-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
- Status
racer26
Active Member
I agree there are some faulty logic bits in the article, by no means do I think it is gospel or anything, but I don't see that premise in the article at all, and I highly doubt Tesla would be ok with limiting people to not being able to charge to 100% at a SC. You obviously feel differently. Current generation SC's have an upper limit of around 415V charge capacity, which after cabling and circuitry losses is indeed pretty close to the ~403V that a fully charged 74P96S 90kWh pack is. In a 96S configuration, increased cell-level voltage by 0.1V increases pack voltage by 9.6V. Thus, going to 4.5V or 4.8V or even 5.0V cells will exceed the capabilities of the installed SCs if you keep a 96S configuration.
Yes, more parallel cells would allow the pack to accept higher current for longer. It is unclear (to me anyway) how much of the time from 0-80% is spent accepting the maximum amperage the SC can put out (on current cars). My assumption is that it's already accepting maximum current for most of the time, and so adding more cells would increase charge time. More parallel cells *would* delay the taper, though, and I don't know by how much. It might come out in the wash.
For these reasons, I think a 100D won't have (more than 74P)(96S) (16 modules x 6S per module) configuration, but rather a 14 module configuration with bigger P.
Its certainly plausible that Tesla found weight savings elsewhere in the car which would compensate for the added battery mass. I believe its equally plausible that they found battery chemistry improvements which are as yet unannounced. Without someone dissecting a pack, and without official word from Tesla on the matter, all we can do is speculate.
If I were in Tesla's shoes, about to launch one of the biggest products in history in the next year, and the advances would give me a massive advantage over any competing technologies, I would be reticent to publicize my advances until the launch of the Model 3 too. If the competition knows I've found an advancement, they might be able to dissect a product and take advantage of it in their competing products.
TL;DR: We don't have enough information to say conclusively one way or the other, but there is some evidence to support that Tesla may already be shipping a more advanced battery technology than anyone thinks.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Why do you assume the superchargers aren't capable of higher voltages? If you were Tesla would you install a network of chargers with no capability for higher voltages?
Certainly. Some CHAdeMO chargers by design already limit charging to 80%, as the charging speed above this level is pretty bad. Much better to let someone else use the charger, and drive 200 miles up the road for the next charging session.
Another issue with the article is that voltage sag is really only an issue when you have a significan current. As the supercharger tapers off towards the high voltage, you could probably utilize close to the entire 415V. With 96 cells in series, that means the superchargers support charging to around 4.3V. Tela isn't likely to need more than that for the next couple of years at least.
I expect the 100D to still have the 96s74p configuration. But use 18650-cells with around ~3800 mAh instead of ~3400 mAh. I don't see any reasonable way for Tesla to achieve 100 kWh (95 kWh) with only 6216 cells. That's an increase in capacity of ~27%. There's nothing to suggest Panasonic has managed this.
It's certainly possible to speculate as much as one feels like. Maybe Panasonic has increased energy density beyond the batteries in the 75/90 pack by 5%, or 10%, or 20%, or 30%, or 50%, or 100%. The higher number one picks, the more the probability drops off, and it starts dropping off rapidly around 5-10%.
ev-enthusiast
Active Member
everman
Member
Congratulations Jayjs20. Now it is 226. Still, tell us before you are going to sell. We will sell together with you (no that is a lie. I will buy).
Hogfighter
Professional Lurker
Hang on, noon Pacific is during hours?
Edit: Or, P100D(L) has landed. (That was in reference to tentonine, which is just before the announcement, by my time.)
About 3 hours from now. Very exciting. Chose from this menu:
1) 100 batteries
2) AP 2.0
3) date setting for M3 part 2.
4) early product concept reveal for some new thing. (model Y, semi, etc).
5) ???
Following the "it will be the most boring possibility" razor, I suspect it will be 1 or 3. Probably just availability of 100 S and X, in a 1-2 weeks.
MartinAustin
Active Member
Talk about "buy the rumour..."
My guess is new autopilot hardware, since we have been seeing real twin-camera hardware evidence on shipping cars.
Less certain about 100kWh battery...but looking forward to it anyway.
For what it's worth... Elon's tweet didn't convey much happiness on his part. I hope that the continual badgering by amateur journalists, blogs and forum speculators isn't starting to force their hand with product development.
(naturally, the programmers who included P100D graphics inside the OS of shipping cars probably got a firm talking to, but still... the public have not sat still and let whatever will be, be)
My guess is new autopilot hardware, since we have been seeing real twin-camera hardware evidence on shipping cars.
Less certain about 100kWh battery...but looking forward to it anyway.
For what it's worth... Elon's tweet didn't convey much happiness on his part. I hope that the continual badgering by amateur journalists, blogs and forum speculators isn't starting to force their hand with product development.
(naturally, the programmers who included P100D graphics inside the OS of shipping cars probably got a firm talking to, but still... the public have not sat still and let whatever will be, be)
Zero chance it is a solar roof. Last I checked Tesla and Solar city were seperate companies.
1) 100 batteries
2) AP 2.0
3) date setting for M3 part 2.
4) Date setting for event to show early product concept reveal for some new thing. (model Y, semi, etc).
5) 8.0 Update
6) Powerwall refresh
7) New inverter product (no chance, that will be post merger)
8) ???
Well, 8.0 would be an even more boring update so it is probably that. If it is that, it must come with some marquee new A/P function.
Last edited:
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
