Switching from TM3 to Jaguar I-Pace

[daktari]

I had a seat in an i-Pace this weekend. Came away rather unimpressed overall. Unfortunately.
It's a very small vehicle, more comparable in size with a BMW X1 / Audi Q3. Also the interior was a bit "meh" and the tech not that impressive. The front also looks a bit strange.

This is pure misinformation - or maybe you sat in the E-pace, not I-pace?

In my experience, cabin space is on par with an X5 or Cayenne (friends have both) without the axle through the cabin. Cabin space is also similar to my own S. Outside dimensions are more similar to X3 or a wider RAV-4 or CX5. Going to see it again in a few days and bringing a tape measure.

Not sure what Jaguar smoked when comparing the i-Pace with a Model X in the first place. It's like comparing a BMW X1 with an X5.

So question back to you is how much TSLA have you been smoking lately? I do agree that the "blue whale" X is a number bigger though.

 

[vigge50]

Yes. And there is less glass (more insulation). As of right now, specs show that there will be actuated shade on optional panorama roof. But I've not seen it in action yet.



Jaguar also states 298 miles on WLTP cycle. And WLTP and EPA are very similar (if we look other EV's like Leaf for example).
It is possible 240 is some crossbreed BS due to "charge to 80% recommendation". That happened with Nissan years ago.

Bolt have nearly the exact same range in WLTP and EPA while Nissan Leaf have 17% longer range in WLTP then EPA. So, we can not drag any conclusion until we have Jaguars number in EPA.

So you take Model X real range from one drive? There are so many parameters that affect range that we need a test that Test both models in the same way until we can make any conclusion.

 

[evster]

This is pure misinformation - or maybe you sat in the E-pace, not I-pace?

In my experience, cabin space is on par with an X5 or Cayenne (friends have both) without the axle through the cabin. Cabin space is also similar to my own S. Outside dimensions are more similar to X3 or a wider RAV-4 or CX5. Going to see it again in a few days and bringing a tape measure.


So question back to you is how much TSLA have you been smoking lately? I do agree that the "blue whale" X is a number bigger though.

Of course it was an i-Pace I sat in and evaluated. It was a black one, the launch edition fully loaded. So spec wise even above the HSE-edition.

I also live in EU just like you do. I've owned several Porsches, Audis etc. Recently in a Porsche Macan Turbo before the Tesla. And I've driven/tested most things out here in Germany where I live.

I felt cramped in the interior in the i-Pace and the back seat and luggage room is comparable with one of my friends BMW X1. I think you need to get a reality check and try and test out a BMW X1 and compare it with your i-Pace when you get it delivered. Also, there is no underfloor storage in the Trunk and the Frunk is so tiny that it won't even fit a small bag in there. It just is nowhere even remotely close to a BMW X5, Cayenne, Q7 in interior size. I also felt the leather material in the seats were rather cheap. Already lot of creases and material didn't feel soft. It was the 18-way seats. And not speaking about the tech. Screens, navigation etc felt a bit dated from a first glance.

It's still a great car, but comparing it with Tesla as a only commuter car is not in the same ballpark today. Mainly due to lack of charging capability. Both the fact that it only has 1-phase/32A but mostly that we're stuck with single stall CCS/50kW chargers in Europe for a while except on a few locations. So getting the jag iteration two in 2021 might be something, but getting it in Europe this autumn is way to early if it's not just a secondary car or you drive very short daily commutes. I wouldn't even consider taking the Jag for a longer trip. I mean, whill you even consider taking the Jag from Norway down to let's say Germany and rely on 50kW/CCS infrastructure where in most places there is just ONE stall?

That TSLA comment was maybe a bit over the top. don't you think? Just for the record. I don't own a single stock in TSLA and secondly I would love if my home market (Germany) start to deliver good EVs. But what I've seen and experienced so far Tesla is way ahead.

 

[Icer]

The trend of the stories lately reinforces my feeling that Elon has won.
The most important aspect of his mission, to change thinking, change the direction.


iPace and Kona directly target Tesla people. These are not more compliance cars, these are the first serious competitors.
The Jag Drag race, Kona "you're move Elon" billboard are for Tesla people, hey look at this.
Future demand is still an unknown so folks who already own a Tesla, or sit on a waiting list are the current target. You are the known quantity. You are it.

VW's Mueller making remarks about reigning in Tesla.
In 3 years, 6 at the most (?)
This is significant, the world's largest mfr, who make 10 million (?) cars a year, talking Tesla?
Germans being generally tweaky about T performance?
This rookie space cowboy dreamer who they no doubt shared some laughs about has scooped the lead, owns the mind share and the forward thinking.

This could not happen. This was Not Possible. The experts, all proven wrong now, were right. You can't do that. Nobody ever did that.

There are still some aspects of denial. Evidenced in the the "we will bury you" thread from the VW fan yesterday.

The score is 10 million to 52 and he is nervous.
In their heads.

So in a significant, history changing way Elon has won.
He changed the thinking, changed the direction. One man did that.
A remarkable achievement.

Now he is far from done, but it seems like this moment merits being designated the end of the beginning. A new course is set.

 

[Yggdrasill]

the Ipace looks awesome. a foot less in width and length than the S and X. so will be easier to drive and park. and interior looks good to me.

The i-Pace is actually wider than a Model S with folded mirrrors. So it may be harder to park in a narrow garage, for instance.

It's sligtly narrower than a Model X, though, by 6 mm or about 1/4".

 

[Yggdrasill]

Regarding range, both the Model S and the Model X have significantly less aerodynamic drag than the i-Pace, so this affects the range substantially. If you're cruising at 75 mph, I wouldn't expect to get much further in an i-Pace than in a Model X 75D. And a Model S 75D would beat both by a fair margin.

 

[boiler81]

Congrats on you i-pace. Its great to see other compelling EV's coming to market. Tesla needs some real competition to challenge its EV market position, and keep it from becoming complacent about quality, design, price, etc. I only wish Jaguar would market the I-Pace against ICE vehicles, rather then only target EV buyers.

 

[daktari]

Of course it was an i-Pace I sat in and evaluated. It was a black one, the launch edition fully loaded. So spec wise even above the HSE-edition.

I also live in EU just like you do. I've owned several Porsches, Audis etc. Recently in a Porsche Macan Turbo before the Tesla. And I've driven/tested most things out here in Germany where I live.

I felt cramped in the interior in the i-Pace and the back seat and luggage room is comparable with one of my friends BMW X1. I think you need to get a reality check and try and test out a BMW X1 and compare it with your i-Pace when you get it delivered. Also, there is no underfloor storage in the Trunk and the Frunk is so tiny that it won't even fit a small bag in there. It just is nowhere even remotely close to a BMW X5, Cayenne, Q7 in interior size. I also felt the leather material in the seats were rather cheap. Already lot of creases and material didn't feel soft. It was the 18-way seats. And not speaking about the tech. Screens, navigation etc felt a bit dated from a first glance.

It's still a great car, but comparing it with Tesla as a only commuter car is not in the same ballpark today. Mainly due to lack of charging capability. Both the fact that it only has 1-phase/32A but mostly that we're stuck with single stall CCS/50kW chargers in Europe for a while except on a few locations. So getting the jag iteration two in 2021 might be something, but getting it in Europe this autumn is way to early if it's not just a secondary car or you drive very short daily commutes. I wouldn't even consider taking the Jag for a longer trip. I mean, whill you even consider taking the Jag from Norway down to let's say Germany and rely on 50kW/CCS infrastructure where in most places there is just ONE stall?

That TSLA comment was maybe a bit over the top. don't you think? Just for the record. I don't own a single stock in TSLA and secondly I would love if my home market (Germany) start to deliver good EVs. But what I've seen and experienced so far Tesla is way ahead.

Funny our experience of space is so different. Will get back with measurements.

I also think Jag should have made the 0-60-0 test with an X5 40e and a SQ5.

My TSLA comment is spot on, there are so many attempts in this forum from bears AND bulls to manipulate opinion. Appreciate your openness.

No, I won't drive any car to Germany, I would take a plane. But I will agree the SuC-network is great and class leading. But fact is, a road trip of 5-600 km will be unproblematic in the I-pace. Only 1 charge is doable with CCS today.

 

[evster]

Removed post because it was incorrect posted measurements for I-Pace. My apologies.

 

[Yggdrasill]

The correct measurements are:

Model S: 1964 mm
i-Pace: 2011 mm
Model X: 2017 mm

Source: Bygg din NEW ALL-ELECTRIC JAGUAR I-PACE

 

[Yggdrasill]

Hmm, I tried to figure out why you had a different width for the Model X, and you *may* be correct when you say 2070 mm. The user manual says 2017 mm and the website says 2070 mm...

Edit: If the 81.5" figure is correct, the 2070 mm figure is the correct one.

 

[JonathanD]

Please come back after delivery and let us know how the i-Pace is. Also, getting info on longer distance runs when charging infrastructure comes into play will be interesting to hear. It's great to see serious entries in the EV market, feels like this wave is about to crest.

 

[McRat]

Eh. I priced out an i-pace and it would cost me $95480 with all the available options I chose. Don't think I'd pay that without a dedicated fast charging network like I have available to me now. Def won't be the jag luring us away from tesla.

I priced the First Edition in Photon Red (it's loaded), and it comes with surround vision, AC/heated seats, HighSpeed AEB, lane centering, collision warnings, deluxe sound and leather interior.

It was $86,895 including destination and deluxe wheels, red paint, deluxe interior. Why are they charging the southern states $9,000 more?

 

[Yggdrasill]

I priced the First Edition in Photon Red (it's loaded), and it comes with surround vision, AC/heated seats, HighSpeed AEB, lane centering, collision warnings, deluxe sound and leather interior.

It was $86,895 including destination and deluxe wheels, red paint, deluxe interior. Why are they charging the southern states $9,000 more?

Maybe CARB/non-CARB states? The i-Pace should get 4 credits worth at least 10k USD.

 

[JonathanD]

I priced the First Edition in Photon Red (it's loaded), and it comes with surround vision, AC/heated seats, HighSpeed AEB, lane centering, collision warnings, deluxe sound and leather interior.

It was $86,895 including destination and deluxe wheels, red paint, deluxe interior. Why are they charging the southern states $9,000 more?

In either case, it makes the Jag a tweener -- pricier than the Model 3 (and Model Y to come), but fully loaded would be about the same price as where the least expensive Model X starts. I don't know how intentional this was by Jag, but may be a smart move as their first pure EV to find a middle price point that doesn't have as much EV competition (though plenty of ICEs of course).

 

[evster]

Hmm, I tried to figure out why you had a different width for the Model X, and you *may* be correct when you say 2070 mm. The user manual says 2017 mm and the website says 2070 mm...

Edit: If the 81.5" figure is correct, the 2070 mm figure is the correct one.

The correct measurements are:

Model S: 1964 mm
i-Pace: 2011 mm
Model X: 2017 mm

Source: Bygg din NEW ALL-ELECTRIC JAGUAR I-PACE

Thanks for clarifying. I unfortunately got the wrong width. I have edited my original post to eliminate any confusion. The Model X is however 2070 so it will end up in between the two.
The I-Pace is really wide for it otherwise rather small dimension.

 

[Yggdrasill]

Thanks for clarifying. I unfortunately got the wrong width. I have edited my original post to eliminate any confusion. The Model X is however 2070 so it will end up in between the two.
The I-Pace is really wide for it otherwise rather small dimension.

Yeah. I was surprised when I saw it was wider than a Model S.

 

[mariopaol]

Please come back after delivery and let us know how the i-Pace is. Also, getting info on longer distance runs when charging infrastructure comes into play will be interesting to hear. It's great to see serious entries in the EV market, feels like this wave is about to crest.

Sure, I will.
Contract with Jaguar to be signed tomorrow morning. Hoping to get the delivery mid September.

 

[mariopaol]

Interesting, do we know how they are heating the glycol loop to keep the pack temps up?

The I Pace battery pack uses pouch cells instead of cylindrical (see picture I took on the open chassis yesterday at the Geneva Motor Show). The advantage should be that you may avoid to circulate the glycol in direct contact with the cells. It may be that the cells have interleaved thermal conductive plates that are sinking the heat to an exchanger with glycol. However, I am not sure about this solution.

 

[MP3Mike]

The I Pace battery pack uses pouch cells instead of cylindrical (see picture I took on the open chassis yesterday at the Geneva Motor Show). The advantage should be that you may avoid to circulate the glycol in direct contact with the cells. It may be that the cells have interleaved thermal conductive plates that are sinking the heat to an exchanger with glycol. However, I am not sure about this solution.

That is similar to how the battery in the Bolt is made. Pouch cells with a chiller plate on the bottom.