Switch to all weather tires or invest in a rim + winter tire setup?

[BigCutie]

For this winter, I was all set on getting extra rims and dedicated winter tires (and i guess the BLE sensors too) for my M3.
i am still on the stock 18" wheels at 12,000km so far.
But now i'm having second doubts about that and wondering if I should just get a good set of all weather tires such as the Michelin CrossClimate 2 or Nokian WRG4.

I figure since tires wear out faster anyways on EVs in general, i might as well just sink the money into a good set of all-weather tires and just replace those when they lose their tread depth etc.....rather than investing in a second set of rims, and all the extra overhead costs (buying another set of BLE sensors etc.).
Curious to hear members' thoughts and what they decided?

​

 

[hgmichna]

Unless you frequently drive your car at the limit, go for all-season tires.

I have used both the Michelin CrossClimate 2 and the Continental AllSeason Contact tires, and both are good. But next time I will most likely go for the GoodYear ElectricDrive GT tires.

Generally, good all-season tires are just as good as good winter tires. They are also good when it rains. On warm, dry days they are still well drivable, but fall behind good summer tires. Not spectacularly so, but you have to adjust your driving accordingly.

 

[BigCutie]

Unless you frequently drive your car at the limit, go for all-season tires.

I have used both the Michelin CrossClimate 2 and the Continental AllSeason Contact tires, and both are good. But next time I will most likely go for the GoodYear ElectricDrive GT tires.

Generally, good all-season tires are just as good as good winter tires. They are also good when it rains. On warm, dry days they are still well drivable, but fall behind good summer tires. Not spectacularly so, but you have to adjust your driving accordingly.

Where i live, we require tires with the M+S designation for routes when driving up to ski mountains and on certain out of town highways. All season tires don't fit the bill but the all weather tires like the CC2 do. How many km/miles did the CC2 last you?
cheers!

 

[804son]

Don't underestimate the advantage of a good set of dedicated winter/snow tires. The advantage is significant or all weather tires. It all depends on your driving conditions and winter conditions. I would NOT have a vehicle where I live without a good set of dedicated winter tires.

 

[dsgerbc]

Surrey seems as urban of an environment as it gets. The roads are probably cleared within a day of major snow falls.
OP, do you frequently need to get places in the middle of a blizzard? If not, I doubt it's worth driving the whole winter on dedicated ice/snow tires, giving up tons of grip compared to all-seasons on cleared dry asphalt. For trips up to mountains get quality chains.

 

[hgmichna]

Where i live, we require tires with the M+S designation for routes when driving up to ski mountains and on certain out of town highways.

Same for me. The good tires have that designation.

How many km/miles did the CC2 last you?

Used Tesla prices were extremely favorable at the time, so I sold it early and bought a new one already two times. Cannot answer the question, but I've seen other drivers report a pretty good endurance with gentle driving.

 

[KenC]

I've used both the Vredestein Quatrac 5 and now the Quatrac Pro. Both have the 3PMSF, 3 peak mountain snowflake, designation, so they both pass the Canadian snow tire test. They aren't quite as good as dedicated snow tires, but they are much better than any all-season tires or the OEM tires. I've seen the tests that the Michelin is better in snow, but not as good in the rain. So, it depends a lot on your driving conditions. Personally, I would think these 3PMSF tires as a group would be ideal for a place like BC.

The Quatrac 5 lasted thru 3 winters and were 5% more efficient than OEM. The Quatrac Pro is what is on the car now, and has gone thru 1 winter, but only equally efficient to the OEM tires. Very happy with both.

 

[DuncanM]

Where i live, we require tires with the M+S designation for routes when driving up to ski mountains and on certain out of town highways. All season tires don't fit the bill but the all weather tires like the CC2 do. How many km/miles did the CC2 last you?
cheers!

I found the stock Michelin ASR tires on my M3 to perform very well in winter during trips to Clinton and 100 Mile House in November 2022 and the M3 RWD is one of the best cars for snow that I've driven. My stock tires have the M+S designation as do most ASR tires. For driving in the lower mainland I would not bother with actual winter tires.

 

[MacO512]

I have the cross climate 2s. There is a thread on here about them somewhere I posted a review.

The great thing about them is they work really well in the snow but are an all season. That is great for me living in Texas but doing ski trips to Colorado with inches of snow. Winters here have 90 degree days. Then a freak ice storm. I love these tires for that versatility.

But if I was in a snow climate I'd have a dedicated winter set and a summer set.

You could use these as your only set, problem is they aren't quite as good in the snow as winter tires, nor as good of grip on dry warm roads as an all season tire. If you never push your vehicle to the limits then extra dry grip might not matter so maybe that is ok for you. Even with their lower grip they are crazy fast on my model 3 performance. So for many people I suspect the extra grip an all season or especially a summer tire has would likely never be noticed.

It's all what trade offs best fit your requirements. There's no best tire, they all have advantages and disadvantages. The crossclimate 2 have very unique strengths that make them awesome for certain situations.

 

[MacO512]

Unless you frequently drive your car at the limit, go for all-season tires.

I have used both the Michelin CrossClimate 2 and the Continental AllSeason Contact tires, and both are good. But next time I will most likely go for the GoodYear ElectricDrive GT tires.

Generally, good all-season tires are just as good as good winter tires. They are also good when it rains. On warm, dry days they are still well drivable, but fall behind good summer tires. Not spectacularly so, but you have to adjust your driving accordingly.

All season tires are not close to as good as snow tires in snow. There is a huge difference. The cross climate 2s do very well in snow, much better than any all season I've ever used, but they still aren't as good either.

 

[MacO512]

Where i live, we require tires with the M+S designation for routes when driving up to ski mountains and on certain out of town highways. All season tires don't fit the bill but the all weather tires like the CC2 do. How many km/miles did the CC2 last you?
cheers!

M+S just means all seasons. 3 peak snowflake means snow tire rated which the cross climate 2s have. The cross climate 2s are the only "all season" rated tire I've ever heard of that does both. Sometimes they are called all weather tires but they meet the criteria of both all seasons and snow tires.

 

[dsgerbc]

The cross climate 2s are the only "all season" rated tire I've ever heard of that does both.

Tirerack has 9 tire models in the all-season severe snow service (3-peak snowflake logo) category in the stock 18" size. Pretty sure all of them are M+S as well.

 

[hgmichna]

All season tires are not close to as good as snow tires in snow. There is a huge difference. The cross climate 2s do very well in snow, much better than any all season I've ever used, but they still aren't as good either.

Read comparison test measurements. You will find that most of the best few all-season tires match winter tires in winter performance.

They also perform very well during moderate temperatures and in rain. They are not as good on dry roads in summer temperatures, so you have to adjust your driving a bit.

 

[dsgerbc]

Read comparison test measurements. You will find that most of the best few all-season tires match winter tires in winter performance.

They also perform very well during moderate temperatures and in rain. They are not as good on dry roads in summer temperatures, so you have to adjust your driving a bit.

Sure, if you compare top all-seasons to junk "winter" tires. But if you like for like, as in top all-seasons to top winter or summer tires, all-seasons cannot possibly match winter tires in snow, nor do they match summer tires when it's cold but dry.
There is no silver bullet in tires, just compromises that improve grip in one set of conditions at the expense of different conditions.

 

[BigCutie]

M+S just means all seasons. 3 peak snowflake means snow tire rated which the cross climate 2s have. The cross climate 2s are the only "all season" rated tire I've ever heard of that does both. Sometimes they are called all weather tires but they meet the criteria of both all seasons and snow tires.

sorry yes i meant the 3 peak thing. i always thought all-weather was distinct from all-season...with the implication that
all season means it's rated for snow whereas all-season really was "3 season" and "good luck if you're relying on it in snow".

 

[BigCutie]

I have the cross climate 2s. There is a thread on here about them somewhere I posted a review.

The great thing about them is they work really well in the snow but are an all season. That is great for me living in Texas but doing ski trips to Colorado with inches of snow. Winters here have 90 degree days. Then a freak ice storm. I love these tires for that versatility.

But if I was in a snow climate I'd have a dedicated winter set and a summer set.

You could use these as your only set, problem is they aren't quite as good in the snow as winter tires, nor as good of grip on dry warm roads as an all season tire. If you never push your vehicle to the limits then extra dry grip might not matter so maybe that is ok for you. Even with their lower grip they are crazy fast on my model 3 performance. So for many people I suspect the extra grip an all season or especially a summer tire has would likely never be noticed.

It's all what trade offs best fit your requirements. There's no best tire, they all have advantages and disadvantages. The crossclimate 2 have very unique strengths that make them awesome for certain situations.

yeah i don't push the limits of my vehicle. the appeal of all-weather i figured is slapping one set of tires on and forgeting about it till the tread life is gone. and i do realize it's still a compromise for dry pavement driving and wet/winter driving. we get a lot of rain here but not all out heavy snow for months at a time. i've gone through the buy another set of rims + dedicated winter tires dance before with previous cars so i'm just trying to figure out if i have to do it again.

 

[MacO512]

Tirerack has 9 tire models in the all-season severe snow service (3-peak snowflake logo) category in the stock 18" size. Pretty sure all of them are M+S as well.

Interesting. Well maybe there are more of these "all weather" options available now. I swear when I looked a year ago I only could find the crossclimate2s.

The crossclimate2 are much better in snow than any other all season I've ever had. They are below average in dry and wet though.

I'd still would always get a dedicated snow tire set if I lived an area that had cold winters, had a house or something to store them, and was going to keep the vehicle for over 3 years. Even in hot Texas I'm basically doing that now, I just have a summer only set and an all season set. But I can understand why some people prefer only one set of tires.

 

[chdlmc]

I've used both the Vredestein Quatrac 5 and now the Quatrac Pro. Both have the 3PMSF, 3 peak mountain snowflake, designation, so they both pass the Canadian snow tire test. They aren't quite as good as dedicated snow tires, but they are much better than any all-season tires or the OEM tires. I've seen the tests that the Michelin is better in snow, but not as good in the rain. So, it depends a lot on your driving conditions. Personally, I would think these 3PMSF tires as a group would be ideal for a place like BC.

The Quatrac 5 lasted thru 3 winters and were 5% more efficient than OEM. The Quatrac Pro is what is on the car now, and has gone thru 1 winter, but only equally efficient to the OEM tires. Very happy with both.

Do you mean you used these tires year round? So the Q5s lasted 3 winters and summers (how many miles)? Or are you switching to the Q5s and QPs during snow season from a different setup?

 

[DrChaos]

Unless you frequently drive your car at the limit, go for all-season tires.

I have used both the Michelin CrossClimate 2 and the Continental AllSeason Contact tires, and both are good. But next time I will most likely go for the GoodYear ElectricDrive GT tires.

Generally, good all-season tires are just as good as good winter tires. They are also good when it rains. On warm, dry days they are still well drivable, but fall behind good summer tires. Not spectacularly so, but you have to adjust your driving accordingly.

In Germany / EU what is called "all-season" tire is the more capable subset called "all-weather" tire in North America (Cross Climate 2 is one), with the 3 peak mountain symbol.

In USA there are many more "all-season" tires which are not summer tires, but are not EU-all-season/all-weather. This in fact is the most common type. Summer tires are usually only for sports cars in those sizes and tire types for enthusiasts in USA, with low or no treadwear warranty, there are virtually no summer touring tires unlike Europe.

American all-season have somewhat more cold temperature capable compounds than a pure summer tire, but aren't at all as good in snow or ice at all as a "all weather" tire, much less a winter focused tire. Almost all tires sold and which come from auto manufacturer are this type.

They would not be allowed to be sold as all-season in Germany, where I believe that people changing tires summer to winter is more common.

 

[hgmichna]

Thanks for the good clarification. There are some all-weather tires here in Germany that rank among good winter tires in tests and have the marks that allow them into mountain roads that are blocked for summer tires in winter. Typically they are a bit weaker on dry roads in summer, i.e. their braking distance is a bit longer than that of good summer tires, but not enough to deter me.