SEC Lawsuit

[EinSV]

I'm not arguing that the SEC is responsible for what they put in the complaint. They are.

<snip>

Imagine, for a minute, where the TSLA stock price would be right now if:
1) Elon ignored Pedo guy
2) Elon didn't smoke MJ on a podcast
3) Elon didn't tweet about going private (unless there was SIGNED paperwork)
4) Elon focused on planning for delivery problems for the Model 3 (seriously, you go through production hell and just think your TINY service center network is going to be able to handle 10-20X the deliveries they were used to last year)

This guy has all the hallmarks of someone that is overworked, doesn't sleep enough, and won't take help when he needs it (both mental help and offloading of tasks to others). In a situation like this, it is proper for us to question if he is "fit to be CEO" anymore.

I think Tesla would be better served by keeping Musk as Chairman of the Board, but having someone else operate day to day functions of the company.

Those are fair concerns for investors to raise, and they have. I personally agree with you that Elon is overworked and overstressed, as he worked incredibly hard to get Model 3 production up and running -- an incredible accomplishment but one that also took a toll on Elon.

But your view that Tesla would be better off without Elon as CEO is an opinion that I think it is fair to say is shared by only a very small minority of shareholders.

And it should be shareholders who decide who runs the company, not the overreaching bureaucrats at the SEC. The vast majority of investors want that person to be Elon.

 

[bkp_duke]

Those are fair concerns for investors to raise, and they have. I personally agree with you that Elon is overworked and overstressed, as he worked incredibly hard to get Model 3 production up and running -- an incredible accomplishment but one that also took a toll on Elon.

But your view that Tesla would be better off without Elon as CEO is an opinion that I think it is fair to say is shared by only a very small minority of shareholders.

And it should be shareholders who decide who runs the company, not the overreaching bureaucrats at the SEC. The vast majority of investors want that person to be Elon.

You forget: most investors (i.e. total number of shares owned) outside of Elon are not small investors like you and me, but are institutional investors. I would wager that those investors would side with the viewpoint I provided over yours.

 

[EinSV]

You forget: most investors (i.e. total number of shares owned) outside of Elon are not small investors like you and me, but are institutional investors. I would wager that those investors would side with the viewpoint I provided over yours.

I bet not. If as many shareholders wanted Elon out as CEO as you say, they could easily call a shareholder vote. Hasn’t happened and if it did I imagine 90+% of shares would vote to keep Elon as CEO.

 

[Dan Detweiler]

It doesn't matter what the Saudi's have for their definition. It's what the US and SEC have as their definition (and I'm 100% certain that Musk has the appropriate lawyers at Tesla that advise him on this kind of thing). 100% of this is governed by US, not Saudi, law.

I totally get that but it does speak to intent.

Dan

 

[shrspeedblade]

This is a bit of a simplification, but attempts to add complexity are usually attempts to distort the truth.

The old adage goes, "If you're going to talk the talk you'd better be able to walk the walk."

Did Tesla fail to move forward on going private because:
1) They chose not to.
2) The shareholders voted it down.
3) The being able to fund it was a fraudulent claim of Elon's imagination.

Taking the word "secured" and turning it into "has 50 billion sitting in the bank" or "has a contract already signed while still in the early stages of consideration" is an exercise in rhetoric by those who are opposed to Tesla either philosophically or monetarily. Considering events unfolded to show #1 to be the correct answer, not doing something because you choose not to is very different then you can't, it makes the SEC case gravely concerning as they are acting on the behest of those engaging in that rhetoric.

The more I consider this, the better I feel about Elon's chances in an impartial venue, but the madder I get that the case has even been filed by a goverment agency in the first place. Putting a finger on the scales for one investment group in preference to another is repugnant, corrupt, and merely giving government insurance to a form of investing that has always been considered volatile and high risk in the first place.

 

[thegruf]

SEC seems to have offered a deal that Musk appears to have declined.
Musk apparently believes his position is defensible or he wouldn't have declined the deal offered.

Of course there are tons of people here that know more about the details than Musk, a CEO of multiple $Bn companies who just happened to be involved in all the relevant discussions ...

mind you this place would be boring if people just stuck to discussing what they actually know instead of lurid speculation

 

[diplomat33]

Musk settles lawsuit with the SEC, agrees to pay a $20 million fine, and step down as chairman of the Board but stays as CEO:
Elon Musk settles SEC lawsuit, forced out as Tesla’s chairman but stays as CEO, $20 million fine and more

 

[VT_EE]

Musk settles lawsuit with the SEC, agrees to pay a $20 million fine, and step down as chairman of the Board but stays as CEO:
Elon Musk settles SEC lawsuit, forced out as Tesla’s chairman but stays as CEO, $20 million fine and more

Thank god!!!!

 

[diplomat33]

Thank god!!!!

Yeah! It could have been much worse. If Musk had gone to court and lost, he could have been banned as CEO or who knows, even sentenced to prison. A settlement was the right call. Tesla will be just fine.

 

[shrspeedblade]

I guess they didn't like their chances in trying it or didn't feel like the distraction of fighting it was worth the negatives it would almost certainly entail moving forward.

Tough lesson learned- but those are the ones you remember the best. I'm still hopping mad about the whole thing and it's yet one big block of confidence in our government institutions removed. I don't have many left.

Moving forward, I hope out of this could come a more dangerous Elon: one who will want to overcome the odds even more but will now keep his bravado in check.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I guess they didn't like their chances in trying it or didn't feel like the distraction of fighting it was worth the negatives it would almost certainly entail moving forward.

Tough lesson learned- but those are the ones you remember the best. I'm still hopping mad about the whole thing and it's yet one big block of confidence in our government institutions removed. I don't have many left.

Moving forward, I hope out of this could come a more dangerous Elon: one who will want to overcome the odds even more but will now keep his bravado in check.

Does anyone know what changed between the deal offered earlier and the deal they settled on today? I'm not seeing any major differences.

The only thing I know that changed is the stock tanked on Friday so maybe Musk underestimated the fallout in not settling.

 

[strangecosmos]

Does anyone know what changed between the deal offered earlier and the deal they settled on today? I'm not seeing any major differences.

According to unnamed sources cited by the New York Times:

The terms are slightly tougher than those that two people briefed on the talks said Mr. Musk had rejected on Thursday, which called for a two-year bar on serving as chairman and a $10 million fine.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

According to unnamed sources cited by the New York Times:

Yeah, it just looks tougher like 3 years instead of 2 years. I'm not seeing anything that's changed in a way that's more appealing to Elon.

So I'm thinking he didn't quite understand the gravity of the situation when he turned down the original offer.

 

[shonline]

I guess they didn't like their chances in trying it or didn't feel like the distraction of fighting it was worth the negatives it would almost certainly entail moving forward.

Tough lesson learned- but those are the ones you remember the best. I'm still hopping mad about the whole thing and it's yet one big block of confidence in our government institutions removed. I don't have many left.

Moving forward, I hope out of this could come a more dangerous Elon: one who will want to overcome the odds even more but will now keep his bravado in check.

I believe the Q 3 numbers are going to be ridiculous and becaus Elon’s mission is selfless, he acted selflessly here. Period. He stays as CEO. This is a win for the planet - and he knew it.

 

[shonline]

Does anyone know what changed between the deal offered earlier and the deal they settled on today? I'm not seeing any major differences.

The only thing I know that changed is the stock tanked on Friday so maybe Musk underestimated the fallout in not settling.

CEO title.

 

[Big Dog]

Yeah, it just looks tougher like 3 years instead of 2 years. I'm not seeing anything that's changed in a way that's more appealing to Elon.

What I've read is that the rejected settlement included an admission of wrongdoing by Elon. If true, than the extra year is nothing in comparison to, 'I did it'.

 

[Grendal]

It's resolved and now Elon can move on. He gets a babysitter for commenting on Tesla using twitter. He is forced out as Chairman of the board for two years (no big deal) and a minor fine (for him). The Board isn't going to do anything stupid in the next two years and they'll still listen to Elon. No admission of wrongdoing is a critical part of the agreement.

 

[Lasairfion]

Well in a way this will give him some breathing room appointing a new Chairman. I wonder if it'll be someone like Jerome? I'm very surprised that the SEC can push this that hard but eh. I expect that in the future, if any of them ever end up driving a Tesla, it'll sit locked and refuse to open unless alternative family members use the key/app.

 

[dondy]

I'm not arguing that the SEC is responsible for what they put in the complaint. They are.


1) Elon ignored Pedo guy
2) Elon didn't smoke MJ on a podcast
3) Elon didn't tweet about going private (unless there was SIGNED paperwork)

His name wouldn't be Elon and Tesla would have performance of the GM.
I am getting hunch that you will see all this much sooner than expected.

4) Elon focused on planning for delivery problems for the Model 3 (seriously, you go through production hell and just think your TINY service center network is going to be able to handle 10-20X the deliveries they were used to last year)

He did, and they started hiring long time ago. They never managed (and still don't) to fill all necessary positions in delivery departments. 25% growth per month is normal only in drugs trading. No other auto company ever succeeded to manage such growth.

This guy has all the hallmarks of someone that is overworked, doesn't sleep enough, and won't take help when he needs it (both mental help and offloading of tasks to others). In a situation like this, it is proper for us to question if he is "fit to be CEO" anymore.

The best question would be: when MM will leave him in peace and give at least some space for personal life?

I think Tesla would be better served by keeping Musk as Chairman of the Board, but having someone else operate day to day functions of the company.

He would leave "in 45 days", most probably he will leave anyway but in a bit longer time.

 

[mos6507]

Tesla will be just fine.

Well, just fine is sort of stretching things. Tesla was already in its share of trouble before the tweet and those troubles remain.

He is forced out as Chairman of the board for two years

Three years.