Model 3 Performance Battery Degradation One Month (Story)

[EVDRVN]

For folks who maybe wondering though, just make a quick appointment and have sc do a quick battery check. They can run to make sure your car don’t have any recall and make sure the battery is ok for peace of mind. That is what warranty is for.

That's a time suck, you can call support and they can do it OTA.

 

[M109Rider]

For folks who maybe wondering though, just make a quick appointment and have sc do a quick battery check. They can run to make sure your car don’t have any recall and make sure the battery is ok for peace of mind. That is what warranty is for.

I don’t think that’s what the warranty is for.
It’s for legitimate warranty claims. Not piece of mind check ups that clog the service centres.
Do some research, and you should be able to determine if the battery needs service legitimately.

 

[ngogas]

That is bs. If you have concern just bring it in. Last I checked we paid for the car and it part of warranty. Use you best judgment. If things don’t look right have it checked out for your peace of mind. The rest is bs.

 

[SWUtah]

Another data point:. M3 is 7 moths old, 6700 total miles. I installed Tesla Stats app about 4 months ago. Since then, 100% SOC has gone up from 308 mlles to 311 miles (as measured and reported by Tesla Stats). Nice slow but consistent linear improvement

 

[ngogas]

Got a call back from SC and they ran a diagnostic over the air on my car battery logs. Battery has no recall and they confirmed it's a firmware issue they know about and they they are working on a fix and should be updated soon. I'm on beta v.9.

Like I said, peace of mind. If you feel like something isn't right; reach out to SC; warranty is for....

 

[Mikey122687]

 

[22522]

View attachment 403129

Is this for AWD?

 

[Mikey122687]

AWD

 

[EV-Tech Exp]

Having recently ordered a Model 3, I've been reading this thread and found it to be a great source of information. Having personally done a lot of work on battery degradation analysis, I thought it worth starting to comment rather than just lurking!

View attachment 376194 I now have 21,000 ‘s or 13,115 miles on my Model 3 AWD non performance. Had it about 4.5 months now.

Happy to see my SOC still showing no degradation.
At 90% SOC I’m at 449 km’s or 279 miles.

I haven’t run any tests to see if my actual range is 499km’s / 310miles, but I’m happy to see my SOC still strong anyway.

-I keep it at 90% all the time.
-Plug in at home every night on a HPWC.
-Use Superchargers maybe one a week.
-It’s kept outside 24/7, even on -22 celcius days.
-I always try to only charge when the battery is warmed up. Try..
-I’ve only gone below 20%, two or three times. Never below 15% yet.
-I’ve only charged to 100% maybe 3 times.

I’m always curious if others are seeing any degradation on the model 3 yet.
If so, any thoughts as to why ?

“ I do realize the battery will continually degrade, but I’m hoping it starts later rather than sooner. “

Sounds like a good battery care routine. Usually the cells will degrade a little more within the first 6-9 months, and subsequently stabilise, though of course, using a battery care routine as you do will help reduce overall degradation significantly.

I've been tracking my degradation since it felt like a lost some early on. I did a 100% charge last week and got to 475. I'm not worried about it yet but interesting that almost everyone I've talked to with a 3 hasn't seen any loss of range really.

Looking forward to the summer again to always have regen again and see the full range numbers. It was like 500 when I got the car in June.

Often the real capacity of the battery pack when new is slightly higher than the rated value, so some of the initial degradation is likely 'hidden' from the customer. Nevertheless, a positive sign re: Model 3 battery degradation.

Not necessarily true. Overwhelming experience with S is about 5% range degradation over first 12-18 months and little to none thereafter. I know 3 battery chemistry is different and not enough data tet, but don’t assume it will degrade either continually or linearly.

Absolutely correct. I recently created a Youtube video to explain battery degradation in depth, and in that video, I explain why we observe this behaviour.

Mods - I don't know whether it is acceptable to post one of my own youtube videos here (please remove if not acceptable).

I read on other Forums that there's a service bulletin out for some M3 P3D's. I haven't found what date range the cars were produced in that are impacted other than last fall. I too have noticed a degradation, nothing as significant as yours. Based on my rate of degradation it would reach its end of life (80% SoC) in about 4-1/2 years - far short of the 8 year warranty.

So this weekend i did short road trip and when charging at home in a garage at 33 F with a NEMA 14-50 charger the most i could get is 300 mi...after 30 mins and charge rate falling from 30mph to 4mph, i manually stopped the charge at 98% knowing that i'll be depleting the battery below 30% then using a Supercharger; it should do a reset. So ran the battery down to 22 & 21% and charged back to 80% time for each leg of the trip. Once at home I did a full charge; it stopped at 306 mi. Better than the 300 mi, but still not 310. By the time i went to work the next morning the SoC fell from 306 to 303 so now I'm down to 98%. Aside from this concern the car has performed wonderfully!

The rate of degradation should slow after the initial 6-9 months, so I wouldn't worry re: your comment about reaching end of life after 4 years.

Your description makes me think that you have some unbalanced cells, and may need to do a 100% charge, and hold for some time to enable cells to balance.

Thanks.
I suspect if you charge to 90%, and had a few runs that take you down to 20%, you would find you have no degradation.
Likely your batteries just need a little balancing.
The 100% charge will only really help balance the batteries if you then drive it down to about 20%. (This based on personal experience and other threads ).

Agreed.

 

[tomas]

Let’s PLEASE stop conflating balancing and calibration.

Balancing is something the battery management system does to make sure all of the cells are at matching capacity. It is done automatically by the BMS whenever you charge 90% or higher. You do not need to charge to 100% to balance cells. If your battery is unbalanced, it will affect both the displayed range and the actual capacity. But very little. Don’t jump through hoops to balance. Just make sure you charge 90% occasionally.

Calibration is running from high state of charge to low state of charge to “remind” your battery management where the edges are so it can estimate better. An out of calibration battery may display lower range, but actual battery capacity is unaffected. You do not need to charge to 100% to calibrate. A couple of runs from 90 to 30 will do fine.

Charging to 100% and or running down low, and especially letting battery sit at either extreme, is about the only thing you can do to ruin your battery. So don’t. And don’t tell others to!!

 

[Vines]

(EDIT For Typos, thanks MP3 Mike.)

Just charged to 90% today and my range is still dropping. My 90% number is 257 miles now at 19k miles.

I typically charge to 80%, today that was 229 miles, 3 days ago that was 237 miles

Once a week I run my battery down to about 20-30 miles left. Its been a month or so since I charged to 100%, maybe I will try that on Friday.

Extrapolated 100% number looks like 285 miles.

Should I be concerned?

 

[MP3Mike]

Just charged to 90% today and my range is still dropping. My 90% number is 285 miles now at 19k miles.

Should I be concerned?

That number looks great, is a typo? (That calculates to a 100% range of ~317 miles 7 past what it is rated at.)

I would say you should start charging to 90% normally and see how it goes.

 

[Vines]

That number looks great, is a typo? (That calculates to a 100% range of ~317 miles 7 past what it is rated at.)

I would say you should start charging to 90% normally and see how it goes.

Again With the typo, good catch thanks.

100% extrapolated number is 285 miles. Actual 90% charge number currently 257 miles.

 

[Tcpdumper]

Having a similar issue with rated range.
- never charged to 100%
- max charge at 90%
- charge practically everyday at work
- usually shallow discharges rarely below 40%
- 8557 on the odometer
- stats app says 296 rated range for P3D

 

[M109Rider]

View attachment 418442
Having a similar issue with rated range.
- never charged to 100%
- max charge at 90%
- charge practically everyday at work
- usually shallow discharges rarely below 40%
- 8557 on the odometer
- stats app says 296 rated range for P3D

Based on what I’ve seen from Posts, you’re usage is the perfect storm for poor calibration.
The battery may just need to be recalibrated.
Range is likely fine.

 

[Tcpdumper]

Based on what I’ve seen from Posts, you’re usage is the perfect storm for poor calibration.
The battery may just need to be recalibrated.
Range is likely fine.

So single digit discharge then 100%?

 

[M109Rider]

So single digit discharge then 100%?

I believe Elon said keep the battery at 90%, which it sounds like you do.
He then said (I believe) charge to 100% once a month then down to 20%

I’m not a fan of this. I feel it does more damage then good.
Here’s what I’ve found works well enough.

Keep it at 90%, which you do.
Once in a while, induce a road trip, where you charge to 90%-95% then back down to 15%-20%.
Even doing this once helps. If you do this twice in a row, you’ll see better results.
Good luck.

 

[alloverx]

I thought the old BMS needed to hit 94% to do its rebalance thing but it now can do it at almost any percentage/time per a technical thread I vaguely recall.

 

[rainforest]

I see people recommending draining low and charging to 90%, but nobody has mentioned that they have been successful at gaining back rated range. Has this worked for anybody?

 

[M109Rider]

I see people recommending draining low and charging to 90%, but nobody has mentioned that they have been successful at gaining back rated range. Has this worked for anybody?

I’ve only done this mostly on trips, or a few times up to 96% down to 10% or 20% and I see an increase in state of charge each time.
Not sure about actual range, because I’ve never gone from 100% to 0% to test the actual range.
State of charge then eventually goes back to about 97% or so.
I think if I did this once a month, the state of charge would maybe stay higher.
Since my state of charge rests at 97% - 98% I only get a percent or so more anyway.

I don’t make a mission out of ensuring my battery is calibrated. When I have the opportunity, I give it a go. We all know going to 100% isn’t ideal for the battery, (even if you drive right away). So doing this frequently isn’t a great idea.