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Pack Performance and Launch Mode Limits

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Somewhat on-topic...

Does anybody have captured data to report max power output for Sport mode on a P85D, P90D, or P100D? I'm considering leaving my vehicle in Sport mode while we wait for this counter stuff to shake out.

Well not quite what you're looking for, but if you look at the numbers on that spreadsheet for the Insane P90D and the Insane P85D, they're significantly less than for the same cars in Ludicrous.

Tesla Model S PxxxD(L) Comparisons (Responses)

Power wise, how Sport mode in Ludicrous equipped cars compares to Insane mode in Insane cars, I don't know.

Sport mode in a P90DL might result in less power than Insane mode in a P90D. Same with a P85DL in Sport vs a P85D in Insane.

Would help if Ludicrous cars had three modes. Sport, Insane, and Ludicrous.

I agree however with AWDtsla. A self imposed power restriction doesn't seem like a good option.
 
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Didn't save the logs, but it's clearly a lot less power. Not that we can tell if that counts against the counters or not. If it's just looking for 100% throttle then you might get power limited sooner, not later.

That's a great point!

We know, roughly, what the intention of the counters are, and we also know that Tesla quite often does a lousy job with their software. There have been countless bugs that make it into released firmware updates, and are then only corrected after feedback from customers.

All that being said, who's to say that wide open throttle accelerations in Sport Mode, or even in Valet mode aren't incrementing the counters?

The little old lady, whose picture was posted up-thread, and who only drives the P90DL to church on Sundays could wind up power-limited!
 
Extraordinary proof like Tesla adding a disclaimer on their website that applies to all P versions? Something like that?
I get his point though. There is a ton of hearsay and speculation on this thread (it's hard to keep it in track, even though I have been following this thread). So far we do not know the effects (how much power cut, does it affect P100D) because we have a sample size of 1 in terms of confirmed affected car.
 
I get his point though. There is a ton of hearsay and speculation on this thread (it's hard to keep it in track, even though I have been following this thread). So far we do not know the effects (how much power cut, does it affect P100D) because we have a sample size of 1 in terms of confirmed affected car.

I also understand his point, and yours.

I'm thinking more along the lines of where there's smoke, there's fire.

We may not know yet how big the fire is, or how much it will spread, but there's definitely a whole lot of smoke.
 
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Well not quite what you're looking for, but if you look at the numbers on that spreadsheet for the Insane P90D and the Insane P85D, they're significantly less than for the same cars in Ludicrous.

Tesla Model S PxxxD(L) Comparisons (Responses)

So...are there really only about 20 entries in this spreadsheet, or am I not seeing all of them for some reason?

Is there a reason there's no column for data without max battery on? I imagine, since there isn't, that means all launches were not only with it on, but also ready. I've avoided using max battery at all, because of the warning about possible battery degradation.

Interestingly, the one launch I've kept a record of, since getting the Ludicrous upgrade on my P85D, which presumably was the best power output of the few launches I did that day, was 446kW, which is just one off from one of the two P85DL listings, and about ten below the other, but both of those were with max battery on.

0-60 3.4 seconds, 446 kw, 90% SOC July 4 2016 600 lbs.jpg
 
Cold battery or less than 100% SoC means you won't get full power. So if my counters have large values in them, most of them were counted when the pack was not producing much more power than a 90D. That's what happens if you're driving around at 50% SoC and the pack is so cold you never get full regen.

It will be interesting to see what the counters are on cars in cold regions.
 
Great info @wk057. Thank you.

What this looks like to me is electric cars too need a maintenance regime for their powertrain, if more sustainable design is not possible.

The answer can not be artificial cutting power permanently (not for long anyway), making the cars disposable... (After all, this is artificial, not normal wear and tear.)

It would be perfectly OK if before sale Tesla said this car needs this and that part replaced after X launches. It will let you know when it is time and cut power temporarily.
 
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"Why?"
1. Avoid the counters for daily driving. Save them for track action.
2. Buy time for the Tesla algorithm to be formally documented.

Your #1, you'd probably notice the first time you went to pass someone on the highway if you were driving in Sport vs if you were driving in Ludicrous.

Now if that didn't bother you and it avoided the counters, it might serve as a temporary method of dealing with this.

But you would be giving up one of the best features of Ludicrous. It's highway passing capability. And you would have paid for that, and you'd be giving it up for no other reason than to try and avoid their counter.

And the worst part of that is; there is no telling for how long you would have to use this workaround to avoid their counters and forfeit the use and hence the capabilities of an option, Ludicrous, that you paid a lot of money for.

But you got me thinking brianman of dialing back one's own performance capabilities as a temporary workaround, and if your move is a move that anyone might contemplate, well then let me throw this out there.

You guys remember the emulator???

Well, if your approach and solution to this is to cut your own power, why not go into the emulator and run your car as a 70D. Or an 85D?

The first answer that many will give you is that "I didn't buy and pay for a 70D or an 85D, and if I had wanted one instead of this Ludicrous car, that's what I would have bought and saved a bundle doing it."

It would be tough to argue with that.

Finally to your second reason listed above, what would we do after the Tesla algorithm was formally documented, and how long will it take to formally document it?
 
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......is the mere act of taking a measurement, might put you closer to the point where permanent power reduction will occur.
Each time you run the test, could get you closer to the tipping point just for having run it.

amazing, this has turned into a discussion of a variant of quantum physics.
...the act of observing affects the observed....
or
"did it break? yes or no, if no, try again"
 
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....

It would be perfectly OK if before sale Tesla said this car needs this and that part replaced after X launches. It will let you know when it is time and cut power temporarily.

I hate to be a killjoy.

But what if "this and that part" which needed to be replaced after X launches turned out to be the battery pack or some other expensive part?

I figure whatever it is, it has to be expensive and a hassle to replace. Which is why they don't want to replace it for free under warranty in the first place.

Whatever it is, it could be subject to failure more than one time while the car is under warranty as well. Which would be another reason why they're trying to get out of the responsibility of replacing it. They don't want you coming back every few thousand miles for another free service of the same thing because you're driving your car hard.

Worse yet, what if "X" number of launches, turned out to be a lower case "x" number of launches, and your power ended up being cut less than a year and less than 10K miles after you had the car?

One guy says he's due to hit the limit at something less than 5K miles.

Tech _Guy has already hit it, and I think he bought that car around June or July.
 
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