Poll is current hardware sufficient for full self driving?

[alexgr]

This same poll could be taken regarding Humans driving high powered vehicle on existing streeets.

They currently get into millions of accidents every year. Often accidents are fatal to both drivers and passengers.
Human drivers are often distracted by other humans, baby on board, Wifey giving instructions, missed an exit, looking at cell phone, being tired/sleepy/bored. Fighting with others in the car, worrying about personal events, watching for police, disobeying traffic laws, worrying about other nearby drivers, not slowing for conditions, driving while ill/drunk/medicated/recreational drugs/emotional. Humans cause most of the vehicle accidents around the World currently. Perhaps they should also be labeled as unsuitable to pilot personal transportation....

Would be safer to just ban cars. Everyone walks, rides a bicycle, takes a train, bus, street car or airplane. While these form of transportation are much safer for mile traveled, they also have accidents and are inherently flawed.

Current situation is that a human can always simply drive their car themselves. They will take into consideration their current condition, experience and training to decide whether to drive themselves or to engage any drivers aids.

I think the only sensible solution would be to ban humans.

 

[DanCar]

2) I am not sure why would that be an issue except when someone crawls under the bumper while the normal cameras are not working.

Are you aware of what happened with cruise?

3) Just a few years back, we the humans driving the normal cars with no sensors haven't been that much paranoid by the idea that a little gnome is hiding under the bumper. So, why would that suddenly become such a big issue?

A person can sense a thud. A person can hear someone screaming while being dragged. Your car doesn't.

 

[mikez10288]

The defining difference between Level 2 and Level 3 comes with OEDR, or “Object and Event Detection and Response.” OEDR is the geek term for doing what any driver does: keep an eye on any factors that might affect driving, especially safety, and deal with it (a core aspect of the “Dynamic Driving Task”). OEDR is defined in detail in the standard. Table 1 in SAE J3016 states that for Level 2, “the driver completes the OEDR subtask and supervises the driving automation system,” immediately taking control when conditions warrant. For Level 3, OEDR is handled by the Automated Driving System (ADS); the driver retains responsibility to be “receptive to ADS-issued requests to intervene.” The flow chart below from SAE J3016 is a great way to negotiate the “levels maze.”

When a Level 3 (ADS) system is driving, you don't have to perform the OEDR, but need to start doing it (and take over the driving task after a completed handover) when the system asks you to. During the handover process (typically 10+ secs), the system is still driving. The only piece of L3 regulation that I am aware or (UNECE R157) outlines the minimum requirement of a 10s hand over period.

Thank you for this. I am happy to admit when I am wrong or misunderstood a topic.

 

[ionsphere]

As mentioned, Tesla has not achieved L3 so there is no current Tesla that is “self driving”. Tesla requires hands on wheel and full attention at all times, even with FSD beta. The driver is fully responsible for controlling the car even when the system is active. It may fail and give the “TAKE CONTROL IMMEDIATELY” notice without warning.

L3 does not require hands on the wheel or active attention. The liability is taken on by the automaker while L3 is active. It will warn the driver well in advance when they need to take over.

Personally I wouldn’t consider a car “self driving” until L4 or L5 where no driver attention intervention is required.

That pesky take control immediately message along with the warning alarm that is fairly unsettling, pops up far too frequently for me even though I have my hands both on the wheel and am looking straight ahead at the road. I'm not sure if this is a malfunction in my car or if it's something I should put a trouble ticket in for. It is unsettling to be constantly demanding that I pay attention to the road (when I am in fact, actually paying attention to the road already) by sending me annoyingly loud warning sounds and written messages on the screen that take my attention off the road
Before my MY 23 I drove a 22 Hyundai Tucson p h e v and the level of "self-driving" was actually much more comfortable. I virtually never got warnings or scolded by my car because I'm actually a really responsible and alert driver who constantly looks at the road and has my hands on the wheel. So I'm not sure why Tesla seems to be going overboard but it's actually been like this since I got the car back in September. Constant corrections that draw my attention away from the road to see what in the heck it's screaming at me for this time. Frustrating and potentially dangerous by taking my attention off the road long enough to actually read something on the screen. Too long. Amazingly though I still currently enjoy my car but I am hopeful that a upcoming update might make it more reasonable. The question has come up recently in my circle asking why Tesla doesn't use the same system that Hyundai uses for its auto drive capabilities which I also appreciated that my parking was an overhead view and was extremely helpful, while the Tesla only gives me a side view on each side of the car and I'm just hoping they get better on this part as well.

 

[Dewg]

That pesky take control immediately message along with the warning alarm that is fairly unsettling, pops up far too frequently for me even though I have my hands both on the wheel and am looking straight ahead at the road. I'm not sure if this is a malfunction in my car or if it's something I should put a trouble ticket in for.

That's not normal behavior.

You can safely look away from the road for 5-7 seconds or so before being told to pay attention. The nag for wheel torque happens about every 30 seconds or so at 60+MPH. Slower will give less nags.

Take Control Immediately means the system has crashed, or has entered an area where it cannot operator properly. This should be rare. Your GPS may be off, so the car thinks it's somewhere it's not, causing the panic.

When you have the Take Control Immediately with the red wheel, take over as requested, and then press the Voice button and say "bug report". Note the date/time of the report and open a service ticket with Tesla, referencing the bug report. That will give them telemetry on the car at the time the error occured and help then diagnose it.

 

[ionsphere]

That's not normal behavior.

You can safely look away from the road for 5-7 seconds or so before being told to pay attention. The nag for wheel torque happens about every 30 seconds or so at 60+MPH. Slower will give less nags.

Take Control Immediately means the system has crashed, or has entered an area where it cannot operator properly. This should be rare. Your GPS may be off, so the car thinks it's somewhere it's not, causing the panic.

When you have the Take Control Immediately with the red wheel, take over as requested, and then press the Voice button and say "bug report". Note the date/time of the report and open a service ticket with Tesla, referencing the bug report. That will give them telemetry on the car at the time the error occured and help then diagnose it.

Okay thank you for this. I didn't want to be an alarmist and whine about everything but this has gotten really irritating to the point where I'm yelling back at the car every time it yells at me for no apparent reason...so probably a good time to open a trouble ticket I'm glad to hear it's not normal behavior. And it's especially helpful to hear the details about how to submit a trouble ticket in a way that is most helpful for the tech team to diagnose it. I appreciate your help.

 

[DanCar]

I didn't know Model S & X now have a front camera.

Tesla Model S and X to Gain Ambient Lighting and Front Bumper Camera

Discover the latest updates to Tesla's Model S and X, including ambient lighting and a front bumper camera. Dive into Tesla's continuous innovation and what's n

www.notateslaapp.com

 

[DanCar]

Posting various tweets from Green about front bumper camera:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1722081239996289207

https://twitter.com/x/status/1731556580552827112

https://twitter.com/x/status/1717596910377140266

https://twitter.com/x/status/1697421234382807272

https://twitter.com/x/status/1697423545431683493

https://twitter.com/greentheonly/status/1728372517067178289
https://twitter.com/greentheonly/status/1728369086705598662