Rear motor failure on road trip.

[TomB985]

I disagree. Personally I came looking for information on what to expect regarding the repair and accommodations for alternate travel arrangements. I too have been on automotive boards for about as long. I find that many, Corvette, Volt and Tesla boards in particular, have plenty of posts from people enthused and enjoying their vehicles and sharing information.

My point is that there are a LOT of people who have a problem with their car, search for it online, discover a forum, and post about their issue. Many of said people are never heard from again after the problem is resolved, and sometimes they even disappear after the original post. These people would never have found the forum otherwise, which strongly biases the sample group.

As a consumer, I place a lot more weight on a problem reported by an established member than someone who comes here because of the problem. There is no scientific way to go about getting accurate data on this, but a survey of Internet forums for problems is nowhere near an accurate sample group.

That being said, I'm continually impressed on how few mechanical problems we see here. At this point you are the unfortunate outlier, and well-established automakers that have been doing this for more than a century are doing nearly as well… On the forums, at least!

 

[mreynolds767]

A few isolated incidents don't change my perception of the car's reliability.
It does however prove that the AWD version is not in any way more reliable for having 2 motors in case one fails. As originally assumed 2 motors means more things that could go wrong.

 

[KenC]

We should collect VINs of people who are having rear motor problems, to see if there's a grouping. My anecdotal perception is that these catastrophic failures, ones that require towing, are pretty random, compared to my Volt. The number of people on the Volt message board complaining of "power reduced, shift to park" seemed shockingly high, to the point, I was starting to expect a failure of my 2016 Volt!

 

[TESURA]

Yes, my incident seems isolated, and yes I came here to see if others have had the same issue. I love my car and have put hard earned money into it. I was more bummed in the fact that I was trying to show my brother how awesome the car is when it shutdown. I get it back today and will post the final outcome so that anyone else that comes here searching for a similar issue can gain a little clarity. An owner shouldn't have to be a "member" with 1000 posts to add value to a conversation. For those that don't believe that I'm not trolling... this was
my view when I waited for the tow. Don't be jealous...

 

[kailm]

The dual motor failure only works if the front motor fails.
Why? Its because the front is induction motor hence can be limped without any feedback to the electrical system. You can let it freely spin as it won't create energy.
The rear motor is permanent magnet, so while the wheels spin, it won't stay limp, it will create current/feedback into the electrical system.
This is dangerous as it can overheat and create a fire. Since the system wants to prevent damage, it shuts down.

Since all systems disconnect several errors show up including the 12V failure as the main battery won't charge the 12V battery anymore.
So you can only limp home, if the front motor fails, which is weird, because induction motor should last longer hence its failure is somewhat pointless.

I have ready many articles about motor failures so its definitely in the low thousands and not in the few 10s.
Still acceptable to have this failure rate due to coil/winding tolerances.

 

[Daniel in SD]

The dual motor failure only works if the front motor fails.
Why? Its because the front is induction motor hence can be limped without any feedback to the electrical system. You can let it freely spin as it won't create energy.
The rear motor is permanent magnet, so while the wheels spin, it won't stay limp, it will create current/feedback into the electrical system.
This is dangerous as it can overheat and create a fire. Since the system wants to prevent damage, it shuts down.

Since all systems disconnect several errors show up including the 12V failure as the main battery won't charge the 12V battery anymore.
So you can only limp home, if the front motor fails, which is weird, because induction motor should last longer hence its failure is somewhat pointless.

I have ready many articles about motor failures so its definitely in the low thousands and not in the few 10s.
Still acceptable to have this failure rate due to coil/winding tolerances.

This seems like a plausible explanation. I am curious if there is any way the rear motor can fail and still safely freewheel. I'm guessing there isn't and Tesla should really update the description on the website.

 

[SMAlset]

Yes, my incident seems isolated, and yes I came here to see if others have had the same issue. I love my car and have put hard earned money into it. I was more bummed in the fact that I was trying to show my brother how awesome the car is when it shutdown. I get it back today and will post the final outcome so that anyone else that comes here searching for a similar issue can gain a little clarity. An owner shouldn't have to be a "member" with 1000 posts to add value to a conversation. For those that don't believe that I'm not trolling... this was
my view when I waited for the tow. Don't be jealous...

View attachment 453029

Yes, reminds me of the time our friend took my husband out in his sports car and it broke down on the highway. Thanks for keeping us informed on your car.

 

[TESURA]

Picked it up on time as indicated by the service rep. I received a new Rear Drive unit and a related cable. Here are the part numbers for those that care. Overall I'm happy with the service and turn-around time. I'll admit that I'll have a little bit of anxiety until my old brain forgets this ever happened. My only complaint were the Uber credits instead of a loaner, but thats a first-world problem that I'll get over quickly

 

[DopeGhoti]

This seems like a plausible explanation. I am curious if there is any way the rear motor can fail and still safely freewheel. I'm guessing there isn't and Tesla should really update the description on the website.

The quote I'd seen pulled from the web site before was incomplete. What I saw before was this:

Tesla All-Wheel Drive has two independent motors. Unlike traditional all-wheel drive systems, these two motors digitally control torque to the front and rear wheels—for far better handling and traction control.

This reads to me like it's simply talking about AWD traction control. "If your rear wheels lose traction, we send power to the front wheels".

However:

Your car can drive on either motor, so you never need to worry about getting stuck on the road. If one motor stops working, you can safely continue to your destination with the second.

This is fairly damning, given how we see several cases on just this forum of a single drive unit failure rendering the car inoperable.

 

[alloverx]

Yes the marketing folks forgot to check with engineering folks.
From a consumer viewpoint, its basically fraudulent unless it has exclusions.

 

[233.3]

Update: After spending literally 6 hours divided between trying to find a one-way car rental to get home (there was only one @ $724 for a 2-day min.) and trying through every method I could think of (text, phone the SC where my car was towed, phone Tesla customer service, phone the SC near my home, choose sales option instead of service on Tesla phone system, Twitter, facebook, e-mail, guessing at extensions on Tesla phone system, leaving multiple voice mails, etc) and with no response from anyone at Tesla I finally gave up and took an Uber to the SC. I figured they would have a hard time ignoring me if I was standing right in front of them. That proved to be the only thing that worked. The service writer talked to a manager and they agreed to cover the price of a Southwest flight so I could get home.

I had a long talk with the service writer about how I can better communicate with him (and others at Tesla). Long story short, there is nothing that actually works short of just showing up. He did flag my account so now he may get notified when I send text messages but that was the extent of what he could offer as improvement.

From all the questions I asked about how to communicate with people at Tesla all I can conclude is that you are wasting your time trying. When I asked why I was ignored all day I was told that they could only be ignoring me if they actually got the communications, they do not. The voice mails and text messages can be seen when they pull up your account but no one knows they are there unless they go looking for them (they don't) so no one reads them or listens to them. I did not get an answer regarding why my e-mail to him was not answered.

There is a person at the SC called the update adviser that is supposed to handle communications but clearly that is not effective. I was not able to talk to her to find out what the breakdown is with her.

There is a phone on the service writer's counter. He told me there was no way to reach that phone by dialing from the outside. When he stepped away I turned the phone around so I could read the extension number off the display. I will try that the next time but I am not sure it was his extension of the last one he spoke with.

The upside is I finally made it home but not before two of three days of my business trip were consumed: first with the break down then with trying to get home. Not to mention about $70 in Uber charges I probably will not be reimbursed for.

 

[KenC]

We should collect VINs of people who are having rear motor problems, to see if there's a grouping.

So, 233.3's VIN is in the 400xxx range; while Tesura's VIN is in the 100xxx range? I suppose it would be better to get the number off the rear motors themselves, but who's pulled the cover off the bottom to look? Anyhow, just based upon 2 datapoints it seems that there's no grouping.

 

[TESURA]

So, 233.3's VIN is in the 400xxx range; while Tesura's VIN is in the 100xxx range? I suppose it would be better to get the number off the rear motors themselves, but who's pulled the cover off the bottom to look? Anyhow, just based upon 2 datapoints it seems that there's no grouping.

My VIN is 145xxx, but agree to your point. No rhyme or reason.

 

[dmurphy]

Picked it up on time as indicated by the service rep. I received a new Rear Drive unit and a related cable. Here are the part numbers for those that care. Overall I'm happy with the service and turn-around time. I'll admit that I'll have a little bit of anxiety until my old brain forgets this ever happened. My only complaint were the Uber credits instead of a loaner, but thats a first-world problem that I'll get over quickly

That’s exactly how it’s supposed to work! Any failure is unpleasant but it sounds like they handled it in the best way possible. Fixed, fixed correctly and fixed rapidly. The loaner/Uber thing - I guess my feeling is that for a day or two, Uber is acceptable most of the time. Of course, there’s extenuating circumstances sometimes, so rental and loaners should be options if one really needs it. Beyond that, a loaner really should be available.

I guess I’m lucky in that my office is at home, so a shuttle or Uber will suffice for a day or two; I can be flexible. I understand loaners are a shared, limited resource so I don’t want to take one if it’s just going to sit in my driveway all day anyway... that’s just bad karma.

Anyway - back to your service repair - very cool the way they handled your springs, too!

“hey, we tried to do an alignment but can’t. So if you take out the lowered springs, just bring it back and we’ll do it then.”

Sounds fair and reasonable to me!

That said - I’d say you probably do actually need an alignment if they had to pull the entire drive assembly .... how much work would it be to put it back to stock?

 

[ecarfan]

I have ready many articles about motor failures so its definitely in the low thousands and not in the few 10s.

There is no logical way you can draw that conclusion based on reading “many articles”. Those “articles” are not a statistically valid sample of all Model 3 owners. They are simply random reports of owners with motor failures.

Yes, some Model 3 owners have had motor failures rendering their cars inoperative. No, we do not know what percentage of all owners have such failures nor do we have a valid way of estimating the failure rate.

Instead what we have are WAGs.

 

[TomB985]

Yep, no one other than Tesla knows the true amount. The closest you could probably get would be some kind of third-party polling or survey, and most reliability surveys aren’t done with that kind of granularity.

 

[eustachio]

Family member's Benz's computer systems all died on the road, has been in the shop for a month or more. Based on that experience, all Benzes are unreliable. Forums are no indication of anything, I've been on owner forums for all brands I've owned, they are all replete with 'issues' and could put you off buying the car.

 

[Phlier]

Family member's Benz's computer systems all died on the road, has been in the shop for a month or more. Based on that experience, all Benzes are unreliable. Forums are no indication of anything, I've been on owner forums for all brands I've owned, they are all replete with 'issues' and could put you off buying the car.

Exactly!

Toyota and Honda both are known for making extremely reliable cars, yet a quick glance through either make's popular forum boards, and you'll see they're rife with complaints just like any other brand.

Forums are *not* a reliable gauge as to a brand's reliability.

 

[DopeGhoti]

Forums are *not* a reliable gauge as to a brand's reliability.

The Internet is where people go to complain. Even enthusiasts. People who have not been having any problems are not very likely to go into every single "is anyone else having this problem?" thread and say "no, not me!"

 

[VancouverM3]

I found a "rear motor disabled/reduced power" warning on starting my M3 one morning on a recent road trip. My first stop was a nearby charging station (though I still had plenty of range left) so I drove there with no difficulty. After charging, the warning disappeared. I put it down to a fluke warning?