery times the Monroney sticker value. you have a MY; I believe that most of them have a 78 kW-hr battery and a 280 W-hr/mile rating. So, if one is at 50% charge (39 kW-hr), then that mileage indicator will show 39 kW-hr/(0.28kW-hr/mile) = 139 miles of range.

This is pretty much the most inaccurate of the indicators built into the Tesla. Next up: The Energy Screen.

Looking at the Tesla screen, at the bottom edge, there's an icon with three horizontal dots. Tap that, and you'll get a ridiculous number of icons; games, theater, radio, streaming, it goes on and on. but one of those is labeled, "Energy" and has a kinda plot icon on it. Tap that.

You'll get a window with Tesla's contribution to the Bewildering Plots of the World. But, there's good stuff in there. Along the top edge of this window, on the right, there's a "Consumption" button. Tap that. What you'll get is a plot of energy usage per mile for the last 5, 20, or 50 miles or so. Did you play Drag Strip with somebody five miles ago? You'll see a spike in energy usage. Coming down the Rocky Mountain Rise for 10 miles? You'll see the energy usage go negative (i.e., the car's absorbing energy to keep a constant speed). Got the heat turned on? More energy usage. Just driving along? A more or less horizontal line. The critical stuff? On the right vertical axis, it'll give you the estimated range based upon the plot. This is based upon whatever-the-heck driving you've been doing over the selected range and, given a squinty look, will give you a reasonable guess as to how far one can get.

Interestingly, there's a horizontal dotted line from left to right that's labeled, "Rated". That's the Monroney value for your car. On warm months, the energy usage of the car beats the Monroney value, sometimes by substantial. Cold months, it's the other way, a bit. If one plays Jackrabbit Jones on the road, then the energy usage will be higher, but you knew that anyway.

Go back to the top of this window and select the left-most plot. This is a plot trending down from the top left down to the bottom right. There's a more-or-less straight line there; that's the rated energy consumption. There's a line, usually lower than the rated, but not always, that shows you how you're doing on this drive. But the really interesting stuff is below the bottom of the plot. This is where the Tesla tells you where All The Energy Has Been Going. Weird driving habits? It's in there. Running at 90 mph? It's in there. Got the heater running? It's in there. Preconditioning for a Supercharger stop? It's in there. Weather? It's in there. There's about six items in there that show you, specifically, what's affecting your range and by how much.

The middle plot in this whole Energy thing gives one information about what has been termed, "Vampire Drain". This is the energy usage when one is parked. People get stressed about this, so Tesla has it out there so one can see.

That ends the Energy Plot discussion. And, now we get to the Most Accurate range estimator the car has.

When one is on NAV and has a destination plugged in, the car calculates its future energy usage and displays a little square window, down near the bottom edge of the screen. In there is the % charge at the destination. That is the most accurate range estimator, bar none, that the car has. Tesla's software and hardware people have pulled out the Big Guns and Did Their All to make that "% charge at destination" number.

On one's route: Going up a hill? It's in there. Going down a hill? It's in there. Different speed limits on different roads? They're in there. You doing 90 mph? It gets in there, maybe not instantly, but it does get in there. Got a headwind? It's in there. Got a tailwind? It's in there. Using the heat when going over the Donner Pass, but not when one is back in the flatlands? It's in there. Outside temperature? It's in there. Battery degradation? It's a recent update, but it's in there. It's ALL in there. Really.

If one is double-checking, look at the distance-to-destination number and compare it to the Miles at the top of the Tesla screen, then do a little subtraction to see how much one will have when One Gets There.

Weird, in its way. One Single Number (more or less) To Rule Them All. But that "% charge remaining" is the Good Stuff.

Hope this helps.
 
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Tesla's aren't like that. In spades. Nobody is saying that a Tesla's equivalent of a gas gauge is infinitely accurate - but the collection of stuff presented is good to within +/-2% to +/-5%, which is much better than what an ICE has to offer.

First: I agree with almost everything else you said. After 3.5 years (and 3.5 winters), I have an excellent sense of my car's range and how to road trip with it for long trips. I've given up on ABRP because of the terrible UI (unbelievably worse than tesla's) and because the tesla NAV planning system has improved over the time I've owned the car (and when I get around to updating it will improve more.) I don't like being limited on where I can take my breaks but that's something that will never change, refueling and breaktimes have to be one stop if you are hoping to manage 850+km of driving a day and still have enough time in the evening to destress before bed.

So, between improvements to my gut instinct of what the car can do and the NAV, a rhythm has been found. We only have one car, so taking the ICE on road trips is not an option. Driving to our rental cottage is slightly more complicated but my gut solidly knows what state of charge I must have to do the trip there. With only 110V charging there, a quick up and back over 2 day trip is not possible. But I know that and thus plan for longer stays. (If the power is ever out when I get up there, though, I'm screwed.)

Unfortunately, your comments about the accuracy of the end of trip state-of-charge doesn't fit my experience so I no longer trust it over my gut. We've had 3 experiences in the past 6 months where it has been off by over 10%. And unnecessarily so since once the NAV was set, I looked at the number (and the suggestion we'd have no need for a stop) and knew it was fantasy.

The first time, I decided since consistently in forums people say to trust the end number, I would see if I could get home. I was surprised at the prediction but not in any danger of running dry because I had been expecting to stop anyway and had a plan. To give the car the best chance at success, I stuck to the speed limit (much to the annoyance of those behind me on the two lane highway) but even so, there was no hope of making it home despite the system telling me to REDUCE SPEED TO GET TO YOUR DESTINATION. The NAV went from 12% on arrival to -2%. I simply pulled into the SC that was on the way but the NAV never rerouted or suggested that to me, I had to select it in order to precondition.

The second time, same route, but this time leaving with 100% and the car insisted we were fine but that time it was dead of winter and I knew we'd be stopping at the same place I stopped before.

The third time was a little bit of a surprise. It was a day trip and we didn't leave home with 100% charge and shouldn't have needed to (we do that day trip a lot) but between a detour to run an errand and winter our range was degraded more than I thought it would be. So in this case, warning bells hadn't gone off in advance.

The NAV insisted we were going to be fine until we weren't. The 20% predicted at journey's end (not only when we headed out but all points of the trip) dropped to 8% in the first 15 minutes of the last leg. As the driving had turned bad with driving snow, we couldn't trust that 8% to hold for the hour it would take to get home so we started to think about rerouting off the freeway so we could reduce speed. Conditions were such that most cars were going below the 100kph limit (instead of above) and at journey's end, the average speed according to teslafi was 81kph. We never were going below that of the cars in our lane so stuck with the divided highway as it was the shortest route home.

On the plus side, I got to educate my husband that him telling me to turn off my heat seater was not the right strategy and when we shut off the HVAC he saw the predicted remaining charge bump up to 12%. I grabbed a blanket from the child car seat in the back to stop the cold air falling from the windshield on my legs. I was thankful we didn't have the kids with us because the seat heaters in the rear wouldn't keep them warm, and range would have become an issue if we had left the HVAC on necessitating a detour to a supercharger (with the added time for the detour plus 10 minutes of charging.) We got home with 8% left, making it the closest to empty I think we've ever done. (We are also on 110V charging at home so to recharge back up to 80% took days.)
 
I did one time see the arrival SoC drop from 24% to 10% when I pulled over for a moment to re-secure the bike on the rack. It was at 24 when I hit Park and got out, and two minutes later when I selected Drive it was at 10. I had already passed the last supercharger on the trip. That surprised me and I was Not Happy.

But, thanks to some heavier than expected traffic, I got to see how slowing down "magically" improves range. Made it with 15% which was the lowest I had ever seen up to that point. Thankfully Dad let me install a 14-50 at their house so I knew I'd have charging available when I got there.
 
Well, apologies all around for my fuzzy math...That'll teach me not to round up/down. And thanks for all the edifying comments; I've learned a lot from them and from now having taken our 2000 mile trip. Which was long. And had many more stops than I would have preferred, but we are still in our learning curve with all this. We opted to only use Tesla charging stations for this trip and it seems that the stops are dictated by distance between (of course). Perhaps broadening our NAV to include other charge points would have made it easier, but we were nervous. Never encountered crowding and only one non-functioning unit (easily remedied by moving over one space).

All in all, the system worked and did a good job of correcting for traffic, etc. We did feel frustration that the Tesla chargers are so frequently well off the highway, unlike gas stations. Will we see a time when every Love's or Flying J or QT has reliable EV chargers? Loved the stops at the HyVee markets!
 
Well, apologies all around for my fuzzy math...That'll teach me not to round up/down. And thanks for all the edifying comments; I've learned a lot from them and from now having taken our 2000 mile trip. Which was long. And had many more stops than I would have preferred, but we are still in our learning curve with all this. We opted to only use Tesla charging stations for this trip and it seems that the stops are dictated by distance between (of course). Perhaps broadening our NAV to include other charge points would have made it easier, but we were nervous. Never encountered crowding and only one non-functioning unit (easily remedied by moving over one space).

All in all, the system worked and did a good job of correcting for traffic, etc. We did feel frustration that the Tesla chargers are so frequently well off the highway, unlike gas stations. Will we see a time when every Love's or Flying J or QT has reliable EV chargers? Loved the stops at the HyVee markets!

I think the answer is that over time the charging locations will be closer to highways. It seems that more companies want to host chargers, so there are more locations close to highways. My perception is that a lot of the out-of-the-way locations are a result of difficulty finding a willing host. So many of them are older.

PIlot/Flying J are adding chargers in a lot of places. They have a deal with GM, with EVGo to install a lot of chargers.

Also, the NEVI program requires that charging locations are within 1 mile of a highway exit, so any of those subsidized locations should be conveniently off the highway. And NEVI has $5B for fast chargers, so that's going to be a lot of locations.

NEVI also has an uptime requirement of more than 97%. While that's still 10 days of downtime per year, it is at least a requirement, and it is better than before, where chargers could be out of commission for months. NEVI also has many companies participating, which also means more competition. As the density of charging increases, customers will increasingly be able to vote with their electronic payment methods and stop at more reliable locations.

With the industry moving to NACS, even though the Federal NEVI rules only require CCS, many states have added additional requirement to include NACS, or strongly encourage NACS support, so there will be a lot more places where most Tesla owners can charge.
 
Wamoosh: I'm still curious which direction you traveled from Dallas. I've done FW-Denver 3 times, FW to Sarasota, FL 3 times, twice to Frederick, MD. I've not gone due west, north or south...yet. (Just returned from 3 days at Big Bend, driving my wife's 2019 Avalon...THAT trip would be a challenge for the Tesla, unless arrangements are made for charging at a campground...always crowded!)

You discovered it's a totally different traveling mindset. If I were 30 years younger, (NOT 69) I probably wouldn't be so tolerant of so many stops, but I find the SCs are perfectly spaced (2-2.5 hours) for power naps (15-20min), and I can travel 24 hours straight w/o feeling sleep deprived. I can also cruise at 75-80mph w/o any range anxiety.
 
Now, onto the next requirement: Not Running Dry Somewhere. That's not so much a factor on the East Coast, where it's getting to the point where if one throws a rock, hard, a few times, one will hit a Supercharger somewhere. But if one is starting off without a full charge, the NAV software is perfectly capable of figuring out where one would run dry and Strongly Suggesting that one stop short of the Run Dry location, or even detour somewhere (not as common as that used to be, thanks to Tesla's gangs of SC installers) in order Not To Run Dry. All this poking around the landscape is still subject to the idea of getting one somewhere as quickly as possible, so if the trip router can avoid detouring, it will do so.
I find that for day trips or any destination where I don't expect to be able to charge, it pays to program your round trip or add on the next destination, when navigating. That way the nav will plan to leave you with enough charge at your destination so that you can make to the next charging stop on the route rather than a minimal 10-15% like it generally does.

If you need to run around a bit at the destination, you can generally handle that by charging a little longer at the last charging stop.
 
Our destination was Minnesota. We had planned to take I-35 up through OKC but the NAV refused this route presumably because no Tesla SC close enough. After fighting with it, we took I-75 up through Tulsa and let the NAV guide us. Most of the time I had no idea where we were, not having studied that route. Probably more degrees of freedom if using other charging operators, but I think Elon needs to put more effort into making highway driving/charging more accessible.

We did see our first "in the wild" Cybertruck all the way up in Rochester. Driver had had it for one week and paid his deposit on "reveal day" for those who are counting.
 
Well, apologies all around for my fuzzy math...That'll teach me not to round up/down. And thanks for all the edifying comments; I've learned a lot from them and from now having taken our 2000 mile trip. Which was long. And had many more stops than I would have preferred, but we are still in our learning curve with all this. We opted to only use Tesla charging stations for this trip and it seems that the stops are dictated by distance between (of course). Perhaps broadening our NAV to include other charge points would have made it easier, but we were nervous. Never encountered crowding and only one non-functioning unit (easily remedied by moving over one space).

All in all, the system worked and did a good job of correcting for traffic, etc. We did feel frustration that the Tesla chargers are so frequently well off the highway, unlike gas stations. Will we see a time when every Love's or Flying J or QT has reliable EV chargers? Loved the stops at the HyVee markets!

Where I drive, I never need non Tesla stations, and don't want to put up with with the risk of the hassle with them (the few times I tried). The 3rd party stations are often non-functional, or difficult, or slow. Add the fact that they have fewer stalls compounds the risk of not having any usable one.

Once you learn the cars nuances you can override the computer to optimize your trip the way that you want.
-the battery meter uses hardcoded efficiency, which overshoots the range
-the trip computer uses specific local condition but also recent driving behavior, which can undershoot the range
-if you know your vehicle and driving habit enough, or familiar with 3rd party tools (like abrp), you can override computer and stretch out the legs to minimize stops
-if you want fastest time to destination, generally just drive as fast as possible
--the paradox is while this is less efficient and requires more frequent charging, the charging sessions are quicker
if there was a choice between arriving at station A w/ 20%, or stretching to station B w/ 5%, A allows you both a buffer and to drive more quickly (arriving at lower charge enables higher power charging). B might require driving slower than intended, which has the added psychological effect of dragging out the leg.
 
On March 12th we drove our 2021 MYP (w/19" snow tires on) 275 miles leaving the house with 100% and arriving back home with 10% remaining charge. This was all highway miles in Colorado most of it at 80mph, so stop and go traffic through Denver, Co. and a couple hours stopped w/ sentry mode running. I've got to say 275 miles on a single charge consuming 90% of the battery was pretty impressive to me.
Just a positive experience, that I don't think we see enough of, when discussing range.
 
A small addendum to our NAV experience: for grins I entered Dallas > OKC (shorter trip) and the system showed me a Tesla charging stations about 100 miles from home. Closer than the one it "forced" us to when entering the entire trip. So they system must be taking a broader view than what's closest. Kind of like your doctor looking at the whole patient. Presumably one could work around this by adding stops and forcing a chosen route that way.