Million EVs by 2015... What's an EV?

[richkae]

This isn't really my thought process but its a fun experiment anyway:

Leaf vs Volt flowchart:
1. Is it going to be your family's second car?
Yes = buy a Leaf. ( end, otherwise fall through ... )
2. Do you never need to drive more than 100 miles in a day?
Yes = buy a Leaf.
3. Do you rarely need to drive a little more than 100 miles in a day - and are there level 3 charging stations spaced no more than 80 miles apart everywhere you may go?
Yes = buy a Leaf.
4. A Volt is $7000 more than a Leaf. Is renting a car for the occasional long trips an option?
Yes = buy a Leaf.
5. Do you drive less than 40 miles per day the majority of days?
Yes = buy a Volt.
No = buy a Prius.

Model S vs Karma flowchart:
1. Is it going to be your family's second car?
Yes = buy a Model S.
2. Do you never need to drive more than 300 miles in a day?
Yes = buy a Model S.
3. Do you rarely need to drive more than 300 miles in a day - and are there level 3 charging stations spaced no more than 240 miles apart everywhere you may go?
Yes = buy a Model S.
4. A Karma is $30000-$40000 more than a Model S. Can you spend that money to put in your own charging stations where you want to go?
Yes = buy a Model S.
5. A Karma is $30000-$40000 more than a Model S. Is buying a second car an option?
Yes = buy a Model S and another car.
6. Do you drive less than 50 miles per day most days?
Yes = buy a Karma.
No = buy some less expensive and more efficient other vehicle.

 

[EVNow]

Leaf vs Volt flowchart:.

Here's mine ...

 

[Norbert]

4. A Karma is $30000-$40000 more than a Model S. Can you spend that money to put in your own charging stations where you want to go?
Yes = buy a Model S.

Exactly, we need a donate-a-fast-charger program which makes donating fast chargers tax-deductible. :smile:

 

[dpeilow]

Can we try to keep this thread on topic? It's been 90% Volt 10% Karma at the moment. What started as a valid comparison has veered off track. Volt stuff in the Volt thread please (where I already posted the green car list story).

 

[mattjs33]

This isn't really my thought process but its a fun experiment anyway:

Leaf vs Volt flowchart:
...

Okay then, I'll buy a Volt.

What a relief. The Leaf is ugly.

 

[richkae]

I included Volt vs Leaf as background for my Model S vs Karma flowchart.

Comparisons:
Performance: Model S is quicker ( 0-60 ) and just as fast ( top speed ).
Range: Model S at 300 miles range is actually superior to the Karma's 250 but the Karma can refuel in 5-10 mins vs Model S 45 minutes level 3 fast charge.
Handling: no way to know, but I bet the Model S will be incredibly nimble, it appears possible that it will be far superior to other luxury sedans due to the extremely low center of gravity.
Luxury & finish: I assume they will target the same level of luxury and finish ( No way to know until you can see both cars )

If the "luxury & finish" is the same then the only advantage the Karma has is the ability to refuel with gasoline - which only matters if there is no Level 3 charging where you want to go - but lets assume there is not.

(All prices without rebates.)
The Karma is priced between: $95900 for minimal and $117100 with all the listed priced options.

I expect a 300 mile Model S to be $68000 min - $80000 optioned and the 230 mile to be $63000 - $75000
( assuming a guessed $5000 premium for the 230 mile pack and a $10000 premium for the 300 mile pack and $12000 worth of options )

So I started thinking I can buy a lot of 240V 70amp chargers for a $30000 difference.
I could probably get 6-10 of them installed ( $2000 for the unit, and $1000 to $3000 for installation )

Now I am wondering how much my very own DC fast charge unit would cost me?

 

[dpeilow]

Now I am wondering how much my very own DC fast charge unit would cost me?

I read $10k for the Nissan charger, but I was told that a big ABB one was $26k with about the same again for the install.

 

[EVNow]

Range: Model S at 300 miles range is actually superior to the Karma's 250 but the Karma can refuel in 5-10 mins vs Model S 45 minutes level 3 fast charge.

It is not just a question of the speed to recharge. It is a question of ubiquity of gas stations compared to 2 L3 stations in the US currently (BTW, does Model S support CHAdeMO ?).

So I started thinking I can buy a lot of 240V 70amp chargers for a $30000 difference.
I could probably get 6-10 of them installed ( $2000 for the unit, and $1000 to $3000 for installation )

Now I am wondering how much my very own DC fast charge unit would cost me?

You can't install your own chargers unless you own property near the place you are going to visit.

L3 chargers require a lot of power and I expect each installtion to be about $50K.

 

[Norbert]

L3 chargers require a lot of power and I expect each installtion to be about $50K.

Because of the power? I'd be surprised if commercial users of maybe a 80 kW connection have to pay that much. Although I don't know.