Overpaid for FSD, No Early Access - Class Action Time?

[Az_Rael]

Does the restaurant owe you money?

Ah, but I DID get a burger and fries to enjoy. If I had bought a ticket for future burgers and fries then came in the next day and the price was $1 lower, I might want a refund of that dollar since I haven’t actually received any burgers or fries yet.

Sure, I guess the airline industry uses that type of pricing model (you can’t get a refund on the purchase of your flight), but at least they DO (mostly) deliver a plane ride on the agreed upon date and time, and you do get credit back should they not hold up their end of the bargain.

Telsa gets to hold my money for some undetermined timeframe, not deliver anything to date, and I don’t get to decide when I am out and get my $$ back. You could argue that their CEOs twitter account even engaged in some questionable tactics by talking about 6 month timelines, end of 2017 coast to coast drives, AND that very misleading 2016 video showing off the system we were purchasing. That WAS a pretty cool video. That might qualify as false advertising considering how prominently it was displayed on the website

Edit: oh, I forgot that lovely statement that my 2017 car had all the hardware it needed for FSD. Turns out that was not correct either. I might have held off on my FSD purchase had I known the car I was buying did not have all the hardware required at the time.

 

[kbecks13]

Ah, but I DID get a burger and fries to enjoy. If I had bought a ticket for future burgers and fries then came in the next day and the price was $1 lower, I might want a refund of that dollar since I haven’t actually received any burgers or fries yet.

Did they actually deliver FSD features prior to March 2019 though? I placed a pre-order for burgers and fries and they would not allow me to cancel that and reorder at a new, cheaper price.

False advertising is generally litigated on the idea of making a false claim to induce a sale.

Yup, i ordered FSD with the car only because they said we would get HW3 and i reasoned it would be out within the next 12-18 months. They also said it would cost a significant percent more post-delivery, meaning unless you could beat that % in some investment it would be prudent to pre-pay for FSD - so i did. They mislead me into paying and then reduced the price later and did not allow me to cancel a pre-order to gain the new pre-order price.

 

[Az_Rael]

Did they actually deliver FSD features prior to March 2019 though?

Zero FSD features have been delivered to date. All current features released have also been delivered to folks that bought EAP only. We could have saved $3k and still had the exact same car and features to enjoy today.

 

[OCR1]

I always understood FSD to be an investment in a future product which may or may not fully materialize. We bought FSD on our 2018 Model 3 when they had the $2K sale. I understood we may be throwing $2K out the window by doing this and I was OK with that decision. To date we have not received any value from the FSD upgrade since we already had EAP.

I understand the OP’s frustration. I find many things about Tesla to be frustrating. They are a horribly dysfunctional company with an eccentric CEO who makes all kinds of wild statements. Does anyone really believe there will be a fleet of a million robotaxis in the next 24 months?

So I think you have to go into a purchasing decision with Tesla understanding what you are getting yourself into. In exchange for getting an absolutely amazing car that nobody can compete with you have to accept the abysmal customer service, erratic decision making, inconsistent and constantly changing customer service policies, and at times a complete inability to reach a live person at the company.

It’s not for everyone, but at this point I don’t think a class action lawsuit would accomplish anything. Be cautious about anything you buy from this company. Do your research and learn from others and only buy if you fully understand what you are getting yourself into.

I’m not a Tesla loyalist. Just a realist. I want to drive an amazing EV with great range and I did not want to spend more than $50K to do so. If the day comes when other companies can provide a car that offers better value than Tesla I will have no problem leaving them behind.

 

[Ptheven]

Wait...are you guys the same person?

Not quite. My idiot brother left himself logged in on my laptop apparently.

 

[run-the-joules]

Not quite. My idiot brother left himself logged in on my laptop apparently.

I was just giving you an opportunity to see what it's like to be the better son.

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

This threads delivers.

 

[MovedOn121]

I had enough referrals for the old early access program and then bought fsd. I really don't think it's a thing. Friend and I get updates around the same time but in the end who really cares? I just got 36.2.1.

 

[run-the-joules]

I had enough referrals for the old early access program and then bought fsd. I really don't think it's a thing. Friend and I get updates around the same time but in the end who really cares? I just got 36.2.1.

That was not the same as early access program. Some sort of vague priority thing.

 

[ftlum]

What makes me mad is that no FSD product has been delivered (there’s still no difference between EAP and FSD) and the price went down despite Tesla pressuring people to buy FSD by saying the price would go up if you waited. What they did said was exactly the opposite of what happened. Since no FSD product actually existed at the time of the price cut, previous buyers should have been given the same price via a rebate. You can’t say it’s the price you pay for being an early adopter since no product was actually received to use/ adopt. Musk even admitted he was wrong to drop the price like that.

Also, the people who paid early for FSD did so during Tesla’s greatest time of need, when Elon was betting the company. We were the ones who helped them survive and should not be dismissed as whiners. People who were able to get FSD for cheap in 2019 were able to do so in part because we helped the company make it through Q3 2018.

I’m realistic enough to know a rebate will never happen but that doesn’t make me any less salty and these sort of pricing shenanigans are literally why I don’t have a 2nd Tesla, so they’ve lost more money from me than they saved.

I have no desire to be in the true beta tester program, however Tesla could go a long way in removing all that salt if they let me upgrade my AWD to a P- . I passed on the P because before the P’s rebate (this was the precedent they set)— it would not have been affordable. I’d even pay to do the P- upgrade (which by several anecdotal accounts is possible for at least the pre2019 AWDs), so they’d be actually making money from me. It’d cost them nothing and restore a lot of good will for me.

 

[toolman335]

I can't figure out why anyone would buy FSD. Our grand-kids might see it come to fruition in 30 years.

 

[robarino]

Appreciate your comments (a bunch), I'm definitely worked up and pretty frustrated about this and am using this post to gauge community feeling. I realize there are the super strong defenders of Tesla, but this really does seem quite different than the typical price change complaints since they said it would cost more post delivery.

I think we can all agree they were insinuating it would always cost more if ordered post delivery to motivate people to buy it up front (and it got me!).

If price changes happen all the time, how come people who ordered FSD in March of 2019 were given refunds? They got what they paid for right?

Then when they offered early access I got my hopes up AGAIN of being made whole, but alas...

Honestly I agree with you. I’m a satisfied owner, would never give this car back, but Elon and Tesla need to be held to some ethical standards. Of their whole schtik wasn’t no negotiation, the price is the price, then we can compare the pricing model to the typical car dealers. For this reason when Tesla lowers the price for purchasers after they pick up theirs cars, we have a right to feel the sting.
when the company CEO says via Twitter that as compensation those who bought fsd before a certain date would get compensation in the form of early access, thats a verbal agreement (non binding of course).
I think OP is frustrated, as are many of us. I just don’t appreciate being misled, lied to and essentially bullied from members of this forum and others from speaking their minds.
When a CEO says certain things will get done, we want to believe we can trust them.
Elon is a pathological liar. I understand and appreciate his good intent and I love his products, but he needs to be held accountable for his promises.


Look, we are just as passionate about our Tesla’s as those that disagree with the OP. But I do not believe we should be attacking OP or anyone that matter that disagrees. Telling people to sell their car is a ridiculous retort that doesn’t further the discussion.
We are all just giving material to the jerks on the RealTesla forum.

 

[C141medic]

have essentially zero belief they're going to upgrade our computers

Haven’t they already done a few HW3 upgrades to 2.5 vehicles with FSD? It would truly suck if this didn’t happen. I remain hopeful.

 

[Matt L]

So if someone promises you something and then fails to give it to you, you're a "cry baby" for asking for what was promised to you? Ok got it, sorry i am not drinking the kool-aid and bending over for them.

What was “promised” and by when?

so you do feel entitled?

 

[arghx7]

I used to process class action settlement checks when I was an intern at an investment management firm. The lawyers take all the money. Don't waste your time, unless you want a $17 dollar check in 5 years.

And yes, I paid $6k for FSD (AP was standard).

 

[ChargedSociety]

Let's say FSD was ready to go, it comes out, and it's an incredible game-changing technology. Overnight the demand for FSD goes through the roof. Everyone wants it. Tesla ups the price by 100% because they can. Then would a thread like this exist?

You paid to future proof your car, and that potential is still there. It seems a bit silly to get hostile towards the price because, ultimately, a completely revolutionary technology that has never existed before isn't happening soon enough for you. If you were willing to gamble your money on the technology coming to fruition, it seems to me that it was your choice alone.

Companies can charge what they wish for products and services; it is up to you the consumer to decide whether you want to purchase that product or not. Good for them to refund people in the past, but just because they did it for some, I'm not sure it means they have to do it retroactively for everyone. Where do you draw the line? It's hard to come up with other examples solely because we don't watch most other companies under a microscope like we do with Tesla but I'm a million percent sure that people pay varying prices for the same products regularly.

It seems to me Tesla has come through with their threats that the FSD package will rise in price, they just upped it, and I'm sure they will raise it again. When people are complaining that they paid more than you, should they be entitled to a refund because you got a better deal by purchasing it earlier?

Regardless of what Elon has said, he is the same as any other Entrepreneur trying to raise capital for a new product. I'm not saying it's ok to lie, but we all know that most individuals put in this position will perhaps stretch the truth. Do you think Shark Tank would be as exciting to watch if everyone that went in there had realistic expectations? It's up to the guy holding the money to determine what is snake oil and what is investable.

I did not buy FSD but not because I don't believe in Tesla. I think they'll get there despite how glitchy AP can be; I'm extremely confident they will get it worked through, and this tech will come to life. I am not optimistic about regulators allowing it on the roads within a timeline that makes sense in the scheme of how long I plan to own this car.