Mission Motorcycles

[mhpr262]

I don't know ... building electric powertrains for other manufacturers was their original business before they even decided to produce their own motorcycle. AFAIK the motor of the Harley Livewire was made by Mission. Maybe they just suffered from a little temporary money shortage and will proceed with the motorcycle project when that has been weathered. Even Elon ran out of money while moving the cars to full production readiness.

The market for electric motors and controllers and similar EV stuff seems to be booming at the moment, only yesterdy I read a statement from the Brammo owner who said that supplying these parts to others was one of his fastest growing business branches, not his complete motorcycles.

 

[WarpedOne]

building electric powertrains for other manufacturers was their original business before they even decided to produce their own motorcycle.

Then why change their main site now when they're supposed to finally start shipping their flagship product?

AFAIK the motor of the Harley Livewire was made by Mission.

30 piece order. LiweWire is demonstration project without a direct follow-up product.

Even Elon ran out of money while moving the cars to full production readiness.

Elon did not run out of money and they didn't diversify during final push to bring roadsters into customers hand. In that time they even AXED side bussines like that Tesla Energy Group stuff.

The market for electric motors and controllers and similar EV stuff seems to be booming at the moment, only yesterdy I read a statement from the Brammo owner who said that supplying these parts to others was one of his fastest growing business branches, not his complete motorcycles.

Sure it is booming but booming enough to warrant delay to your own flagship project?

Writting on the wall says they don't have the funds to deliver the bike and must sell what they have already developed i.e. parts.

Focus, focus, focus.

 

[mhpr262]

Mission may be following a different strategy, just trying to play it safe for a few months, allowing their cash reserves to recover a bit with no-risk ventures.

I should have said Elon NEARLY ran out of money. It took balls to do what Elon did, with all his live savings at stake.

 

[rabar10]

They may be chasing continuous improvements -- something similar happened to Brammo with the Empulse. That bike was announced July 2010, then was delayed/redesigned over the next two years (different battery chemistry/packaging, different motor, added transmission, added J1772 charging,etc.) before officially re-announced in May 2012, and the first customer delivery made in December of that year.

The Mission saga has lasted a lot longer though... Mission One announced in 2009 and discontinued/cancelled in 2011, Mission R announced December 2010 and we're still waiting...

 

[mhpr262]

and we're still waiting...

Well, at least we have got the Lighting LS 218 ... they are accepting orders now so I hope it's closer to actual production.

Specifications - Lightning MotorcyclesLightning Motorcycles

 

[rabar10]

Well, at least we have got the Lighting LS 218

Still waiting on Mission, is what I meant.
There's a separate thread for the Lightning bike(s) and another few mentions over here.

 

[dsm363]

Well, at least we have got the Lighting LS 218 ... they are accepting orders now so I hope it's closer to actual production.

Specifications - Lightning MotorcyclesLightning Motorcycles


View attachment 58474

218 mph? Wow.

 

[protomech]

Here's what I don't understand.

Mission Motors designed the 2011 Mission R racebike and (I believe) the motor, motor controller, and battery system. They sell power trains and power train design expertise to OEMs (including Honda CR-Z prototype and Harley-Davidson Livewire prototypes). They target the following applications:
HEAVY EQUIPMENT
TRUCK AND BUS
POWERSPORTS
MOTORSPORTS
AUTOMOTIVE
SPECIALTY

Mission Motorcycles was formed to sell & support a production street bike adapted from the 2011 Mission R racebike, using the powertrain, charger, motor controller, and battery system designed by Mission Motors. It's not clear how much they are fundamentally changing the bike; notably the street bike switched to an AC Propulsion-type reductive charging scheme.

Now Mission Motorcycles is "plan[ning] to become one of the larger OEM suppliers of electric powertrains in the world."

That seems like a large overlap with what Mission Motors is doing, and (without any knowledge of the type of in-house expertise at Mission Electric) I don't see where Mission Electric adds value.

 

[mhpr262]

They probably just think they can make more money by selling powertrains to other players in the industry than by selling complete motorcycles. It is probably a lot easier too. It is a huge expense and pain in the behind to actually deal with end customers - just think what the showrooms, service centers, rangers, customer complaints, warranty repairs and fixes must be costing Tesla. It would be the same for a motorcycle, but with much less profit. Traditional motorcycle dealers can't be interested in electric bikes any more than autodealers are in cars, for the exact same reasons.

 

[protomech]

Asphalt & Rubber has some news that makes me feel a little better.

Mission Motorcycles Becomes Mission Electric, Boats Cars to Come, Mission R/RS Motos Delayed Until Q2/Q3 2015

From what our sources say, this move will mean that Mission Motorcycles and Mission Motors will once again become one entity — loyal readers will remember that Mission Motorcycles was*spun out of Mission Motors*two*years ago.

For those that have been following the Mission story, it is an interesting turn of events, though we hear that Mission Electric has some sizable funding behind it, which it will need in order to achieve the big plans the company plans to undertake.

 

[mhpr262]

That is good news. "Sizeable funding" and "overdeliver on the promises" sound good too.

Wahtever they do I hope they decide on one thing and then STICK with it for once ...

 

[lolachampcar]

Well, it took about six weeks to get most of my deposit back from Mission. I dropped Mark Seeger a note sharing my disappointment of getting $900 back out of a $1K deposit when it was Mission that failed to deliver. I will count myself lucky that I got the $900 back. This was his response-


"Bill you have made a point to express nothing but disapointment. $100 is the cancellation fee that we are charged for refunding the cash/processing payment

Please never contact me again. You have been the singular most disappointing contact I have yet had.


Enjoy your time


Mark "

 

[ecarfan]

That is an example of shockingly poor customer service.

 

[lolachampcar]

It is consistent with conversations I had with Mark leading up to my cancellation and one of the primary drivers for the cancellation.

 

[qwk]

Consider yourself lucky, with the constant delays, latest news, and a response like that, the writing is on the wall. It's too bad, because Mission seemed to be the motorcycle equivalent of Tesla.

 

[Hodginator]

Yeah, that is too bad. I really liked that bike and the tech that came with it. Sorry to hear about your bad experience.

 

[lolachampcar]

qwk,

Yea, Mark made the comment more than once how they were the Tesla of motorcycles and that he only wanted "true believers" for customers that were willing to put up with the "Kickstarter" effort.

I was thinking to myself, I know Musk and you sir are no Musk.

 

[mhpr262]

Oh wow, I wouldn't have believed it possible that a customer would be given such an answer. That's really burning one's bridges. Nowadays one has to know that such things can end up on the web and spread, especially in the pretty close knit EV enthusiast community. Not very professional IMHO. Seems like Mr. Seeger is pretty full of himself.
And "true believers", really? That doesn't quite sound like something a mentally healthy person would say ... more like something from the manic phase of bipolar disorder ...

I still hope something comes of the Mission Motorcycles effort, they really were cool looking bikes. I hope at least Lightning is still moving forward.

 

[lolachampcar]

I too hope they build that bike.
A few others have made the point that it would have been earth moving had they built it when they had the TTXGP win in 2011.
It would have been a phenomenal bike had they delivered this last summer like they promised.
IF, and that is a huge if, they deliver next summer like they are now promising, it will be an ok bike.

I just took delivery of a 2015 Zero SR. Zero moved from FastAce to KYB suspension and the bike feels wonderful. Power delivery is smooth and very consistent. The battery has also moved from an 11.4 KW-hr to a 12.5 Kw-hr.

Take the Zero core bits and put them in a S1000RR chassis and you have an extremely capable bike for a heck of a lot less than Mission wants for theirs. You would not have everything Mission is promising but you would have at least a four year track record of delivering and supporting large capacity battery packs which I have always considered the single largest risk of dealing with any of these entities. In short, it would be a compelling product and literally all the bits already exist today. Mission is wasting that huge lead they had.

 

[TEG]

(By request), Moved some Zero related posts to here:
Zero Motorcycles