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PG&E charges double for energy put onto grid as a penalty without PTO

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,168
5,942
Merced, CA
If you didn't have PTO and your meter wasn't able to actually measure import-vs-export, then it's hard to fault the utility IMO.

I was annoyed at the timeliness of getting PTO, but I also understand that they need to be able to both have some mechanism to ensure worker safety & have the ability to meter accurately [differentiate import-vs-export], somewhat obviously IMO...

I don't fault them. I think it's a perfectly reasonable penalty for exporting without permission.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,168
5,942
Merced, CA
PG&E swapped out old meters for Smart Meters years ago. I believe they did every customer, but might be wrong.

They did unless you asked them not to. My mom was one of those holdouts believing the EMF, which was a million time less than the cellphone she held up to her head, was going to cause brain cancer.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,168
5,942
Merced, CA
I would agree if their times to give PTO were reasonable, but they aren’t.

Right, although in this case, the much bigger delay is on Tesla's part, not PG&E. So I'll split the difference and operate without exporting to the grid. Fortunately in the winter, I can still harvest almost everything and between using it and 3 PWs of storage, I can avoid sending to the grid.
 
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getakey

Active Member
Jan 28, 2020
1,322
429
95762
Right, although in this case, the much bigger delay is on Tesla's part, not PG&E. So I'll split the difference and operate without exporting to the grid. Fortunately in the winter, I can still harvest almost everything and between using it and 3 PWs of storage, I can avoid sending to the grid.

There s nothing in your contract with PG&E that says they can charge double for export before PTO. Once you get PTO, I suspect this will still be a problem
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,168
5,942
Merced, CA
There s nothing in your contract with PG&E that says they can charge double for export before PTO. Once you get PTO, I suspect this will still be a problem

I don't think so because the account will completely change to include things like NBCs which they're not charging me for now. It will actually show production credits and other things related to having solar that it can't show right now because I don't have the right kind of account for it.
 

getakey

Active Member
Jan 28, 2020
1,322
429
95762
I don't think so because the account will completely change to include things like NBCs which they're not charging me for now. It will actually show production credits and other things related to having solar that it can't show right now because I don't have the right kind of account for it.

Betting?
 

charlesj

Active Member
Oct 22, 2019
1,197
254
Monterey, CA
PG&E swapped out old meters for Smart Meters years ago. I believe they did every customer, but might be wrong.
But smart meter may not be bidirectional, only reports usage back to base without needing a meter reader. Yes, that was a long time ago.
Now that I recall, I had smart meter before PV but they they switched it when I went solar 8 +years ago so it can read dumping to grid.
Perhaps, later they just installed a bidirectional meter for every house so they don't have to make a repeat trip to change meters?
 
Last edited:

SMAlset

Well-Known Member
Mar 4, 2017
9,093
9,841
SF Bay Area
We had our SmartMeter installed just a few years back as part of a massive change out program in our area. I don't think it was switched out again during our solar/PW install for another one but never asked. I know PG&E didn't do anything with it and doubt Tesla did. I'd have to look at our meter numbers to double check though. They were going to install an NGOM meter during our install but that became unnecessary so it was removed.
 

jboy210

Supporting Member
Dec 2, 2016
5,216
3,239
Northern California
But smart meter may not be bidirectional, only reports usage back to base without needing a meter reader. Yes, that was a long time ago.
Now that I recall, I had smart meter before PV but they they switched it when I went solar 8 +years ago so it can read dumping to grid.
Perhaps, later they just installed a bidirectional meter for every house so they don't have to make a repeat trip to change meters?
Might depend on the smart meter installed. We have had the same smart meter for a decade, and it does read negative when solar-generated power is being pushed back to the grid.
 
Last edited:

SMAlset

Well-Known Member
Mar 4, 2017
9,093
9,841
SF Bay Area
We had our SmartMeter installed just a few years back as part of a massive change out program in our area. I don't think it was switched out again during our solar/PW install for another one but never asked. I know PG&E didn't do anything with it and doubt Tesla did. I'd have to look at our meter numbers to double check though. They were going to install an NGOM meter during our install but that became unnecessary so it was removed.

Just compared photos of MP meter face taken before Tesla was out and after and same meter so in our case no need to replace.
 

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