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Supercharger Revenue

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Before now there was no difference. I can't find the actual legal agreement (here, here) or what Tesla considers the definition of "Supercharging". Please share the agreement of FUSC or what Tesla's definition of Supercharging is if you have it. But it would be confusing for someone to see a charger location in the UI of the vehicle and then arrive to a blue/green v4 Supercharger and plug-and-charge then find out they have to pay 'because it's a different color'.
Nah, that already happens. Tesla lists some EVgo sites in the nav, and in Europe they list a lot of third-party CCS sites. (I know the EVgo ones are listed under the two lightning bolt section, I don't know how the CCS sites are displayed in the nav, but I assume these will be exactly the same.)

If you aren't going to a Tesla owned/operated site you will have to pay the provider at that location.
 
To add to this a little, the same situation exists with EA. EA has a deal with some OEMs to provide free charging at EA sites. (Which has confused, and frustrated, some people.)

But if you go to a "Corporate EA" site, where it is owned and operated by a different company that paid for EA equipment and installation, some of those third-parties honor the free charging agreement that EA signed, they may get a "kick-back" from EA, while others don't honor it and charge you whatever they want. (Different than EA prices.)

It doesn't matter that the charging hardware is EA supplied/branded, or was installed by EA, it is owned and operated by a different company that isn't a party to the free charging agreement.

But there aren't currently a lot of these "Corporate EA" sites, so it hasn't been a big deal yet.
 
Now that charging equipment sales are becoming large, questions are:
1. what are probable margins for sale of adapters through OEM?
2. For non-OEM sales of adapters what are probable margins?
3. Supercharger sales are now growing too; in the announcements for BP and this one there is not much detail about what is to be provided. Is it turnkey installation? Is some kind of processing included? on what basis is the electricity sourced. If in UK/EU Tesla could be the actual provider. Is it to be?

The range of similar questions for OEM NACS is even broader. There AFAIK is no detail provided on any deals thus far.

We have had some speculations here. We need solid evidence on these and other questions, precisely because all this activity probably will be material in 2024, and in some respects may already be material.
A closely related group of questions exists for subscriptions, Supercharger revenue and the Megapack servicing revenue. We cannot forget FSD, Premium Connectivity and the likely evolution of games and entertainment.

Since we already know that Tesla Energy revenues last quarter finally achieved critical mass all these others seem ready to do so in early 2024, accelerating rapidly thereafter.

The problem is quantifying all that. Do any of us know how to approach that series of questions?
For context, as a long-time AAPL shareholder I was amazed to watch the ancillary revenues and margins rise rapidly and keep rising with steady margins. Those have been dubbed the 'ecosystem'. TSLA most definitely is not AAPL, but... NACS and Superchargers clearly are the core competency that nobody else has, lest we forget, NACS happened because Tesla built a standard when there was none and CCS2 has such critical flaws that connector failures alone make both level 3and level 2 unreliable, if for no other reason that the infernal clip failures. Thus TSLA has become the NA standard setter.

We all know the foregoing. We all know the potential. However, no analyst mentions this (at least none of whom I am aware) and no OEM mentions this, while Tesla certainly is disinclined to clarify the questions.

All these are the huge looming developments on 2024/2025 that are completely 'under the radar' now.
We know how to quantify both the automotive and Core Tesla Energy opportunities and expectations, as well as the major unknowns for each.

We do not for Services. With AAPL people ignored that category while it was growing 'like topsy'. Even now analysts often say iPhone is THE product, despite Services being the glue that promotes cross sales and direct margins. Let us try to avoid that error with TSLA.

Much of the opinion and information on these questions needs a dedicated thread, or more than one. Of course we already have threads on several subsets. Should there be a direct thread for financial quantification of these questions?

While I am very interested in the questions I am acutely aware of my limitations in quantifying these issues.
As such I hope some of us are better equipped to help minimize the unknowns.
 
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Now that charging equipment sales are becoming large, questions are:
1. what are probable margins for sale of adapters through OEM?
2. For non-OEM sales of adapters what are probable margins?
3. Supercharger sales are now growing too; in the announcements for BP and this one there is not much detail about what is to be provided. Is it turnkey installation? Is some kind of processing included? on what basis is the electricity sourced. If in UK/EU Tesla could be the actual provider. Is it to be?

My guess is that Tesla limit themselves to around 25% margin - as they tend to lower megapack costs when raw materials fall. It might be an internal rule of thumb to prevent regulatory trouble and show that Tesla is a good partner.

From a variety of discussions, looking at press releases, BP seems to be mostly hardware (maybe some software) and no maintenance. That could change. I suspect Tesla are cheaper and more efficient - leading to higher uptimes.

Either BP/EG are ok at maintenance or they'll lose money, browny points, listings on Tesla cars' navigation. UK, USA seem to be requiring some kind of minimum uptime. I suspect this will be widespread.

Doesn't explain carrots or sticks to uptime:-

Enforcement​

12.—(1) These Regulations must be enforced by the Secretary of State.

(2) The Schedule has effect.


Might be based on draft: £10,000 max fine per network, so very little money :- Public Charge Point Regulations in the UK - Fully Charged Show
 
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Apologies if already mentioned, but great advantage of selling Superchargers to BP Pulse (North America) and EG Group (mostly Europe but some *North America) is that the money for this hardware should be paid to Tesla quicker than Tesla's own network provides income.

Make hardware, sell it, get paid/pay suppliers (pretty close timewise), make profit. Repeat.


* USA EG Group, 20,000 employees- USA
1699974958313.png
 
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I'm surprised I haven't seen any mention - there was a small throwaway line in the most recent earnings report that the supercharger network was profitable. I don't know that it wou

Pay-per-use Supercharging remains a profitable business
for the company, even as we scale capital expenditures.


By my reckoning this makes the Supercharger network the only profitable EV charging network in the world. I recognize that the terminology may be a bit loose in here as there's no detail elsewhere (that I saw) that put any numbers to this. Maybe this is cash flow positive while showing a GAAP loss - easy to do in a capital intense business that is growing fast.

Whatever - the fact that the network is already profitable is huge. Yet another space that the industry, competition, etc.. can't really see a path to profitability, and Tesla is already doing it.