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Short-Term TSLA Price Movements - 2013

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Actually no, scratch that... I wish I were paying attention to more than just TSLA today. The market is going to be down HUGE tomorrow. 500-1000 points I'm guessing. I think people are betting on the US debt crisis finally happening with both gold and interest rates rising together. I sold half of my GLD calls, and half of my SPY puts to buy TSLA puts... I'm a dumbass.
 
Where do you see that tomorrow is going to be down huge tomorrow? I'm looking at CNN after hours and it looks like futures on the indices flip between -1.5% and +.05%, which i take to mean that the futures are positive but the data from today (-1.5%) is still in the system. I don't think you'd see a -200 point drop tomorrow without more of an indication in the last 20 min of trading. Plus, after hour quotes of a lot of stocks are neutral, besides apple which is down 2 dollar.s
 
So with the fed tapering its QE, I understand that to mean that it will no longer be buying treasury bonds. If that's the case, then the price of treasuries will fall and the interest levels will rise to over 3-4% for the 10 year treasury. That large fall in treasury price means that people other than the fed are selling, as I think the fed has no intention of selling for the foreseeable future. If people are selling, then where are they putting their money?
1) they short the market.
2) probably not dividend stocks, as it's not worth buying a dividend stock yielding 3% when you could have a treasury with 4%.
3) Do you think they would be investing in high growth stocks? I'd imagine that tesla would be one of these stocks.
 
Where do you see that tomorrow is going to be down huge tomorrow? I'm looking at CNN after hours and it looks like futures on the indices flip between -1.5% and +.05%, which i take to mean that the futures are positive but the data from today (-1.5%) is still in the system. I don't think you'd see a -200 point drop tomorrow without more of an indication in the last 20 min of trading. Plus, after hour quotes of a lot of stocks are neutral, besides apple which is down 2 dollar.s

I'm talking about George Soros shorting the whole market today. Remember when interest rates started rising? There was no mention of a taper then - interest rates are low, monetary inflation is not. After mention of the taper, Gold would go down when interest rates went up because people thought the Fed would taper, or vise versa. Now they're both going up in tandem which means to me that now nobody ####ing cares what the Fed does, rates are going up. Also the market dropped today, which usually
would lead to bond purchases as people head to "safe" returns, but nope... Not today. Check out the amount the US pays in interest expenses: http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/ir/ir_expense.htm
Notice the note for July ** Due to a change in the accounting method for the Department of Defense (DOD) market-based securities, a one time adjustment of $75 billion decreased the Interest Expense on the Public Debt for the month of July.

The fact is a doubling in interest rates from here to keep up with the monetary (not price) inflation, would lead over an extra 1 Trillion added to the defecit. The government will have to borrow more money just to pay the interest, which will add to the interest expense. If people think the government is going to pay for this interest expense by printing more money, than the rates are going up even more. The only way to keep this defecit under control is to increase tax revenue or SPEND LESS!!! The plan was that the improving economy would add to the tax revenue but this doesn't appear to be happening fast enough. The US currently has a $700B defecit to overcome already. If tax revenues don't increase faster than the interest expense we will never get out of this mess and the dollar will be exposed for the monopoly money it is.
 
I'm talking about George Soros shorting the whole market today. Remember when interest rates started rising? There was no mention of a taper then - interest rates are low, monetary inflation is not. After mention of the taper, Gold would go down when interest rates went up because people thought the Fed would taper, or vise versa. Now they're both going up in tandem which means to me that now nobody ####ing cares what the Fed does, rates are going up. Also the market dropped today, which usually
would lead to bond purchases as people head to "safe" returns, but nope... Not today. Check out the amount the US pays in interest expenses: http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/ir/ir_expense.htm
Notice the note for July ** Due to a change in the accounting method for the Department of Defense (DOD) market-based securities, a one time adjustment of $75 billion decreased the Interest Expense on the Public Debt for the month of July.

The fact is a doubling in interest rates from here to keep up with the monetary (not price) inflation, would lead over an extra 1 Trillion added to the defecit. The government will have to borrow more money just to pay the interest, which will add to the interest expense. If people think the government is going to pay for this interest expense by printing more money, than the rates are going up even more. The only way to keep this defecit under control is to increase tax revenue or SPEND LESS!!! The plan was that the improving economy would add to the tax revenue but this doesn't appear to be happening fast enough. The US currently has a $700B defecit to overcome already. If tax revenues don't increase faster than the interest expense we will never get out of this mess and the dollar will be exposed for the monopoly money it is.

Remember - DON'T PANIC!

and don't forget your towel
 
George Soros shorted the market during the last quarter, not during the last week. If he was opening his position today, I'd be concerned. I have more faith in the fed wanting to keep the market up than I do in Soros's prediction, because the fed can manipulate the market for its desires. Yes, so today money left bonds and stocks and went into gold. Doubt that we'll see a 500 point correction tomorrow based on this. There is no fundamentally new news that would cause that sort of correction. A drop of that magnitude is the result of unexpected news, otherwise there is a more orderly exit over time as one by one investors close positions.
Your discussion of interest rates is not something that has been taken up by the news and won't play a role in dropping the market 500 points tomorrow either.

You posted "The market is going to be down HUGE tomorrow. 500-1000 points I'm guessing.". I'm calling bs. Maybe it will be down, maybe even 100 points, but without a news item driving it down, you won't see such a disorderly exit of positions that makes a 500 point drop. I bought big today, and as of now futures are up by 0.1%. I don't think I'll be lucky to score a positive tomorrow, but down 40 points is the most likely thing for tomorrow.
 
So with the fed tapering its QE, I understand that to mean that it will no longer be buying treasury bonds.

Tapering means that the Fed will be buying treasury bonds from the large banks at a slower pace, perhaps at first 75% of the current rate. It doesn't mean that they will immediately stop the purchases. The bonds are bought with money newly created by the Fed. The electronic payments for bonds are money because the Fed says so. This is sometimes euphemistically referred to as printing money. The Fed's intention has been to boost the economy. However, while the economy has been growing at a slower than hoped pace, much of that new money has been winding up in the stock market. If the economy perks up, more of that money will be spent on the consumption of goods and services (including Model S's). That will boost corporate profits. Money will circulate more rapidly, obviating the need for more to be created. Much of that would be invested in companies with swelling profits. Of course for every stock buyer there is a seller who can spend the proceeds on either consumption goods or another investment. The economic growth feeds on itself. I wouldn't worry about tapering, despite the gloom spread by media pundits with political agendas that leads to occasional market corrections. Wise investors know how to take advantage of those who throw them curveballs.
 
This morning I missed out on buying on the $135 dip.

I had everything set up and I thought I was prepared. I noticed pre-market was down, and was ready to do some buying. However, when the stock started to dip and options premiums tanked, I hesitated a bit. I had my order page open, and seeing the option premiums tank ($5, $4.8, $4.6, $4.4, $4.2) I figured I should try to get a good deal and I placed an order for $4.0 for Sep13 150s (originally I was planning for $4.4). Right after I placed it the stock started to recover from touching $135 and premiums started to shoot up. I felt disappointed that I missed the opportunity. I realized I should have picked a price earlier and placed a limit order prior to market open, or spread out my order into 2 or 3 orders with various limit prices. It's just the dip to $135 happen so quick and it was gone. (I did place a small limit order before market open in a smaller account I have and picked up some Sep13 150 calls for $4.2 so I guess I didn't miss out on the dip completely).

So, I spent the morning lamenting over a missed opportunity. I had fully expected the stock to quickly jump into the low 140s and end the day above $142. However, the overall market had a bad day, and TSLA had a hard time staying above $140. Toward the end of the day it felt like it was going to test $138 again but ended the day closer to $140.

I noticed a lot of the financial headlines were about gloom and doom (ie., the market is collapsing, etc). At first I didn't pay much attention thinking it was all FUD. But I did some more reading and got a bit concerned. I think I had thought the economy/market mood would remain stable in the coming weeks. But it seems like there's some risk of a market correction. Most are pointing to Walmart, Macy's, and Cisco disappointing in earnings. It's not that they had terrible earnings; they were actually ok. It's just that they aren't growing as fast as they should, and that's disappointing. It reminds me a bit about the solar companies reporting okay earnings but the market not appreciating it because it was expecting better/faster growth.

So, earlier this morning I was kicking myself for missing the $135 dip. And now, I don't know. If the overall market turns bearish during a major correction, I'm not sure what the effect will be on TSLA stock. On one hand, I think it could present some great buying opportunities but on the other hand it's difficult to know when market mood will turn bullish. Also, it's tough to know how much, if any, TSLA will be affected by the overall market. During the last minor market correction, we saw TSLA performing very well. It's just that if this market correction is more major, I'm thinking it could affect TSLA's strong uptrend movement.

In my earlier posts, I've shared how I see TSLA continuing its uptrend assuming the economy doesn't tank and Tesla continues to execute. Now, today we get to see those risks a bit more clearly. It's also not just about the economy not tanking, but it's also about the market not sinking into a big sell-off even when the economy is alright (maybe not stellar though). It's a risk because sometimes fear begets fear and strange things happen. Eventually, things turn around but it's difficult to pinpoint the exact timing. There are just too many variables.

So now this fear in the market and possible looming correction decreases the odds of success for my trade yesterday. Whereas I was forecasting 90% odds of breaking even or a profit (if I could exit correctly), now I think the odds are somewhat lower. Maybe 70-80% (if I can exit correctly). If I don't exit correctly, then maybe 50-60%.

Also, there's the risk of Tesla not executing as well. I think I glossed over this risk, but it's something to be considered. If a major supplier to Tesla experiencing a catastrophe (ie., fire, earthquake, flood, etc) and Tesla isn't able to replace those parts, it could halt production of the Model S line. This would not be good. They wouldn't be able to produce the cars they've guided for, and the next quarterly report (and maybe the following one as well) would not look good. I'm sure they would recover, but in the near-term it wouldn't be good for TSLA. I don't view this as a super large risk to keep me up at night, but it's a risk that needs to be considered especially when making short-term trades. That's why longer-term trades (ie., stock or LEAPs) have a much larger safety of margin. Since they're so far out (over a year out or longer) you can wait out market corrections and execution challenges. You're more betting on the long-term execution of the company, and that's a much safer play.

Anyway, my wife now wants us to sell our our Sep13 150 calls. She's read the headlines and is scared. I'm more the pondering type, and will spend the rest of the day researching and thinking deeply on things. Maybe a long evening walk will help.

Part of me thinks TSLA is strong enough to weather a market correction, but another part of me think if the market correction is severe enough it will affect TSLA and could keep it beat down a bit in the near-term. Another part of me is wondering how severe is this market correction going to be, and also is it just hyped up or is it really looming. These are not easy questions to answer.

And then, there's tomorrow. How will TSLA perform, and can it hold that 138 resistance level? If it breaks down under 138 will it take the fears of the overall market and push it much lower? Or will it hold strong and can we see it consolidate in the 140s?

Earlier this morning I was very bullish on my yesterday's purchase. I still think it's a decent investment but I see significant risks that have increased since yesterday. If anything, if I'm tempted to buy more I might lean toward further out option calls (ie., Dec or Jan) so I can have a greater margin of safety. But I'll be gaining more margin of safety in exchange for less potential reward.

But one thing I'm learning is to adapt quickly.

I think we're kind of in limbo right now, and it might depend on what the overall market decides to do and if there's a major correction or not. I'm just reminding myself that sentiment/mood can be fickle both ways. If Tesla goes up 5-10 points tomorrow, then people will likely think it's back on track and will soon forget this dip ever happened (ie., do you remember that distant Goldman dip once upon a time?). If Tesla sinks 5-10 points tomorrow, people will think it's falling with no end or bottom. It's funny how mood/sentiment can affect things so much.

I'm not saying that TSLA will go up or down 5-10 points tomorrow. I'm just illustrating how fickle mood can be and how it can be reversed in either direction. I think that applies to the overall market as well. It can be humbling to realize that we have such little control over outcomes. But I do have control over my thought processes, what I research, the questions I ask, and how I approach my decisions. So for me, I just keep trying to improve my decision-making processes and hopefully that will make me a better investor over time.
 
The question is, why is TSLA up nearly $1 at $140.32? Does anyone know?

If anyone here is able to tell you why TSLA (or any stock) moved 0.47% in after hours they would be extremely rich. There are plenty of people who literally spend their lives attempting to read & predict trends over weeks/months/years and hope to be right enough to make a living. Asking why a specific stock moved slightly over a few hours is almost impossible, its like asking why a particular spin in roulette hit 32.

Post Q2 earnings is a great example of how hard it is to predict what the market will do, or read why it did what it did. There are plenty of ideas as to why the stock didn't climb further or why we saw 5 days of losses but how do you figure out the exact reasons behind the free market?

I don't mean that to say predictions can't be made. There are some extremely smart people here that have made solid analyses and models to help predict stock movement and many have turned out to be well founded and accurate. But the fact is stock prices are driven by individual buyers & sellers and individuals aren't always rational. Irrational decisions aren't necessarily wrong, just almost impossible to predict or explain absolutely :)
 
I'm tossing out a post-Q2 scenario... any thoughts?

We go into Q2 earnings at $145+ share price.
Earnings is very good (5150 cars delivered, 22,500 guidance, good profit/rev/GM, etc), but not complete blowout.
We see a squeeze of sorts and stock opens at $155+ and then goes up to $175 within 3 days.
Then, stock drops in following week to $135-140 as people realize earnings was good but company is still in similar position as before.

disclaimer: i'm not forecasting this scenario as happening, but just bringing it up as a possibility to stir discussion.

I posted this on Aug 5 a few days prior to Q2 ER as just some speculation. Most of it was incorrect (thus I'm not saying I called anything)... we went into earnings below $135 and we got a pop but not as high as I was expecting (partially because I think we entered ER lower than $145 and partially because guidance wasn't raised like I was hoping). But what's interesting is what I wrote about the possibility of the stock trading at $135-140 the week after ER:
"Then, stock drops in following week to $135-140 as people realize earnings was good but company is still in similar position as before."

I wonder if that's what really happened or not. Did people realize earnings was good but the company is still in similar position as before, thus deflating some of the expectations and enthusiasm that was fueling the pre-Q2 ER runup? Just some food for thought.
 
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