POLL: Changes in feeling toward Tesla

[CrazyCoconut]

Funny, that’s one of the things I like. I was probably going to upgrade to a Performance next year before last week’s events, and if I did I was going to sell the stupid 20 inch wheels, paint the calipers back to normal color, and take off the spoiler. The badge of course would be dental-flossed off before I even leave the delivery center. Zero interest in playing “show how much I spent” with people I don’t care about

If it's really about "show how much I spent", as you say, then the Model 3 (regardless of trim level) is definitely not the car to do it. It's about having a car that is uniquely yours. Maybe that's not a priority for you, and that's OK. Different folks look for different things when they buy a car.

 

[jdcollins5]

I love the car, and it's not the prices changes that bother me (speaking as someone who bought FSD early), it's the fact that all of these changes seem so erratic. I used to think Tesla had a long-term strategy and plan. Now it seems like they're just throwing darts at the dart board and constantly scrambling to adjust.

+1 Agree.

 

[omar]

it's a very situational question...

if you had no AP or FSD and get to upgrade for 5K- you love tesla right now
if you bought AP and get to upgrade to FSD for another 2k- you're not pissed
If you bought AP + FSD for 8K- you're like WTF
If you bought FSD post delivery for 4K or 5K (ahem, someone like me)- you're irate

people in different situations are arguing with each other... no common ground. If you were grouped into the other person's situation you would probably feel the way they do.

 

[run-the-joules]

If it's really about "show how much I spent", as you say, then the Model 3 (regardless of trim level) is definitely not the car to do it. It's about having a car that is uniquely yours. Maybe that's not a priority for you, and that's OK. Different folks look for different things when they buy a car.

That's fair. I definitely do a few small things but generally less for uniqueness than it is to correct deficiencies in the overall design

 

[N5329K]

Price changes seem perfectly fine to me, and just what you'd expect from a business based in a rapidly-developing technology. What kind of concerns me, though, is this: eliminating stores (don't know which ones or how many) and going 100% online for sales. It suggests shaping the entire company in the image of its early adopters - techies who enjoy poring through information, options, reviews, in order to figure out exactly what they need - and ignoring those who don't have the time, skills or inclination for all that crap. People who just want a good car. And while it may not be obvious here, I'm pretty sure there are a lot of them. Many of the enormous hits in the SV startup world are based in some way on our hard-wired laziness. And this: I don't think buying a $50k automobile you can return if you don't like it is "just the same" as ordering a new pair of shoes from Zappos. And I don't think that "80% of orders now are entirely online" is meaningful since 100% of those orders have been placed by early adopters.
Hate to see Tesla cede such a huge potential market to traditional manufacturers who don't deserve the gift.
Robin

 

[GeoX750]

Yesterday a close friend called all excited about the fact that he could purchase a M3 for such low price. I fully respect Tesla's prerogative to price their products as they wish. But, I must confess that my view of the company, as an owner, investor, and an academic economist has tanked. The reality is that, at least for me, one of the reason I purchased my car was the expectation that we were in part supporting the mission, and that this was a different type of car company. The decision to drastically lower the price, and most disturbing, lure people into buying EAP with the explicit promise that it would be more expense in the future, has left me very unhappy. As an investor, it strikes me (any obviously many others) as a desperate act. And as an economist who spends much of my time estimating price elasticities, it just seems like a bad business decision. If nothing else, it is very difficult if not impossible to accurately estimate the price responsiveness to such drastic price cuts. In any event, I strongly cautioned my friend not the purchase a Tesla, and as I started to list all the downsides, especially for those of us with only one car and who live in rugged winter climates, it was clear after my conversation that Tesla lost a sale. I don't say this out of a sense of joy, but sadness that the future for the company, and for my owners experience, is not a bright one.

EAP/FS, that stuff is all peanuts. Tesla just dropped the price of the S/X over $15K ??? This changed my view of the company, its health, and it will hurt the Tesla brand longterm with luxury car buyers.

Nonetheless, I love my car and want Tesla to survive and thrive. Called my brother over the weekend and told him after the recent price drops, now is the time for his family to get a Tesla. Spent a lot time with him explaining configurations, how to get inventory cars etc, and he is getting his wife on board and ready to order.

The only thing worse that could happen (than what Tesla has done recently) is if the company does not survive. The large, overnight prices cuts on the S/X tell me they have a lot of old inventory they need to clear out. Hopefully, they are making room for new updated S and X.

The Y introduction should create a lot of positive attention. The Y design is going to be great and having and affordable smaller SUV should save the company long term. In the end, someone will buy Tesla even if it is looking at bankruptcy.

 

[CrazyCoconut]

That's fair. I definitely do a few small things but generally less for uniqueness than it is to correct deficiencies in the overall design

It might be partially influenced by my location. There are 30-40 Model 3s at my office, so I always feel like I just pulled into a Tesla service center whenever I get in lol

 

[run-the-joules]

It might be partially influenced by my location. There are 30-40 Model 3s at my office, so I always feel like I just pulled into a Tesla service center whenever I get in lol

You should see what it's like in the bay area, it's getting ridiculous. For the first several months I had the car I would go weeks without seeing another Model 3 since mine was pretty early, but a few months ago I walked out of a movie and there was another MSM 3 parked next to mine with the same darkness tint and the HOV stickers placed the same. Thankfully I knew my licence plate number and didn't have to resort to using the app to figure out which car was mine

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

My view is unchanged.
Everything I see Tesla doing comes back to:
1) Precarious cash position, stemming from production problems, as far back as the Model X.
2) The need to get the SR price down to $35k, in order to be profitable in the entry-level premium space.

 

[kengchang]

It is not the price change that is bothering me, it is the numerous erratic changes. dismantling the stores is the wrong thing to do - there aren't that many of them anyway.

You would be surprised to know Sales associate is paid $20.90/hour and can earn anywhere from $2.5K~10K a month in commission

 

[SammichLover]

I love the car, and it's not the price changes that bother me (speaking as someone who bought FSD early), it's the fact that all of these changes seem so erratic. I used to think Tesla had a long-term strategy and plan. Now it seems like they're just throwing darts at the dart board and constantly scrambling to adjust.

Those aren't mutually exclusive in the way you seem to think they are.

Long-term strategy and plan that you continue to follow should never, ever preclude you from constant adjustments. To expect otherwise is to set up a disaster, since humans aren't temporally omnipotent, infallible beings and all.

 

[SammichLover]

it's a very situational question...

if you had no AP or FSD and get to upgrade for 5K- you love tesla right now
if you bought AP and get to upgrade to FSD for another 2k- you're not pissed
If you bought AP + FSD for 8K- you're like WTF
If you bought FSD post delivery for 4K or 5K (ahem, someone like me)- you're irate

people in different situations are arguing with each other... no common ground. If you were grouped into the other person's situation you would probably feel the way they do.

You missed out the huge category of "if you were complaining/claiming that Tesla wouldn't ship a $35K this year/ever you're looking to quietly move on to loudly complaining about something else, and this seems as good a thing as any".

 

[SammichLover]

You should see what it's like in the bay area, it's getting ridiculous. For the first several months I had the car I would go weeks without seeing another Model 3 since mine was pretty early, but a few months ago I walked out of a movie and there was another MSM 3 parked next to mine with the same darkness tint and the HOV stickers placed the same. Thankfully I knew my licence plate number and didn't have to resort to using the app to figure out which car was mine

Yesterday at work in semi-rural TX, walking back to leave after morning shift; "Wait, I don't park like that in this lot."

I haven't talked to them, to set them straight on backing into parking spot etiquette. Judging from registration tag date and the lack of a front half-shaft (I peeked) I think they're a LeMR.

 

[StellarRat]

When do you expect to get it?

I honestly don't know. It could be years, BUT, I'm looking forward to the features that will become available bit by bit. My M3 may never be completely self-driving, but I'm sure it will have a lot of new features that will reduce the amount of human intervention required. Even the ability to stop at traffic lights and stop signs would be a very big step forward and worth the $2K they want now. With just that feature I could probably do 70% of my in town driving with AP.

 

[ConcordeSST]

Those aren't mutually exclusive in the way you seem to think they are.

Long-term strategy and plan that you continue to follow should never, ever preclude you from constant adjustments. To expect otherwise is to set up a disaster, since humans aren't temporally omnipotent, infallible beings and all.

Sure, but it's the level of change and the rapidity with which the changes are being implemented that do not inspire me with a sense of confidence that these are the kind of minor adjustments that come ordinarily with a well thought out plan. They smack of reactive thinking and in some cases desperation.

I sincerely hope I'm wrong. I love Tesla and I want them to succeed. So much so, that if I was offered a refund for anything, I'd genuinely hesitate and consider not accepting because I don't think they can afford it.

 

[SammichLover]

Sure, but it's the level of change and the rapidity with which the changes are being implemented that do not inspire me with a sense of confidence

Then you fundamentally misunderstand what Tesla's strength is, how it has succeeded to the extent it has so far, and why it is 4+ years ahead of the rest of the automobile manufacturers on BEVs.

 

[rdunniii]

erratic is bad.
I can't stand it when Tesla, or any company, won't reveal basic information to shareholders.

Tesla gets 400k reservations.... WE HAVE 400K RESERVATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2019: Elon, what is demand like? how many reservations do you have?
Elon: we're not going to talk about that today.

??????????????????
Apple: we sold 70 million iphones this quarter!!! *high 5s all around*
(Iphone sales drop suddenly)
Apple: we will no longer report sales numbers, but trust us, sales are great!

please tell the owners of the company the truth

Most would prefer to, but between the SEC, activist shareholders and lawyers looking for anything to sue them over make it potentially costly.

 

[StellarRat]

They smack of reactive thinking and in some cases desperation.

I sincerely hope I'm wrong. I love Tesla and I want them to succeed. So much so, that if I was offered a refund for anything, I'd genuinely hesitate and consider not accepting because I don't think they can afford it.

I think you might being a bit gloomy. They have good people on the board including Larry Ellison and Elon isn't stupid either. He may say stupid stuff, but to date his business moves have been good. Besides, companies this big don't make changes without looking at the data and Tesla gathers a ton of that. Remember, the Model 3 is just arriving in China and Europe and the Model Y is coming up. Plus we now have the SR which should sell well at such a low price. If Tesla is making any margin on the SR that has to be good. It's very unlikely they'll be selling too many base SRs, most will be SR+ and some of those will have AP and maybe even FSD upgrades. Also, I should point out that Tesla can still raise capital. Yeah, that will kill the stock, but it could tide them over for a long time if the cash burn isn't too bad and they're selling enough M3's to come close to break even.

 

[ConcordeSST]

Then you fundamentally misunderstand what Tesla's strength is, how it has succeeded to the extent it has so far, and why it is 4+ years ahead of the rest of the automobile manufacturers on BEVs.

I think you misunderstand me. I want them to succeed and I think they will, but that doesn't mean that they planned all of these recent changes and it doesn't mean I don't have some doubts. If I have them as a Tesla owner and enthusiast, imagine how all this looks to the people they have yet to win over? I still think they'll eventually overcome the challenges that they have now because their strengths outweigh their weaknesses, but they often shoot themselves in the foot and make things harder for themselves than they need to be. Even Elon would agree I think (flufferbot).

 

[SammichLover]

I think you misunderstand me. I want them to succeed and I think they will, but that doesn't mean that they planned all of these recent changes and it doesn't mean I don't have some doubts. If I have them as a Tesla owner and enthusiast, imagine how all this looks to the people they have yet to win over? I still think they'll eventually overcome the challenges that they have now because their strengths outweigh their weaknesses, but they often shoot themselves in the foot and make things harder for themselves than they need to be. Even Elon would agree I think (flufferbot).

All of this is inline with my understanding of what you're saying.

You are uncomfortable with the Silicon Valley style that Tesla has successfully translated to automobile design, manufacturing, and sales. Frantic and flexible and quick-loop iterative. It can be unsettling if you're got in mind the plodding old school, if that's what you expect and are using as the measuring stick for "done right". But as we've seen over the last two decades in software and then computer hardware, if this approach is executed successfully it absolutely slaughters the competition. It overwhelms with speed of improvement and product actually shipping, which more than compensates for any clunkiness along the way.

Scoreboard so far says Tesla is proving it translates to automobiles, too. Your uncomfortableness with it notwithstanding.