Nissan wants Tesla Model 3 reservation holders to buy LEAFs, launches new ad campaign

[ggies07]

This is hilarious. hahahaha.

Nissan wants Tesla Model 3 reservation holders to buy LEAFs, launches new ad campaign

 

[flankspeed8]

nice try Nissan....but lame!

 

[McRat]

I don't think Nissan understands. Tesla received more reservations BEFORE the press conference than Nissan Leafs sell in a year.

People do not care what a Model 3 is. They want one. Not a lot you can do about that. If Model 3 buyers actually wanted an EV, they can buy brand new ones for under $10,000 total price today. So it isn't EV, it isn't price, it isn't features, it isn't the styling. They want the badging. The badging was the only thing they knew about the car when they ordered 100,000 of them.

 

[ChadS]

I think it's a great idea. Obviously a 107-mile LEAF won't work for everybody, and that's partly why so many people put a deposit on the 3. But it will work for quite a few of those people (and it really is a very nice car if you can live with the range and looks), they just haven't bothered to really think about it yet - as is becoming clear from a research project I am doing, an awful lot of what is keeping people from buying PEVs is that so far they have simply put zero thought in to it. They might look in to whether they could lease a LEAF until the 3 is available. Some of them might stick with Nissan, especially if the 2nd-gen LEAF (which Nissan doesn't want to make a big deal about yet) comes out before the 3, looks better than the 1st-gen, has a lot of driving assist tech, and has ~200 miles of range. I think the chances are very good that will happen.

At least Nissan is trying to actually get PEVs on the road, unlike some other companies that either bad-mouth them, or relentlessly tout cars that nobody can actually buy at the cost of any sales today. (True that Tesla has made a big deal of a car you can't buy yet, and I do have a few mixed feelings about it but their situation and motivations are different).

 

[ChadS]

The badging was the only thing they knew about the car when they ordered 100,000 of them.

They also knew the rough price and range (and of course that it was an EV, will likely have a lot of tech, and is made in the US), so I wouldn't dismiss those as factors for some.

 

[ggies07]

I think it's a great idea. Obviously a 107-mile LEAF won't work for everybody, and that's partly why so many people put a deposit on the 3. But it will work for quite a few of those people (and it really is a very nice car if you can live with the range and looks), they just haven't bothered to really think about it yet - as is becoming clear from a research project I am doing, an awful lot of what is keeping people from buying PEVs is that so far they have simply put zero thought in to it. They might look in to whether they could lease a LEAF until the 3 is available. Some of them might stick with Nissan, especially if the 2nd-gen LEAF (which Nissan doesn't want to make a big deal about yet) comes out before the 3, looks better than the 1st-gen, has a lot of driving assist tech, and has ~200 miles of range. I think the chances are very good that will happen.

At least Nissan is trying to actually get PEVs on the road, unlike some other companies that either bad-mouth them, or relentlessly tout cars that nobody can actually buy at the cost of any sales today. (True that Tesla has made a big deal of a car you can't buy yet, and I do have a few mixed feelings about it but their situation and motivations are different).

It would be different if the LEAF had the same range and style and perks, but it does not. Therefore, this is a very laughable marketing moment. If someone wanted an EV now and the LEAF met their needs, they would have already bought one and not signed up.

 

[S'toon]

This smells like desperation to me.

 

[mspohr]

It would be different if the LEAF had the same range and style and perks, but it does not. Therefore, this is a very laughable marketing moment. If someone wanted an EV now and the LEAF met their needs, they would have already bought one and not signed up.

I think we should give them an "A" for effort (at least in the marketing department, if not car design).

 

[BluestarE3]

A better ad would have been: "While waiting for the car of your dreams, why not lease a Nissan Leaf so you can join the EV revolution now? Great deals on 2 and 3 years leases available now from your local Nissan dealer."

 

[ChadS]

If someone wanted an EV now and the LEAF met their needs, they would have already bought one and not signed up.

That is only true if they had given it any thought. The LEAF meets many people's needs, they simply have not thought about it. (I have been reading hundreds of studies about PEV adoption, and when they talk about awareness, it is usually in the single digits).

Consumer Reports and the Union of Concerned Scientists did a survey last year. They found that 42% of Americans could use one of today's PEVs without giving up anything. These are people that already have a place to plug in a car, wouldn't need any public charging, already drive a similar size/price car, don't need to tow, or haul big things, or carry more than 4 passengers. That number includes PHEVs like the Volt, but when they asked if they had a current car that NEVER went beyond X miles of range...it turns out that about half of those people could use the 84-mile LEAF.

So there is about 20% of the US population that could easily buy a gen-1 LEAF without changing anything. It's cheap, convenient, and a nice car to drive. Owners love them (not as much as Tesla owners, but still). But most of the US population has still not even SEEN a LEAF, and if they've even heard of it (the majority of the population can't name a single PEV), they assume it is smaller, slower, less fun to drive, and more expensive than it is. It is true that not everybody will pick it anyway; some don't like the looks, some don't like the brand, etc. But the LEAF meets the needs of a LOT of people that have not bought one yet. Campaigns to get more people to think about it are exactly what we need.

 

[kort677]

I think it's a great idea. Obviously a 107-mile LEAF won't work for everybody,

let me correct you, in reality under normal driving you can expect a little more than 72 miles of range from the car, 107 if you never exceed 35mph is possible, factor in cold, wind or range and ranges take a big hit. After using your 70+ miles of range without chademo charging, using L2 charging
you're down for 6+ hours to recharge.
this might work well for people who have well defined travel patterns, commuting for example. I am not ragging on the LEAF, I owned one, but for many people 70+ miles or range
just doesn't cut it.

 

[ChadS]

Thanks, I am indeed aware of the factors that affect range. And I have owned a PEV with similar range (at a time when there was NO public charging). I said 107-miles because that is the EPA rating; it's the easiest way to refer to range in any PEV. Short-range BEVs indeed don't work for everybody (in fact I excluded 80%) but it works for an awful lot more people than are buying the cars.

 

[stopcrazypp]

I didn't expect an ad campaign like this from Nissan; usually they avoid challenging Tesla. However, the reaction from the media and people in comments seems to be ridicule. The current Leaf simply isn't comparable to the Model 3.

 

[stopcrazypp]

People do not care what a Model 3 is. They want one. Not a lot you can do about that. If Model 3 buyers actually wanted an EV, they can buy brand new ones for under $10,000 total price today. So it isn't EV, it isn't price, it isn't features, it isn't the styling. They want the badging. The badging was the only thing they knew about the car when they ordered 100,000 of them.

I don't agree that they knew nothing. They knew it would have more than 200 miles of EPA range, start at $35k, and would be a 3 series competitor. And based on the track record of Tesla, they knew the styling would likely be sleek and that it would likely support superchargers and autopilot (even if optional). The car unveiled did not disappoint those expectations (the major sticking points seemed to be the trunk vs hatchback, lack of dash, and front bumper design, but not enough to be deal breakers).

 

[S'toon]

That is only true if they had given it any thought. The LEAF meets many people's needs, they simply have not thought about it. (I have been reading hundreds of studies about PEV adoption, and when they talk about awareness, it is usually in the single digits).

Consumer Reports and the Union of Concerned Scientists did a survey last year. They found that 42% of Americans could use one of today's PEVs without giving up anything. These are people that already have a place to plug in a car, and already drive a similar size/price car, don't need to tow, or haul big things, or carry more than 4 passengers. That number includes PHEVs like the Volt, but when they asked if they had a current car that NEVER went beyond X miles of range...it turns out that about half of those people could use the 84-mile LEAF.

So there is about 20% of the US population that could easily buy a gen-1 LEAF without changing anything. It's cheap, convenient, and a nice car to drive. Owners love them (not as much as Tesla owners, but still). But most of the US population has still not even SEEN a LEAF, and if they've even heard of it, they assume it is a slower, less fun to drive, and more expensive than it is. It is true that not everybody will pick it anyway; some don't like the looks, some don't like the brand, etc. But the LEAF meets the needs of a LOT of people that have not bought one yet. Campaign to get more people to think about it are exactly what we need.

Not really cheap for what you get. It's approaching the Bolt and the 3 in price, for much less capability.

 

[McRat]

I don't agree that they knew nothing. They knew it would have more than 200 miles of EPA range, start at $35k, and would be a 3 series competitor. And based on the track record of Tesla, they knew the styling would likely be sleek and that it would likely support superchargers and autopilot (even if optional). The car unveiled did not disappoint those expectations (the major sticking points seemed to be the trunk vs hatchback, lack of dash, and front bumper design, but not enough to be deal breakers).

Sort of. 200 miles? No, 215+. Styling? Size? Number of doors? Hatchback? Horsepower? Battery size? Seating? Supercharging? Autopilot? RWD/FWD/AWD? Most the answerable questions were not firm until the presentation, and still nobody really knows what the Model 3 metrics are.

 

[kort677]

Thanks, I am indeed aware of the factors that affect range. I said 107-miles because that is the EPA rating; it's the easiest way to refer to range in any PEV. 107 indeed doesn't work for everybody (in fact I excluded 80%) but it works for an awful lot more people than are buying the cars.

I think that you missed the point that 107 range is not a real world number. Just like a Tesla claims almost 300 miles in a s90d I can assure you that in "normal" driving you'll never see 300 mile range, unless you never exceed local road speeds.
have you ever driven/owned a LEAF?

 

[mspohr]

let me correct you, in reality under normal driving you can expect a little more than 72 miles of range from the car, 107 if you never exceed 35mph is possible, factor in cold, wind or range and ranges take a big hit. After using your 70+ miles of range without chademo charging, using L2 charging
you're down for 6+ hours to recharge.
this might work well for people who have well defined travel patterns, commuting for example. I am not ragging on the LEAF, I owned one, but for many people 70+ miles or range
just doesn't cut it.

I have a friend who bought a Leaf a few years ago. He loves it. Great performance and it meets all of his daily driving needs. (Of course, it doesn't have the range and Supercharging for long distance travel, but other than that, it's great.)

 

[ChadS]

I think that you missed the point that 107 range is not a real world number. Just like a Tesla claims almost 300 miles in a s90d I can assure you that in "normal" driving you'll never see 300 mile range, unless you never exceed local road speeds.
have you ever driven/owned a LEAF?

I did not miss that point; which I guess would have been clearer if I had not started my last sentence with "107" again. I changed it. I do know what the real world numbers are (did you click on my link?), and I (and the study) accounted for it.

My father and two of my best friends have a LEAF based on my advice. I am active in the local LEAF group and personally know a few dozen owners and have interacted with many more in local and national LEAF groups. I had a 2003 RAV4-EV for four years that was a fairly similar car in terms of size and range.

 

[ChadS]

Not really cheap for what you get. It's approaching the Bolt and the 3 in price, for much less capability.

I agree the current LEAF, at the current price, will have a problem when the Bolt and T3 are available. But I meant today, not in the future. For some owners, the LEAF is a "free" car, because gas savings is more than the lease payment - can't get any cheaper than that in a car you can buy today.