Supercharger congestion problem ideas.

[JeffK]

Aha but occupancy is not a clear cut constant for any particular charge session, it's an instantaneous value so your condition expression would have to be something like this.

if (now >= (charging_complete_time + 5 minutes) && stalls >= 75% get_average_occupancy(charging date, charging_start_time, charging_complete_time) ) {

Imagine figuring that out if you have to challenge the fine

But the fee is a minute by minute basis no need for the average over the course of 60 seconds. That level of precision is probably acceptable.

If you're doing a sum over the entire timeframe in one go then sure you could get the average. You could also change by partial minutes I guess too.

I was thinking more like a loop with a check once a minute.

 

[Red Sage]

It came to the point that Elon had to get involved to impose the rulebook so I am afraid the definitions are still not clear to some - so it seems.

I can give many examples but this is a matter of simple accountability - our local library had a rule that books can be kept for two weeks but there were no penalties for those who violated it. The first page had a good explanation as to why they have this rule and to be considerate to other library members who would want to lend the book once is returned. But no, some members decided it did not matter even if they broke the rules. Then the rules were tightened and now as soon as it exceeded two weeks, a text message+email is sent out followed by penalty fees for every late day and bingo - problem solved.

We need rules that are clear cut, easy to police, and works every single time and those who ignore them have to be held accountable - that is the simplest way to guarantee fairness.

What you are describing isn't the Rules, they stayed the same. You are talking about the Penalties, and their Enforcement. Specifically, the parameters by which they are enforced. In other words, once people begin to act like a Dick there are penalties assessed. That is a change to Policy instead.

The primary point I am making is that not everyone is a Dick. There may be extenuating circumstances. For instance, if someone arrives at a Supercharger, and plugs in the 'counter' begins to start. Cool. But if for some reason the power is interrupted, but the system can still read the car is still connected beyond the time that was estimated for completion. Or, a person charges their car just fine, leaves in a proper timely manner, and no one else is inconvenienced, but then the communication system is down so hours later, only when the person plugs the same car into another Supercharger miles away does that 'counter' on the previous location stop. Should a person be immediately assessed a fee for being a Dick in each case?

Of course not, that would be horrible Customer Service. Elon Musk has said time and time again that Customers should not be charged for errors that a Company makes. Throwing up your hands and saying, "The system says you are a Dick. You have to pay!" doesn't help one bit. That is wrong. When the Superchargers break, or a piece of software has a bug, that is Tesla's problem to solve. Human beings are part of a Customer Service system precisely to take care of isolated incidents that the Policies, Procedures, and Rules in place may not have foreseen. And there must be a precedent by which concessions are made and grace is granted.

So, yeah... You get a 'free pass' when Tesla [FOULS] up. Why are you so insistent that every case be labeled 'Dickish Behavior' when it is much more likely that Dicks will be the far flung fringe cases? I'd much rather have the flexibility needed to target the specific Dicks that occupy 0.5% of the populace instead of casting a wide net to catch 100% of those connected a couple of milliseconds longer than absolutely necessary. I don't want to see a report on I'mWitlessNEWS SuperStation 7EVEN about how someone was levied a fee of $450.32 for a Supercharger that wasn't working properly.

 

[Topher]

For those who are so certain that 'abuse' of Superchargers is, has been, or soon will be rampant...? Please let us know what actions you personally find 'abusive'. I have a sneaky suspicion that what I would consider 'use' others would call 'abuse'.

When someone else is at a charger I need, that is 'abuse'. When I am at a charger that someone else needs, that is 'use'.

Thank you kindly.

 

[Topher]

1) Don't be a dick; and 2) Be courteous to others.

As fundamentals, these are of course completely useless. They say, in essence, 1) Don't do things we have all agreed are bad. 2) Do do things we have all agreed are good. Until we actually all agree on which things are which, those don't help. When we have agreed, then they are redundant.

Thank you kindly.

 

[Red Sage]

As fundamentals, these are of course completely useless. They say, in essence, 1) Don't do things we have all agreed are bad. 2) Do do things we have all agreed are good. Until we actually all agree on which things are which, those don't help. When we have agreed, then they are redundant.

Works for me. I DON'T agree that everyone else using a Supercharge is equivalent to ABUSE. Unlike those who foresee the impending Supercharger Apocalypse and would prefer to discourage all USE. "Hey, everybody! Lookit all those empty Supercharger stalls, Coast-to-Coast, and all over the world! Woo-Hoo! Good. That shore is purdy!" No. I don't want that.

 

[swaltner]

As fundamentals, these are of course completely useless. They say, in essence, 1) Don't do things we have all agreed are bad. 2) Do do things we have all agreed are good. Until we actually all agree on which things are which, those don't help. When we have agreed, then they are redundant.

Thank you kindly.

"He said do do... "

sorry, I had to add a little childish humor.

 

[Topher]

Works for me.

Of course it does. That's entirely my point. Everyone thinks morality is easy and obvious, since clearly THEY have it, and don't remember working hard to get it. But, if that were true, we wouldn't have disagreements about it. Disproof by contradiction.

Thank you kindly.