Should EVs Make Artificial Sounds at Low Speeds?

[Iz]

Sounds nuts to me. I wonder if the "advocates for the blind" is actually a front by automakers or big oil looking to slow the progress of EVs?

Guess the next thing will be tough fines and perhaps jail sentences for those who disable these devices.

 

[malcolm]

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/05/19/report-washington-to-require-that-quiet-cars-get-alert-sounds/

If passed, the bill would have the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration propose regulations for an "alert sound" within a year and a half, and finalize the rules within three years. Drivers would not be able to turn off the noise. So far, there's no word as to how loud the noise would be or what it will sound like

 

[stopcrazypp]

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/05/19/report-washington-to-require-that-quiet-cars-get-alert-sounds/

Is there anyone even lobbying for the opposing viewpoint? It seems automakers are totally fine with going with it.

I have yet to see a comparison of noise with luxury cars today. I bet they aren't that different, when moving (what might be happening is they are comparing "idling" noises, since EVs do not idle, there is no noise at all).
If so, they should require luxury cars to also have a sound emitter. Then we'll see what kind of support they will get.

Has quiet cars resulted in much higher probability of accidents (adjusting for bad visibility / urban environments of most hybrids).

I sorely do not want mandated noise.

 

[dpeilow]

I'm sure that everyone on here knows that in a built-up area they should drive as if any pedestrian is going to step out in front of them.

However, if people drive like this then we will get noise generators mandated...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_GsmW0G9fM[/media]

 

[Brent]

I'm a frequent pedestrian and cyclist -- this kind of driving makes my blood boil.

 

[edo]

However, if people drive like this then we will get noise generators mandated...

The only bright side to how he was driving was that he was maximizing the level road noise

 

[dpeilow]

Electric cars can't stay silent forever, noise is coming soon

Automakers, along with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) and advocates for the blind, have come to the conclusion that electric and hybrid cars need to make some noise as they whiz on down the road. Though an initial agreement has been reached, it could take up to three years to be finalized and become law, but that's politics for ya, eh? However, some of the proposed changes could wind up in the Motor Safety Act of 2010 if standards are agreed upon soon.

 

[DrTaras]

I understand that this will NOT be something you can cancel or over ride:
http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/06/01/electric-car-warning-sounds-dont-expect-ringtones/


Thank YOU Tesla for holding off on doing this and therfore creating unintended consequences of good intentions!

The Fisker Karma plug-in hybrid will have a “very distinctive” audio tone, said a Fisker spokesman, Russell Datz, in an e-mail message, but the company won’t be making it public “until the cars are on the road.”
Some electric automakers are resistant or say they are “studying” the idea.
“We’re looking at it,” said Ricardo Reyes, a spokesman for Tesla Motors. “We’re not aware of any accidents involving Tesla cars and pedestrians.”

 

[Albern]

“Bruup, bruup” is an approximation of the sound that will be made by the Chevrolet Volt, according to Micky Bly, General Motors’ executive director for hybrid electric vehicles and batteries. The driver will toggle a stalk to produce the sound, which Mr. Bly describes as “like the low tone of a horn, but nonstartling.”

Where's the facepalm smiley?

The way I see it - rather than having all of these ridiculous noises why not just amplify tire and wind noise at low speeds. As the article had mentioned, people have more or less adapted / responded to those sounds. The last thing we need is another EV that sounds like an ICE with a coffee can muffler.

 

[doug]

I actually like that Volt sound (a direct carry over from the EV1) since it is initiated by user action, and is essentially just a soft secondary horn for those parking lot situations. This is a feature all cars should have.

 

[vfx]

I never expected in my life to hate blind people.

http://gm-volt.com/2010/06/05/automakers-reach-agreement-on-sound-for-electric-cars/

 

[vfx]

I guess we will have to keep the thousands of miles of freeway sound walls.

Imagine every car creeping along now beeping chirping burping -whatever when it COULD be totally silent.

Same for skyscraper cities. Office buildings had the opportunity to have just the blaring of angry horns like so many mooing cows but not they will be filled with the constant blaring of electric sheep.

 

[Todd Burch]

This has got to be one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. It's like a skit from the Daily Show...

In my personal experience, I've driven near maybe 1 blind person in the last DECADE. I don't think, in 15 years of driving, I've EVER passed a blind person walking on the side of the road. Blind people just aren't that friggin stupid.

If the blind person's crossing the street, then they better be crossing at a green light on the sidewalks anyway. Do blind people jaywalk? Nope, don't think so. Do blind people walk along the curb, or in the gutter? Nope. Don't think so. If they do, natural selection tends to eliminate them from the gene pool.

Blind people, with sound being one of their primary cues with communicating with the world, tend to have a greatly heightened sense of hearing. If I'm going so slow that a blind person can't hear me, then I'll have 3 seconds to brake from 5 mph to a stop anyway. I think I can handle that. At any speed fast enough to be potentially dangerous, tire and wind noise are loud enough to alert someone that I'm coming...So when I pass that next blind person sometime the next 10 years, I should be okay.

If my Model S makes a chirping sound I will most certainly either remove the "chirper", cut some wires, or spray some sound-dampening foam.

It almost sounds like the ICE manufacturers or the oil companies "encouraged" organizations representing blind people to push for this crap.

Seriously, do statistics really show a significant increase in collisions between blind people and electric cars/hybrids versus ICE cars? If so, I'd like to see proof.

Do we need to start getting ahold of our Congressional representatives?

 

[stopcrazypp]

Do we need to start getting ahold of our Congressional representatives?

We really need do it NOW to because it will be voted into legislation (I think within half a year) and the NHTSA will begin regulating it. It seems automakers are in full support of it (which is why it is moving so quickly), and I think is because the legislation specifically targets hybrids and EVs rather than fairly targeting all vehicles that fall under a certain sound level. If this starts affecting luxury cars (as it should, if this law was fair), I don't think there will be nearly as much support.

I think the research into this is WAY, WAY not enough to show that this is a pressing problem. I think the NHTSA had a report that showed hybrids have a higher chance of low speed collisions, but that report didn't factor in that hybrid tend to be more prevalent in urban communities and that many (Prius/Insight) have different visibility than conventional cars. There are so many factors (it could even be the driving style of hybrid owners).
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2009/11/truth-hybrids-more-likely-to-hit-pedestrians-bicycles.php

You can see DaveD's comment here about how to have your input heard.
http://green.autoblog.com/2010/06/04/and-the-chevy-volt-goes-bruup-bruup-bruup/

 

[DaveD]

You can see DaveD's comment here about how to have your input heard.
http://green.autoblog.com/2010/06/04/and-the-chevy-volt-goes-bruup-bruup-bruup/

Just a clarification: that "Dave D" is not me. I don't want to be given credit for someone else's effort.

 

[Iz]

This is such an asinine argument. It would be nice if someone could identify the origination of this issue. A vehicle rolling down the street at 30 mph is going to make the same noise whether ICE, Hybrid or BEV. Tires rolling a large object and cutting through air are going to generate some level of noise. Today's modern ICEs are much quieter and still generate noise not linked to ICE components. As Todd Burch indicated, at low speed a driver's reaction time to brake is greatly improved.

Chris Paine are you reading this? Would be a good segment to include in Revenge Of The Electric Car movie and get to the bottom of who is actually behind this. I highly doubt it is the blind.

 

[vfx]

http://www.electrificationcoalition.org/news.php

[youtube]9xwBQxcrqBM[/youtube]

 

[RGB]

Noticed that there is actually a built in "F1-sound-generator" in the Roadster: Switch your stereo to 192kHz LW and turn it up as loud as you want!


(can't upload a video, but if someone can I'd be happy to send a file from this morning)

 

[doug]

Please, for the love of all that is good, no...

[MEDIA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yO5msMEGZI[/MEDIA][MEDIA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZK74nUJl48[/MEDIA]

 

[doug]

Nissan demonstrating speed-sensitive alert sounds for Leaf in Japan - ABG

A commenter suggested this for the back-up sound. I'd totally go with that.