Model S/X deliveries with Intel-based MCU

[HankLloydRight]

Or do what other manufacturers do, stockpile a bunch of chips before end-of-life.

It's not just about stockpiling chips.. I think a new V1 MCU retrofit module would also greatly reduce the complexity and cost of the existing board which was designed and built nearly a decade ago. Why continue to build something so outdated? Have you seen the MCU motherboard teardowns? It's a big board with lots of components, which I'm sure 10 years later has been massively consolidated into fewer chips and a smaller, easier to manufacture, motherboard.

I'm sure once we see a teardown of the Intel MCU, the motherboard will be much less complex. I'd think if Tesla were going to offer a V1 MCU retrofit down the road, they'd want to do the same thing, or even just use the same Intel board with the now deprecated inputs, outputs, and displays of the older cars. It's just going to take them time to engineer that.

This way, as they do release/develop more advanced software features, they can offer them to older cars with a drop-in Intel retrofit unit. If they price it right, say $2500-$3500 and use the old units as core exchanges (the touchscreen, display, case, and mounting hardware all likely can be reused in newer units, so they're not all just trashed), I'd bet they could turn the retrofit program into a profit center and make tens or hundreds of thousands of pre-Intel MCU owners very happy.

But I wouldn't expect that to happen for at least a year or two.

The counter argument is of course, never offer an MCU upgrade path and just force people to buy new cars. But that's not very customer friendly.

 

[HankLloydRight]

I thought on the old MCU the big screen was ok while driving, but IC should be while parked. I could be wrong. Also, from the latest reports the double thumb-wheel reboot seems to be disabled on the new MCU.

I've done both while driving. Not a problem. Sometimes I've rebooted the main screen while driving and that triggered and IC reboot also.

 

[number12]

If they price it right, say $2500-$3500 and use the old units as core exchanges (the touchscreen, display, case, and mounting hardware all likely can be reused in newer units, so they're not all just trashed)

If that is priced right. No one should accept delivery of old MCU if all they are forfeiting is $2500 deposit.

 

[BigD0g]

The counter argument is of course, never offer an MCU upgrade path and just force people to buy new cars. But that's not very customer friendly.

But that's the Tesla way! Not be quite and come get some more kool aide while it's nice and cold!

Let's be honest here folks, we know the following would be required:
New MCU
New Driver Side Mirror ( 5gtz antenna)
New Wiring Harness

Strongly suspected, but not confirmed (Where's MaxKw, tear apart that dash, super easy and non destructive):
New IC

Tesla's not going to offer this folks, it's just not going to happen. I do suspect however down the road that @wk057 could sell us upgrades down the road, once we get enough salvage cars.

 

[BigD0g]

If that is priced right. No one should accept delivery of old MCU if all they are forfeiting is $2500 deposit.

Nobody should accept a car delivered today or any day without the new MCU if you want it, it would cost you more then $2500 to retrofit it and frankly at this point I think a retrofit is highly unlikely, but I could be wrong.

 

[mdelrossi]

Nobody should accept a delivered today or any day without the new MCU if you want it, it would cost you more then $2500 to retrofit it.

I'm one of those expecting delivery of model mx75d, and it is confirmed by DS that missed the upgrades by days. I'm refusing delivery. just doesn't make sense to accept it.

 

[HankLloydRight]

Let's be honest here folks, we know the following would be required:
New MCU
New Driver Side Mirror ( 5gtz antenna)
New Wiring Harness

Strongly suspected, but not confirmed (Where's MaxKw, tear apart that dash, super easy and non destructive):
New IC

Not really. They can offer MCU upgrades in older cars without 5G wifi support or phone-as-key BT antennas. They can re-use the IC display (it's just an LCD panel afterall) without the separate submodule controlling it. Or keep the IC intact and drive it "the old way" via ethernet. And no new harness is needed, the goal would be to build a "drop in" MCU replacement.

I don't think anyone can say it will or won't happen. But it's definitely possible and not that hard.

If that is priced right. No one should accept delivery of old MCU if all they are forfeiting is $2500 deposit.

I was just throwing a number out there.. and by the time an MCU retrofit is ready (years from now) it's way past the point of anyone taking delivery this month during the short transition period.

 

[ILzappy]

Ah man....that stinks.

Makes me super worried about mine. Production 2/28 - 3/3. Trying to see if the DS can get me any clue of what MCU is installed.

Let me know what your DS says. my production dates are exactly the same as you. Either we got it..... or we missed it by 24 hours.

My car was originally supposed to go into production that Monday the 26th but it didn't. It ended up getting delayed until Wednesday the 28th to start...... so I am hoping that means it was because I was getting the new MCU.

I know my exact start and end dates per speaking with my DS.

 

[BigD0g]

Not really. They can offer MCU upgrades in older cars without 5G wifi support or phone-as-key BT antennas. They can re-use the IC display (it's just an LCD panel afterall) without the separate submodule controlling it. Or keep the IC intact and drive it "the old way" via ethernet. And no new harness is needed, the goal would be to build a "drop in" MCU replacement.

I don't think anyone can say it will or won't happen. But it's definitely possible and not that hard.

Very true, but not the Tesla way that we've seen. Not to mention the software update hell Tesla would have if some cars had some bits and not other bits. See the issues with the Model X with gen 1 sensors and gen 2 sensors failing software updates, it's just a PITA. Tesla needs all or nothing they can't have some piece of this and piece of that to support with future software updates, it's just not their model.

 

[Glap86]

Ordered 1/30
In transit for delivery 2/20
Model S P100D

Delivery appointment scheduled for tomorrow.

Having my DA check, but assuming it's the old MCU. Will refuse delivery if that's the case. I've waited for this baby for years. What's a few more months?

 

[HankLloydRight]

Very true, but not the Tesla way that we've seen. Not to mention the software update hell Tesla would have if some cars had some bits and not other bits. See the issues with the Model X with gen 1 sensors and gen 2 sensors failing software updates, it's just a PITA. Tesla needs all or nothing they can't have some piece of this and piece of that to support with future software updates, it's just not their model.

What? They do that now with hundreds of different parts and sensors (no AP, AP1, AP2, AP2.5, etc) and all MS/MX get the same firmware updates. And some of those cars have parking sensors and folding mirrors, and some don't. Cold weather package, ultra-hi-fi sound. Power/non power liftgages. The list goes on and on.

 

[BigD0g]

What? They do that now with hundreds of different parts and sensors (no AP, AP1, AP2, AP2.5, etc) and all MS/MX get the same firmware updates. And some of those cars have parking sensors and folding mirrors, and some don't. Cold weather package, ultra-hi-fi sound. Power/non power liftgages. The list goes on and on.

Yes, and they if statements all over their code for this crap , I'll still going with your not getting it from Tesla. granted I also thought there was. rear radar present, so let's not trust anything I say!

 

[HankLloydRight]

Tesla needs all or nothing they can't have some piece of this and piece of that to support with future software updates, it's just not their model.

But going forward now, they have to support two entirely different software branches -- Tegra and Intel.

So either they can either:

(1) Stop all development on the old platform and abandon all those customers who invested in Tesla early on, and only offer new features to Intel MCU customers.

(2) continue development on the old platform, but come on, what developer wants that crappy job?

Or

(3) they can sharpen their pencils and offer the Tegra customers an upgrade path, at an appropriate cost (say, under $5k).

 

[ABC2D]

I know my exact start and end dates per speaking with my DS

Those dates are not always accurate:

Are you sure it started production 3/2? If it is then why do you ask when it went into production? Check your driver door. There's a sticker with month / year indicating when it was produced. If you took delivery on 3/10 I'd assume it's produced in February.

I tracked my order every day on through the website and nagged on my Delivery Specialist. I tracked all the dates on the tracking spreadsheet here: Order Tracking Spreadsheet

Ordered: 1/25/2018
Confirmed: 1/27/2018
VIN:2/3/2018 (2453xx)
Prod Start: 3/2/2018
Prod End: 3/6/2018
Delivered: 3/10/2018

Door sticker shows 02/18 in upper left corner :'(

 

[BigD0g]

But going forward now, they have to support two entirely different software branches -- Tegra and Intel.

So either they can either:

(1) Stop all development on the old platform and abandon all those customers who invested in Tesla early on, and only offer new features to Intel MCU customers.

(2) continue development on the old platform, but come on, what developer wants that crappy job?

Or

(3) they can sharpen their pencils and offer the Tegra customers an upgrade path, at an appropriate cost (say, under $5k).

I'm going to wildly speculate now, but I think they are down to two branches now M3 and MCU2, and everyone else. The CID code for AP1, AP2 and AP2.5 is identifcal is just the bits they choose to run, I would not be shocked to find something similar with M3 / MCU2 as that will be the "new" platform going forward, so only 2 branches.

 

[kak1154]

Nobody should accept a car delivered today or any day without the new MCU if you want it, it would cost you more then $2500 to retrofit it and frankly at this point I think a retrofit is highly unlikely, but I could be wrong.

Unless it also means you lose $3,750 on the tax credit. Now you're talking $6,250. That's the decision I'm facing, delivery on 3/20.

 

[viper2ko]

I'm going to wildly speculate now, but I think they are down to two branches now M3 and MCU2, and everyone else. The CID code for AP1, AP2 and AP2.5 is identifcal is just the bits they choose to run, I would not be shocked to find something similar with M3 / MCU2 as that will be the "new" platform going forward, so only 2 branches.

Agreed. We may see minor updates to the Tegra branch. But new features, major upgrades will only be for the intel MCUs. My biggest fear is that they realized they had to upgrade the Tegra to make good on all the promises.

 

[viper2ko]

Unless it also means you lose $3,750 on the tax credit. Now you're talking $6,250. That's the decision I'm facing, delivery on 3/20.

I think youll get the full 7500. When was your car produced

 

[pkodali]

Agreed. We may see minor updates to the Tegra branch. But new features, major upgrades will only be for the intel MCUs. My biggest fear is that they realized they had to upgrade the Tegra to make good on all the promises.

If they promised the features to existing owners, doesn't that mean that they at the very least have to offer some sort of path to upgrade the mcu?

 

[BigD0g]

Unless it also means you lose $3,750 on the tax credit. Now you're talking $6,250. That's the decision I'm facing, delivery on 3/20.

Sure, if you think Tesla hits 200k deliveries locally this quarter, or is the a CT rebate your speaking to? Remember even when they hit 200k you still get 3 more months of 100% rebate.