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Tesla banned me from purchasing another Tesla after vehicle buyback

FlatSix911

Porsche 918 Hybrid
Jun 15, 2015
6,561
5,960
Silicon Valley
Really? I haven't seen anyone report that yet.

No, it hasn't. If you can point to one case of someone having a successful UV treatment reporting the problem returning and getting charged for the treatment, I'll eat my hat.

The truth will set you free... where should we send your hat? :cool:

A high ranking service tech also confirmed that the issue has come back to some screens. It has to do with heat and UV on the silicon material that they use between the glass touch screen and the LCD to bond the two together. We do a similar bonding process on our outdoor LCD displays, but it has taken many years of improvements to our formula to avoid any discoloration or degradation. The process that Tesla has used to reduce or eliminate the yellowing was quite novel, but it is only a temporary fix to the underlying cause. If the display is subjected to the same conditions, the yellowing will return.
 
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whitex

Well-Known Member
Sep 30, 2015
6,456
7,648
Seattle area, WA
The yellow screen problem is cosmetic at best... not sure if that should be covered under warranty or not, but it is at least borderline.
What does that mean "cosmetic at best"? Pealing paint is cosmetic, so borderline for warranty too as long as the body panel is aluminum so it doesn't rust? If it's caused by manufacturing defect and depreciates the car, it should absolutely be covered.
 
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wemetzger

Member
Jul 16, 2018
71
52
San Carlos, CA
What does that mean "cosmetic at best"? Pealing paint is cosmetic, so borderline for warranty too as long as the body panel is aluminum so it doesn't rust? If it's caused by manufacturing defect and depreciates the car, it should absolutely be covered.
The plastic in your car also fades color, and that is normal wear and tear. But yeah, I do agree with you.
 

HighZ

MDNT SLV M3
Apr 30, 2019
191
198
Rockford, IL
You’re gonna have to do a little better than fourth-hand info. Show me a customer. There are thousands of people bitching on here every day, if this was happening, we’d know about it by now.

A few clarifications after more research by my materials engineers, and keep in mind that without knowing the exact materials or process used, it is a SWAG, but they are pretty smart. The issue seems to be a UV cure issue on the perimeter bond between the touch screen and the LCD. The material is most likely an acrylic that requires the UV to turn it from a more liquid state to a solid.

There are two potential causes, one being that over time, the photoinitiators in the acrylic adhesive are reactuating and causing the yellowing, so going through a re-cure process will remove the yellow. Whether or not they return may not be known for a while. If it took a few years to yellow, it may take equally as long. Also, environmental conditions will play a big part. If the cause was created by high levels of sunlight on the display, then using shades may prevent future yellowing.

Another potential cause is that during production, the screen was under-cured. There have been a few cases they found where bonding liquid was seeping from the screens, which would indicate an extreme under-cure. If that were the case, and the screens were cured fully at the service center, perhaps the issue would not occur again. This cause is more likely if quality control in the factory is suspect. What materials were used in production would be key.

Tesla is saying that this issue was resolved going forward with new vehicles, so they may have changed their production process and/or materials such as adding an agent to prevent yellowing.

Here is an interesting video of someone who tried to do his own UV cure unsuccessfully before the SC fix was released. The issue of why his first test didn't work would be more related to scatter or reflection of the UV (vs. having it right up against the screen) and using the specific wavelength needed by the specific acrylic used.

This post from July 2019 is probably well-publicized here on the forum but had some information new at least to me about the initial communication about the UV fix, length of time for the cure, and that long-term data is needed to see if it will last.
 

ucmndd

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2016
6,413
11,965
California
A few clarifications after more research by my materials engineers, and keep in mind that without knowing the exact materials or process used, it is a SWAG, but they are pretty smart. The issue seems to be a UV cure issue on the perimeter bond between the touch screen and the LCD. The material is most likely an acrylic that requires the UV to turn it from a more liquid state to a solid.

There are two potential causes, one being that over time, the photoinitiators in the acrylic adhesive are reactuating and causing the yellowing, so going through a re-cure process will remove the yellow. Whether or not they return may not be known for a while. If it took a few years to yellow, it may take equally as long. Also, environmental conditions will play a big part. If the cause was created by high levels of sunlight on the display, then using shades may prevent future yellowing.

Another potential cause is that during production, the screen was under-cured. There have been a few cases they found where bonding liquid was seeping from the screens, which would indicate an extreme under-cure. If that were the case, and the screens were cured fully at the service center, perhaps the issue would not occur again. This cause is more likely if quality control in the factory is suspect. What materials were used in production would be key.

Tesla is saying that this issue was resolved going forward with new vehicles, so they may have changed their production process and/or materials such as adding an agent to prevent yellowing.

Here is an interesting video of someone who tried to do his own UV cure unsuccessfully before the SC fix was released. The issue of why his first test didn't work would be more related to scatter or reflection of the UV (vs. having it right up against the screen) and using the specific wavelength needed by the specific acrylic used.

This post from July 2019 is probably well-publicized here on the forum but had some information new at least to me about the initial communication about the UV fix, length of time for the cure, and that long-term data is needed to see if it will last.

Good analysis.

In case you haven't seen it, my personal experience with a DIY UV treatment is detailed here:

DIY UV Treatment for Yellowed MCU Screen
 
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whitex

Well-Known Member
Sep 30, 2015
6,456
7,648
Seattle area, WA
The plastic in your car also fades color, and that is normal wear and tear. But yeah, I do agree with you.
I think time is relevant here. All cars eventually rust and fall apart due to wear and tear, but if that happens during warranty, it's covered. All batteries eventually die too due to wear, but if that happens during warranty, it's covered (at least it should be, Tesla just lowered their acceptable % degradation to 70% from previous 80%). If plastics in the car faded in 6 months, that should be covered too. Even tires, an obvious wearable item, have warranty, assuming typical usage. Screen yellows during warranty under typical usage, so it should be covered.
 

FlatSix911

Porsche 918 Hybrid
Jun 15, 2015
6,561
5,960
Silicon Valley
HighZ said: said:
A high ranking service tech also confirmed that the issue has come back to some screens. It has to do with heat and UV on the silicon material that they use between the glass touch screen and the LCD to bond the two together. We do a similar bonding process on our outdoor LCD displays, but it has taken many years of improvements to our formula to avoid any discoloration or degradation.

The process that Tesla has used to reduce or eliminate the yellowing was quite novel, but it is only a temporary fix to the underlying cause. If the display is subjected to the same conditions, the yellowing will return
.

You’re gonna have to do a little better than fourth-hand info. Show me a customer.
There are thousands of people bitching on here every day, if this was happening, we’d know about it by now.

The evidence has been clearly provided by a Tesla service tech... are you also a climate denier? :cool:
 

ucmndd

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2016
6,413
11,965
California
The evidence has been clearly provided by a Tesla service tech... are you also a climate denier? :cool:
No. All I require is evidence to change my mind about basically anything.

4th hand information on the internet is no more “evidence” than “:cool:” is a proper way to end every sentence one writes.

You stated definitively that “the UV treatment has proven to be temporary in many cases”. You made this up. It’s that simple.
 

FlatSix911

Porsche 918 Hybrid
Jun 15, 2015
6,561
5,960
Silicon Valley
No. All I require is evidence to change my mind about basically anything.
4th hand information on the internet is no more “evidence” than “:cool:” is a proper way to end every sentence one writes.
You stated definitively that “the UV treatment has proven to be temporary in many cases”. You made this up. It’s that simple.

No. You are just ignoring the evidence... It’s that simple. ;)
 
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dannycamps

Member
Apr 8, 2019
678
618
Northeast USA
No. All I require is evidence to change my mind about basically anything.

4th hand information on the internet is no more “evidence” than “:cool:” is a proper way to end every sentence one writes.

You stated definitively that “the UV treatment has proven to be temporary in many cases”. You made this up. It’s that simple.

"Quotes found on the internet must be taken with a grain of salt." -Abraham Lincoln
 

testhrowaway

Member
Jul 1, 2019
40
369
california
When I read that he was interacting with Tesla's lawyer, that was a huge red flag. Sounds like the interaction with Tesla wasn't as innocent as being presented here, perhaps he threatened to sue them.
When you go into buyback or arbitration territory you automatically start dealing with their lawyers. Nothing more, nothing less.

Sorry all - I wasn't getting the email notifications on this thread (my fault).

Anyway, we ended up getting the etron which turns out to have significantly higher build quality, along with plenty of other features the Tesla should really have at its cost. The biggest two concerns I had with going outside of tesla: no autopilot and electric vehicle are easily assuaged here. Their traffic Jam Assist is quite good and can handle 95% of what autopilot can today.

Regardless, I'm done with Tesla. I get their viewpoint on banning, however, it still boils down to banning a customer for standing up for themselves. I've since spoken with others that have been banned, and it always seems to revolve around customers that know their rights.

There were legitimate problems, nothing was falsified or made up.

(as a side note, they also incorrectly registered the car after the buyback, which is requiring me to get back in contact with both them and the dmv to get it corrected)
 

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