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Tesla autopilot HW3

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I feel there is miscommunication on NOA. The feature behaves very different in the EU than in the US. In the US you have NOA with auto lane change. That system seems to work really well as the system complete decides autonomously when to move lanes. In the EU we have *always* had to confirm first and then *always*n the steering wheel and needs to complete within 5 seconds which is not needed in the US.

When do discussed behavior is is very important to clarify if it is EU NOA or US NOA.
 
I like your line of thinking and I hope your right, although I'm not sure I agree.
There will be plenty of people wanting to poke fun at Tesla driverless once it is released. For example will somebody print traffic light or stop sign shirts just to see if Tesla will stop in the middle of a busy street because of it?
One can dream up many cases of failure and the unforeseen cases are equally dangerous. But as you say, if those cases don't add up to a hill of beans, then that is great, except for the few that die because of it. And if there are just a few that die, then Tesla will be in a boat load of lawsuits due to deaths and injuries. Shouldn't be that way. I'd be in favor of taking in the greater good when examining these cases, but the law isn't set up that way and it will take moving a mountain to change it. Perhaps if Tesla makes a boat load of money with insurance, it will take care of this problem.

Well, I guess a good case study is wherever google and lift are testing. I've heard plenty of stories of people screwing with the cars, but it has always been to try to trap them or slow them down rather than causing harm to others. I think the former will happen a LOT at the beginning and then people will move on. We'll probably see it soon with smart summon (at least in the US...in canada I suspect I'll have to be darn near touching the car to make it move)
 
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I think people will just step out in front of driverless cars forcing them to stop, then either leave a traffic cone there or put a piece of tape over a camera.

Could very well be. But then they would be recorded by the cars cameras. And could be fined by the authorities for their behaviour. And hopefully that would make people stop doing this.
 
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You don't frequently see people just messing with traffic today, so I'm not sure why this is a concern.

FUD/ edge cases/ interesting topic.
I think in Elon's response to Jonas regarding Terminator cars, he alluded to the fact you could just stop them with traffic cones.
Current drivers have to content with power outages disabling traffic signals and street lights, or ner'do wells removing stop signs. So it is a thing to design for.
 
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What makes messing with driverless cars more likely is simply that there is nobody in the car to take unexpected action such as catching them. Putting a bit of tape over a camera in order to disable it moving is really not in the same category as cutting brake lines.
 
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The 5 second thing makes NoA almost entirely useless outside of the US.

In busy traffic, 5 seconds is simply not enough time to signal the intent, and complete the manoeuvre. The most dangerous part of the 5 second rule is that it will abort the lane change even if it has already started - but not completed - the lane change.

Cool, so they could likn the turn stalk into "change lanes eventually " instead of "change lanes now".?

Well - not really... a lot of the time you're relying on the indicator to signal intent to other drivers because you need them to leave you a space. That will often take more than 3-5 seconds. There are plenty of situations whereby you'd almost never be able to change lanes if you waited for a natural gap large enough for NoA to signal, and maneuverer.

To be fair, though, [AP1] is also doing recognition of a much smaller set of things (which likely means a much smaller NN) and only processes data from one camera instead of 8/9.

AP1/EyeQ3 doesn't use a neural network to perform image recognition. It does use custom ASICs to accelerate the traditional computer vision algorithms used. EyeQ3 "recognises" much more than AP2, although Tesla did not use all the features in AP1. This includes traffic lights, potholes/debris, quite an impressive array of international signage, animals (yes), and more. And, it does it in something like 3 watts, on a SoC that sits on your windshield, and since 2014.

There is no real need to use a NN for the kinds of image recognition that Tesla is using for AP2. I can see why Tesla went down the AP2 route, and the NN route (quick, yet inaccurate results). It's not particularly great progress, overall - and it's a shame that we'll never see what a Tesla/EyeQ4 system would have been capable of.
 
Well - not really... a lot of the time you're relying on the indicator to signal intent to other drivers because you need them to leave you a space. That will often take more than 3-5 seconds. There are plenty of situations whereby you'd almost never be able to change lanes if you waited for a natural gap large enough for NoA to signal, and maneuverer.
I'm not seeing a disagreement between our two statements.
I was replying to the post which indicated that NoA signals, waits for a spot, then changes lanes. So the existing software could do the same for a user initiated lane change (for regions that do not require auto lane change to complete in 5 seconds, which seems to be the base issue).
 
Yeah so I've heard from a small subset of random people. It's far from consistent. I guess you live in a place with perfect raindrops and perfect lightning conditions. It wipes like crazy on dry windshield in tunnels tho.
I’m not sure that’s accurate or fair at all. I’ve heard from many in different locales that it’s working well for them.
We definitely have the same random rain drops as everyone else with variable lighting.
 
I’m not sure that’s accurate or fair at all. I’ve heard from many in different locales that it’s working well for them.

I'm 100% sure it's accurate and fair. Anecdotal evidence :) So we're on equal grounds here.

We definitely have the same random rain drops as everyone else with variable lighting.

Clearly not since the behavior is different. Unless my car is broken? Depending where you are in the world, the sun rises and sets at different angles.
 
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