wow mind-blown, how can this be, not Tesla, must be woke mind virus.
Tesla’s secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints
Tesla’s secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints
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Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints
- Thread starter Madmolecule
- Start date
tonybelding
Active Member
That's out of Reuters, and after reading it my opinion of Reuters has really taken a dive.
CyberGus
Not Just a Member
The nice thing about standards is there are so many to choose from. I'm sure Tesla chose the optimal range measurement, but the real-world experiences didn't match. The "secret" team was meant to stop owners from seeking useless repair solutions without causing a PR nightmare.
It was made out to be more nefarious than it seems.
It was made out to be more nefarious than it seems.
Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
Tesla Model S Aces Winter Range Test In Norway, Beats 28 Other EVs
The Tesla Model S set a new record on the annual cold-weather range test organized by Norway's Motor.no, covering 530 kilometers (329 miles) on a single charge.
insideevs.com
yes, overblown and it was only Tesla not wanting to confuse ignorant customers, that were so stupid, they thought their car was not working properly and needed service. I thought my BMS needed recalibration as the shills on the forum were saying, and as an Electrical/control engineer that made sense. In fact they increased the Range from the time I purchased mine to 310 miles. I am sure the marketing dept made that announcement at the end of a quarter. I should have know it was just marketing hype and my car was working perfectly, except for a $2,000 software bug fix to enhance acceleration.
As it has been pointed out here every car manufactures lies and avoids explaining the lie to the consumer. I put the blame on Reuters. I sure they were going to do another "Tesla FSD game changer article", but this one must have slipped through.
As it has been pointed out here every car manufactures lies and avoids explaining the lie to the consumer. I put the blame on Reuters. I sure they were going to do another "Tesla FSD game changer article", but this one must have slipped through.
Has everyone seen this news?! Tesla’s Real-World And EPA Range Significantly Different: Recurrent Data
Analytical findings from 12K vehicles showed that Teslas achieve ~60% of their advertised range in 70-90F temps, and only ~45% in 30F temps.
That gives you - AT BEST - 200 miles of range in a Model Y, which explains why the guy I know with a Chevy Bolt routinely outdistances me, and why I can't get more than ~200 miles myself. RIDICULOUS!
To add insult to injury, "Tesla allegedly rigged its range-estimating software by writing algorithms for the range meter that would display optimistic projections for the distance the vehicle could cover on a single charge" (source: Tesla Set Up Secret Team To Stifle Thousands Of Range Complaints: Report).
My blood is boiling about this and I was surely one of THOUSANDS who made inquiries with Tesla after discovering this issue and was told nothing was wrong with the vehicle despite my vehicle's data showing otherwise.
I'm seriously considering a class action suit against Tesla for this. False advertising and outright fraud.
CyberGus
Not Just a Member
Teslas, by default, show "miles remaining" simply based on EPA rated for mixed driving. At least it seems to adjust it for actual pack capacity. Drive on the highway at speed and you'll not make those numbers. Drive conservatively in the city, and you might best them. What of the average consumer? The car says right on its screen it can go 351 miles... why should it go any less!
Other manufacturers provide a range estimate based on recent and current driving conditions. I've always thought Tesla's choice in the matter was a terrible shortcut that ultimately results in people overestimating the range of their cars in real world driving. That EVs have less range on the highway is counterintuitive to people used to ICE vehicles. Further, that cold weather can cut range in half is one of those fine print things new drivers are simply not expecting. Companies selling EVs would rather not mention it for fear of losing the sale. Today's profits at the expense of repeat customers.
We keep our car set to Percentage. The Rated Range display is not in the least bit useful, unless you're doing an EPA Range Test.
Other manufacturers provide a range estimate based on recent and current driving conditions. I've always thought Tesla's choice in the matter was a terrible shortcut that ultimately results in people overestimating the range of their cars in real world driving. That EVs have less range on the highway is counterintuitive to people used to ICE vehicles. Further, that cold weather can cut range in half is one of those fine print things new drivers are simply not expecting. Companies selling EVs would rather not mention it for fear of losing the sale. Today's profits at the expense of repeat customers.
We keep our car set to Percentage. The Rated Range display is not in the least bit useful, unless you're doing an EPA Range Test.
The headline is completely misleading. It wasn't about suppressing complaints; it was about taking care of their requests remotely and preventing the service staff from having to deal with nuance requests where there is nothing for them to service. (Customer education.)
Even the one guy they quoted that refused to cancel his service appointment ended up saying that they were correct and there was nothing wrong with his car, he just didn't understand that he wasn't going to get the EPA rated range in all driving conditions. (Tesla used to have a widget on their site where you could put in your speed and temperature and it would give you an estimate for how many miles you could actually drive, but they got rid of it.)
Even the one guy they quoted that refused to cancel his service appointment ended up saying that they were correct and there was nothing wrong with his car, he just didn't understand that he wasn't going to get the EPA rated range in all driving conditions. (Tesla used to have a widget on their site where you could put in your speed and temperature and it would give you an estimate for how many miles you could actually drive, but they got rid of it.)
tonybelding
Active Member
That's also my experience. I think they should consider making battery percentage the default, and not show miles on the dash display unless you deliberately go in and switch to that. In fact. . . I think an argument could be made for getting rid of the "guess-o-meter" completely. If you want a range projection, then set a destination in the nav system and get a really good estimate.
boulder.dude
Member
Your quarrel is with the EPA that sets the guidelines for determining EV range.
The article you mention is overblown. Tesla is merely using the government-certified EPA range in their calculation.
Well.... yes and no. Tesla uses the most liberal version of the range estimate, whereas most other manufacturers use the most conservative. This is shown out by various articles that show actual range relative to rated range. Tesla typically has a lower percent in these these sorts of tests. Google it, there are plenty of sources out there. That said, I am not complaining about my cars range. Unlike some others here, I did some research prior to buying and understood that I wasn't going to get the 316 miles my car was rated for at the time, and it doesn't bother me in the least. Keep it to percent, stop when the car tells you to stop, and get on your way.
zoomer0056
Active Member
Same as this thread
teslamotorsclub.com
Tesla rigged the dashboard readouts in its electric cars to provide “rosy” [range] projections
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/tesla-batteries-range/ Interesting. TL;DR 1. Above 50% SOC the cars over state range, and under 50% they become more realistic. 2. Tesla had or has a team in Nevada and now moved to Utah solely dedicated to cancelling Service requests for...
teslamotorsclub.com
johnnycnote
Member
This is no different than what ICE manufacturers do. Actually, what any other business does and should do, use the data that will provide optimal results. Nothing to see here, carry on...
johnnycnote
Member
I was thinking just that but didn't add it to my post. Perhaps much handwringing about range anxiety could be solved by a) having more public charging (L2 and L3), b) defaulting to percentage instead of miles-to-empty, and c) emphasizing the convenience of overnight charging at home or workplace charging instead of letting new owners continue to think in terms of charging stations for day-to-day.
Right now road tripping in my Model 3 is closer to flight planning that it should be. While it's kind of nerdy fun, but for most folks that's just too much math and anxiety. We should be more aiming for the "the battery is getting down... we probably should charge up at the next town, and maybe grab some lunch... hey can you look to see who's got the best kWh price and near some food options?"
Huh? Road tripping is incredibly easy in a Tesla. Just stop when the car says to stop, do your business and move on.... Very little nerdy planning needed.
Sure, in areas plentiful with chargers and when everything goes right, it's pleasantly straightforward. Do what the car tells you to.
However, certain segments of my WA to AZ route require charging to near 100% to make it through a charging desert. Not exactly a selling point to the other half (range anxiety is a thing). Other times we've shown up at a Supercharger and have had to wait, deal with half power at a V2, or worse, broken plugs.
All of this needs to be improved upon so we don't have to calculate "well let's see, the car says we can make it to the next charger and we'll arrive with 17%, but it was about 10% optimistic last time, so let's charge for another 5 minutes because there are ... no other options between here and there, and it's 110ºF with a headwind." That's what is too much like flight planning.
Tesla’s secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints
About a decade ago, Tesla rigged the dashboard readouts in its electric cars to provide “rosy” projections of how far owners can drive before needing to recharge, a source told Reuters.
Just wanted feedback on this article.
Moderator note: Merged from another thread.
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