Signature Value - some thoughts

[techmaven]

When I ordered my Model S, the Model S was already in production for a year and therefore I did not have the choice of buying a Signature version. In devouring all sorts of Tesla related information in the past year, I definitely noted the grumbling about the value of buying Signature editions. Just being first was apparently not enough, as being first in a technology product has attendant first production problems too. Compounded with the fact that Tesla is doing running changes in lieu of waiting for model year changes, there is a real issue surrounding the value of buying a Signature model. Since I just placed a reservation for a Model X and I had to make the decision for the first time and was thinking about what else Tesla could do to make Signature models have a higher value. Here are a few ideas:

1) Priority firmware updates. Signature model owners have the first priority for both beta and general production firmware updates if they so choose. We know that Tesla does gradual rollout of firmware updates and so Signature model owners should implicitly get first crack if they so choose.

2) Logo wear subscription. Two items each of all tesla branded clothing is thrown in - and all subsequent new versions for a period of x years (where x is likely 1-3).

3) Priority access to new model test drives

4) Special annual meeting of signature owners with Tesla upper management. Pay your own way to Fremont and get a special group meeting with the likes of Elon Musk, JB Straubel, Jerome, etc.

Any other ideas?

 

[hiroshiy]

I have a signature reservation for Model S Japan delivery, and while I think we will see much less quality issues, I would think your idea 1 and 2 sound perfect. They don't cost too much to Tesla, either.

My 2 cents - 5) Special annual party only for signature owners to socialize. It's like a supporters' club. We don't need great food or expensive wines, but some finger food with playback of customer videos worldwide etc. Also owners are allowed to attend the parties held in other countries. For retired people it's going to be good time to meet young people and enjoy the party. For working generation people it'll ne a good chance to meet with good people in other industries in management level or expert engineering.

 

[apacheguy]

Any other ideas?

Offer Sigs who still have A packs a one-time new or refurbished B/C/D pack replacement. Honestly, if Tesla did that then almost all of my other concerns RE Sig value would vaporize as it would demonstrate that TM is serious about maintaining their commitment to early adopters.

 

[gaswalla]

honestly, Tesla doesn't claim that Signature cars are anything more than different badging and possibly unique bundling of features aside from getting delivery earlier than others. It's the owners that are looking for Signature to be more meaningful, but it doesn't look like Tesla agrees.

 

[roblab]

Just being first was apparently not enough,

Being first was worth the price of admission. No complaints. I have had so many perks from being first, and so few problems, which were fixed immediately for free, always being treated as a superstar.

Just a couple weeks ago, a Model S driver stopped to look at the car, saw the VIN and Sig badge, and said, "Thank you for keeping the dream alive." Not everyone understands this and they want more.

My wife and I are satisfied.

VIN 00064

 

[apacheguy]

Actually, Sigs were supposed to mean more than just early delivery. In justifying the Sig tax, Elon did imply a hardware upgrade promise that so far has failed to materialize. I'm a fairly low VIN, but my car did not arrive until late October. Basically I got my car about 1 month before everyone else. Sure, if you're VIN 64 and got your car several months before general production started then I could see some greater value.

 

[brianman]

@OP
This has been discussed in depth before. But, if Tesla was listening to input, my input would be this...

The differences after delivery are exterior color, interior color, some software/firmware art, and 3 etched "Signature" script locations on the car. Some think this was enough when coupled with "earlier than you might have gotten the car from a production reservation", some don't.

What could they do better? To rebuild the "brand" of Signature?

I don't want parties. I don't want gear. I don't want VIP parking at announcements. For me, Signature wasn't and isn't about the owner. It's about the car. Signature value should be about value in the car. Included 40 additional (to the 4 just announced for all cars) years connectivity would be one relatively cheap example of something they could do. ("80 years? That's not cheap..." Assuming $10/mo. for connectivity: 40x12x10 = $4,800 ... is less than the Sig Tax of $5,050 on my vehicle.)

 

[joefee]

Offer Sigs who still have A packs a one-time new or refurbished B/C/D pack replacement. Honestly, if Tesla did that then almost all of my other concerns RE Sig value would vaporize as it would demonstrate that TM is serious about maintaining their commitment to early adopters.

+!!!

I'm proud to have been an early supporter of Tesla's Mission and glad I have a Sig (Elon was kind enough to autograph it on delivery:love. That said, I think the company has lost an opportunity to build the "Sig" brand by not providing upgrades at reasonable prices for at least the 1st two or three years; the A pack being the most egregious example. If they had done pack swap, they could have swapped for "the cost of a tank of gas" and charged x per mile minus a Sig tax credit for the old used battery (which could have been used for grid storage at Solar City). Now that the company is viable, I would not pay the Sig tax to own a Sig X, E, etc.

 

[dsm363]

I agree a pack upgrade for some reasonable prorated amount would at least give people an option.

 

[roblab]

Actually, Sigs were supposed to mean more than just early delivery. In justifying the Sig tax, Elon did imply a hardware upgrade promise that so far has failed to materialize. I'm a fairly low VIN, but my car did not arrive until late October. Basically I got my car about 1 month before everyone else. Sure, if you're VIN 64 and got your car several months before general production started then I could see some greater value.

Sorry. I never heard that there was a sig tax. Price of car was $X and never heard Elon say he was going to pay up on all sig owners for their loyalty. I knew I would get mine just a few months, or weeks, before the general public started getting theirs. I knew that Sig build was not as tight as the Production.

Maybe some should have waited a month or so and got into production line. I know I had that option. But I wanted to support Tesla. Me, who worked hard for every dollar and saved for what I wanted.

And, buying TSLA stock at $17, I think I've been repaid somewhat.

I understand what you are saying. What *I* am saying is that not all of us Sig owners are dissatisfied.

I feel bad that there are some out there that feel cheated. I truly hope you and all the others get something from Tesla or Elon that makes you feel that you got more value than you currently perceive. From reading this thread, the only problem seems to be deciding what it is you want, and then dunning Elon into giving it to you. I wish you the best.

 

[brianman]

Sorry. I never heard that there was a sig tax.

As a long-time member of TMC, I'm kind of amazed you've never heard of it. It's one of the many topics discussed here:
Signature Angst

 

[bonnie]

Sorry. I never heard that there was a sig tax. Price of car was $X and never heard Elon say he was going to pay up on all sig owners for their loyalty. I knew I would get mine just a few months, or weeks, before the general public started getting theirs. I knew that Sig build was not as tight as the Production.

Maybe some should have waited a month or so and got into production line. I know I had that option. But I wanted to support Tesla. Me, who worked hard for every dollar and saved for what I wanted.

And, buying TSLA stock at $17, I think I've been repaid somewhat.

I understand what you are saying. What *I* am saying is that not all of us Sig owners are dissatisfied.

I feel bad that there are some out there that feel cheated. I truly hope you and all the others get something from Tesla or Elon that makes you feel that you got more value than you currently perceive. From reading this thread, the only problem seems to be deciding what it is you want, and then dunning Elon into giving it to you. I wish you the best.

Which is why I'm keeping my Sig reservation for the X. Thanks for putting it into words for me, Rob.

 

[dsm363]

I agree with roblab. It wasn't a tax. We voluntarily paid more to get in line early and for the option of red paint and white leather. That's pretty much it.

 

[brianman]

And, buying TSLA stock at $17, I think I've been repaid somewhat.

I'm a little confused how this relates to Signature value. If anything, Signature value is eroded with the stock going up as the money (some would argue) is better spent on TSLA stock than on, well, very little in actual vehicle differences.

 

[bonnie]

You're not confused brianman. Rob was perfectly clear. He feels he's gotten plenty of value from Tesla. Yes, of course he could have made more money with more of it invested in Tesla.

Hey! We ALL could have gone without our Roadster and/or Model S and left it invested. It's not just Signature.

 

[aronth5]

And while Tesla considers this topic it will be fascinating to see how the concept of a signature model plays out with Gen 3. Since the tax credit won't last long I suspect the most interest in buying a Signature model for Gen 3 will be to lock in the tax credit not to get additional perks.

 

[apacheguy]

I just dug this up from am old thread (Sept 2012) and realized it is exactly what is going on here:

Too true. I think many sigs are. I fear there may come a time when we get the "no, that's it" answer and then everyone will jump on about how we weren't promised anything else, so shouldn't be disappointed yadda yadda. It seems much with Tesla is faith, and then when things don't pan out, it's "well, no one ever said it would".


..and yes, delivery during the summer would have actually had some value.

Talk about digging up a time capsule. That provided me with an interesting perspective, to say the least.

I realize that there are some folks who remain die-hard Sig fans. However, Tesla has completely destroyed the Sig Brand value (for many of us) and upset valued members of our community by "cutting us loose." Furthermore, Tesla should not be viewed as just a company. We should hold them to a higher standard, which Elon has repeatedly agreed with. After all, how many other car companies have taken an interest-free 40 K loan from you for a reservation? We have every right to expect TM to reciprocate the same degree of trust we placed in them by making such a deposit. So far, I'd have to say they are falling short on that end.

 

[apvbguy]

I think that some of you need to realize that what you paid for the car then has little to no bearing on the value of the car today. the marketplace has determined that there is little to no added value attached to a sig. MS.
I have a MB sl that was a "special" edition that commanded a premium price, 8 years later that special edition has no more value than a "normal" model.
YMMV

 

[techmaven]

In the context of Model X signature models, I was thinking that there are a few small steps that could be cost effective and help preserve the Signature brand if Tesla should care to do so. Otherwise, they might as well drop the Signature series altogether.

I'm not sure big things like battery pack upgrades were a reasonable expectation given the costs and the production constraints. It would be very nice and maybe offered at a later date especially if people should keep hammering on Tesla for them. But I'm not sure why, at some point, if Tesla offers a battery upgrade at the outrageous price it will definitely cost, would it be restricted to Signature models - maybe just priority access.

Maybe limited edition wheels or wood? I'm puzzling through the possible items that might entice anyone reserving a Model X to choose the Signature series.

 

[ibcs]

For me the Signature was the greatest investment in my life. It proved to me that Tesla was going to be the real thing convincing me to invest. Needless to say, the investment turned out very well for my family. I now own a Roadster and Signature Model S - #513. Tesla has always treated us like a rockstar with outstanding service.