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P3D+ Second Track Day - thoughts
- Thread starter Nocturnal
- Start date
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Regen generates heat. Charging the battery isn't 100% efficient and the drive unit isn't 100% efficient.
That heat shouldn't transfer to the drive unit. (indirectly through the coolant system I guess)
How would it not, the drive unit is what is regenerating the power! The drive unit essentially turns into a generator which is not 100% efficient and would generate heat just the same as it does during power output.
I enjoyed a HPDE track weekend in the 3P+ (I've spent a decent amount of time on tracks - I stopped counting around 100 days of track experience)
A few points I thought might be helpful to those thinking of tracking their cars:
Tips:
For those of us with PUO brakes, the RWD wheels are 5mm further out than ours due to the thicker rotor hats.
Assuming that the MPP setup is close to rubbing on the inside we'd either have to run a 5mm spacer on +35 wheels to match the MPP setup. Or we could do a 10mm narrower tire on a slightly narrower wheel such as a 19x9.5 +35 with 265/35R19 RE-71R to keep the factory scrub radius.
A few points I thought might be helpful to those thinking of tracking their cars:
- I went out in a completely stock 3P+ (stock brakes / brake fluid / 20" Pilot Sport 4S)
- Temps were around 90-95 deg F
- My car used ~700 Wh / mi for the 20 - 30 minute sessions (3 x 20 min sessions and 1 x 30 min session scheduled per day)
- Power was noticeably lower by lap 5 or so. My experience regarding the power step down agrees with @Nocturnal Still fun but much more of a momentum car. The longest session was about 35 minutes of driving. The main straight was ~115mph early and I'd only do 100mph on the straight after heat soak began. (I was staying out of the throttle on the straight to have more power through the turns in the infield.)
- The brakes did get a little soft but never failed on a 1.6 mile track (following cars noted the puff of brake dust under hard braking and said the brakes smelled hot though not concerningly hot)
- I used approximately 5mm of rear pad (this is an eyeball guess assuming they start with 15mm - I have not yet measured)
- The car was very neutral. It had just a hint of understeer but that was easy to handle in the sharp turns with a slight lift of the throttle or tap of the brake (or slight trail brake) to get the car to rotate.
- Stability control was flashing on every turn. I could *not* feel the stability intrusion but was told the light on the dash was flashing every turn. Oddly on the highest speed turn of the track (on a banked oval) at exactly 80mph I felt the stability control every lap. (Perhaps 80mph coincided with the lateral acceleration or perhaps 80mph meant something in the software?) Either way I could feel the car give a tiny twitch in the back end as the light came on. I went many sessions not realizing the stability control indicator existed but eventually I took an observant passenger along.
- Pilot Sport 4S tires are very nice predictable street tires - not as fun as more track oriented R-compounds but certainly good enough to have a great time! The tires got hot enough that the tread started curling towards the outside of the contact patch.
- The Model 3P+ was slower overall than track prepped cars. (In the advanced run groups few people show up with a full street setup.) Curious how much track mode would improve the experience.
Tips:
- Create a profile named "Track" and adjust seat position settings, collision warnings, etc.
- Used a Post-IT note to remind to turn off the automatic braking before each session (per the rules of the event)
- After each session put the car in Tow mode to disengage the automatic parking brakes (and chock the wheels to prevent rolling)
For those of us with PUO brakes, the RWD wheels are 5mm further out than ours due to the thicker rotor hats.
Assuming that the MPP setup is close to rubbing on the inside we'd either have to run a 5mm spacer on +35 wheels to match the MPP setup. Or we could do a 10mm narrower tire on a slightly narrower wheel such as a 19x9.5 +35 with 265/35R19 RE-71R to keep the factory scrub radius.
Last edited:
Awesome write up, thank you! I just purchased some 19x9.5 +33 with 265/35/R19 for my P3D+ which is close to the stock set-up and about .100" further from suspension that what MPP is running (including adjustments for rotor thickness). Scrub radius would change slightly, but less than how it has changed with MPP's RWD car.
You're welcome.
That sounds like a nice wheel setup. Where and what did you get? (Yes, your scrub radius is only 2mm more than stock whereas MPP was 5mm more than stock.) The fact that MPP isn't complaining about the handling characteristics of the increased scrub radius is a great sign. I take it to mean that the differences are very slight and that we can choose either and be happy.
The Titan 7 wheels with 19x10 +30 (or 19x10 + 35 with 5mm spacer) or 19x9.5 +35 would be nice. Maybe someone should call.
(My preference is to skip spacers and get the 19x9.5 +35mm though if we go with upcoming aftermarket 2 piece rotors we could use the 19x10 +35mm - heck we can probably use the x10 either way - would be nice if someone would try it out on the PUO)
During the Speed Academy Hot Lap yesterday, the host Dave managed to hit our fender with the LF tire, we will need to raise the front of our car a little more to make sure it doesn't happen again. I can't tell people it fits perfectly anymore! We are surprised because the setup never changed for the last 2 track days and this tire contact only happened this time!
Model 3....
The charger is what's in the car. It can do 48A.
The Gen2 connector is the cable w/box and adapters. It can do 32A.
As you noted with a Gen1 connector, you can use the full 40A of a 14-50 plug.
With HPWC, a Model 3 will use up to 48A.
Alright time for my track experience - I visited Buttonwillow Raceway and did 5x sessions as part of Tesla Corsa's inaugural event (more to come on that soon, amazing event that deserves its own thread) and was actually fairly surprised with the P3D+ abilities.
I had almost the exact same experience with laps 1-2 having full power (sometimes 3) and then falling down to 80-90% for the rest. After discussing with the group and doing some experiments, it appears that turning regen from standard to low actually helps reduce heat input to the car and lets you go longer before hitting power fade. This, of course, comes with the trade-off that you must brake 0.1g harder which simply moves that heat to the brakes instead. This didn't seem to be a problem for me as my brakes are in great shape and did well (totally stock) though i'm not the hardest braking person in the world (yet).
Overall the car was really great to drive and i had an amazing time, even when being power limited. In fact, being power limited actually seems to be a good thing as it really lets you focus on driving smooth and improving your line. My best time of the day was a 2:18 and i was still able to get a 2:20 on my last lap of one session.
Some areas of improvement/potential ways to waste more money: The stock suspension is surprisingly soft for the performance package and likely needs at least new springs and potentially coilovers to really maximize capability. The stock tires, while made of a great compound (Pilot Sport 4S), seem a bit too narrow for such a heavy car and hurt your ability to carry speed through turns so i'm definitely looking forward to getting 9.5" wide wheels (+1") and 265 tires for the next track day. These upgrades are definitely not necessary, but could make the car even more fun.
I had almost the exact same experience with laps 1-2 having full power (sometimes 3) and then falling down to 80-90% for the rest. After discussing with the group and doing some experiments, it appears that turning regen from standard to low actually helps reduce heat input to the car and lets you go longer before hitting power fade. This, of course, comes with the trade-off that you must brake 0.1g harder which simply moves that heat to the brakes instead. This didn't seem to be a problem for me as my brakes are in great shape and did well (totally stock) though i'm not the hardest braking person in the world (yet).
Overall the car was really great to drive and i had an amazing time, even when being power limited. In fact, being power limited actually seems to be a good thing as it really lets you focus on driving smooth and improving your line. My best time of the day was a 2:18 and i was still able to get a 2:20 on my last lap of one session.
Some areas of improvement/potential ways to waste more money: The stock suspension is surprisingly soft for the performance package and likely needs at least new springs and potentially coilovers to really maximize capability. The stock tires, while made of a great compound (Pilot Sport 4S), seem a bit too narrow for such a heavy car and hurt your ability to carry speed through turns so i'm definitely looking forward to getting 9.5" wide wheels (+1") and 265 tires for the next track day. These upgrades are definitely not necessary, but could make the car even more fun.
Lucky13
Member
Basically it's a Tesla get together, but at a racetrack where you spend a day with a bunch of other Tesla enthusiasts and go for 15 minute sessions out on the track with only electric cars. You take an hour break or so in between sessions (it goes by quick) and also have a longer break for supercharging and lunch.
It's pretty cool as you're at a track with tons of other cars of all sorts (from civic to LMP3 car) who are also running sessions in between yours and you can get out on the track without any pressure as you're guaranteed to be with similar people in the same car as you. You don't have to go incredibly fast, but you can if you want. It's great for people with totally stock cars or those who are adding mods.
More videos/pictures from this weekends event are coming soon, stay tuned! - Tesla Corsa
Sounds like a fun time was had by all. I was really disappointed I couldn't go, but it was the last weekend of Northern Renn Faire, and we already had plans. I'll certainly be looking for the next event, so I can participate, and meet other Tesla owners who like to take the car to the track.
Lucky13
Member
We suspect he hit a curb while in opposite lock, but since they have the GoPro footage, we may never find out!!
Here is one of our customers at that Tesla Corsa event, we would love to go to one ourselves!
Lucky13
Member
beastmode13
Member
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