Tesla EV Tax Credits coming back?

[Spidey616]

One thing to note. Reconciliation is effectively the scorched earth approach. If that happens any future bipartisan legislation is less likely to happen.

 

[dduffey]

I'm using waiting on the bill as an excuse to see if Tesla will either come up with added range to the Y or if it can make it to and from where I need to go. I've heard that they actually may not get 300+ miles and my drive is about 225-250 round trip. I live in Rosamond and make the drive out to Anaheim/Irvine a few times a week (if anyone lives in Southern California and knows this info), but my friend is planning on driving his Tesla out here to visit in the next couple weeks so if his makes it, I'm probably just going to go ahead and release my hold in the next month or two.

Check out a better route planner. I don't know your details, but using a MY LR leaving without a descent charge and some speeding and extra weight you would want to stop at least once.

You can easily make one way, so if you have charging at your destination there would be no extra stops. Based on ABRP I would budget 30 minutes for charging if you left home with a 50% charge and 10 minutes if left at 80% charge. You would only need to charge once, probably on the leg home if you can't charge at your destination.

There are several superchargers and routes to pick from.

Edit: Your friend will have a harder time because there are fewer SC around Rosamond meaning they will probably need to charge on the leg up as well as down. If heading to Irvine there are plenty of SC that you can hit when it is time to head home. So if they make it and have a good experience yours will most likely be even better.

 

[sgalla04]

I'm using waiting on the bill as an excuse to see if Tesla will either come up with added range to the Y or if it can make it to and from where I need to go. I've heard that they actually may not get 300+ miles and my drive is about 225-250 round trip. I live in Rosamond and make the drive out to Anaheim/Irvine a few times a week (if anyone lives in Southern California and knows this info), but my friend is planning on driving his Tesla out here to visit in the next couple weeks so if his makes it, I'm probably just going to go ahead and release my hold in the next month or two.

Yeah without charging it will cut it close. I took the MY on a 210 mile round trip up to the Poconos mtns no problem (considering there was some decent elevation gain and using AC too). Left at 100% and returned at 22%. Brand new battery, I got the car 4 days prior.

 

[eleven24]

There is a second bill which is much larger than the bi partiSan infrastructure bill, it is worth $3.5T. It can be passed on a simple majority through a process called reconciliation. So it only needs 50 dems.

That's the problem. Sienma (AZ) and Manchin (WV) are 2 Dems who have already said they won't pass the bill through reconciliation. Fact is, there's just too much big oil money in the politicians pockets to keep any of them from aggressively pushing anything EV. Senator Cornyn called the EV credit a jihad against jobs in the oil and gas sector. Others have said similar.

It all reminds me how film camera manufacturers like Canon and Nikon scoffed at digital saying it wasn't sustainable. Eventually the market dictated they change their way of thinking. It will happen the same way with EV's and reluctant (paid off) politicians.

 

[a2t2]

I think they should fund charging stations but giving tax credit to people buying $100,000 luxury ev’s is pretty stupid. You can expect the f250 crowd to key you car daily. If you can afford a premium luxury ev you don’t need some truck drivers paycheck in Iowa who doesn’t have the means to participate in the ev game.

 

[k.alexander]

I think you are confusing the core infrastructure bill and the reconciliation proposal. She is the lead Democrat negotiator on the core bill, why would she vote against it?

She has said the price is too high on the $3.5T reconciliation package and more negotiating needs to be done. As it stands, it currently has EV tax incentives. A lot is still up in the air but it is fairly clear that one bill will not pass without the other.

There is a second bill which is much larger than the bi partiSan infrastructure bill, it is worth $3.5T. It can be passed on a simple majority through a process called reconciliation. So it only needs 50 dems.

Both of the above are correct.

Bill #1. The bipartisan Infrastructure deal is looking like it's on track to pass. That bill does not include extending of EV purchase tax credits, I don't think those credits were ever in the bill or were definitely scratched at one of the earliest stages. EDIT: This bill does include money for building out charging stations.

Bill #2. This is the bill that Dems will try to push through Reconciliation. This bill will, hopefully, included EV purchase tax credits.
Interesting quote here: Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm said Wednesday that the amount of funding for an electric vehicle charging network included in the bipartisan Senate infrastructure plan is about even with what was in President Biden’s proposal. “Upfront incentives to purchase, for passenger vehicles — that was not in the bipartisan plan, but hopefully will be part of the reconciliation plan,” she said, referring to Democrats' larger funding bill.

Energy chief touts electric vehicle funding in Senate plan

Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm said Wednesday that the amount of funding for an electric vehicle charging network included in the bipartisan Senate infrastructure plan is about e…

thehill.com

PS: I was about to debate the comments above about whether people buying $100k luxury cars should get tax credits vs some other stupid thing that people get tax credits/deductions for, but decided to stop. Everyone has their own opinions, and I stopped arguing politics with people some time ago. I will note however that most Tesla buyers are buying cars in the $40k-$55k range, which is a far cry from $100k luxury cars. Also has anyone kept up with what non-ev cars cost nowadays, in times where Civics costs $25k, Camrys cost easily into the upper 30s and lower 40s, and lets not even talk about comparable luxury brand cars like BMWs/Mercedes/etc., that $40k Tesla is not that far off on the price. Anyways, and again, because I did suggest before, but let's keep this thread on topic of sharing information about any legislature that may in one way or another affect the EV tax credits.

 

[sgalla04]

I think they should fund charging stations but giving tax credit to people buying $100,000 luxury ev’s is pretty stupid. You can expect the f250 crowd to key you car daily. If you can afford a premium luxury ev you don’t need some truck drivers paycheck in Iowa who doesn’t have the means to participate in the ev game.

The most recent bill that does actually includes EV tax credits with the most traction is for EVs less than $80,000 made in America and more credit for Union Made. However, I do not disagree with your points in general.

 

[bro1999]

That's the problem. Sienma (AZ) and Manchin (WV) are 2 Dems who have already said they won't pass the bill through reconciliation. Fact is, there's just too much big oil money in the politicians pockets to keep any of them from aggressively pushing anything EV. Senator Cornyn called the EV credit a jihad against jobs in the oil and gas sector. Others have said similar.

It all reminds me how film camera manufacturers like Canon and Nikon scoffed at digital saying it wasn't sustainable. Eventually the market dictated they change their way of thinking. It will happen the same way with EV's and reluctant (paid off) politicians.

I think if a new EV tax credit bill is targeted enough (no one earning more than $400k qualifies, something like that) and has stipulations about cars needing to be manufactured in the US/majority of parts content from US, it can become acceptable to even Manchin and Sinema.

 

[eleven24]

I will note however that most Tesla buyers are buying cars in the $40k-$55k range, which is a far cry from $100k luxury cars. Also has anyone kept up with what non-ev cars cost nowadays, in times where Civics costs $25k, Camrys cost easily into the upper 30s and lower 40s, and lets not even talk about comparable luxury brand cars like BMWs/Mercedes/etc., that $40k Tesla is not that far off on the price. Anyways, and again, because I did suggest before, but let's keep this thread on topic of sharing information about any legislature that may in one way or another affect the EV tax credits.

Just this past week our 22 yo daughter bought a Hyundai Kona with an MSRP of $32k. Hypothetically, a $10k EV credit could put the Tesla 3/Y within striking distance, especially when you include the gas/maintenance savings of an EV. She would've absolutely preferred an EV, even if not a Tesla. She also would've accepted paying a slight bit more if it meant being more environmentally friendly. That's what the EV credit would do for the EV market & it's why big oil companies are terrified of it going through.

It's also why I'll maintain an "I'll believe it when I see it" attitude in regards to EV credits.

 

[PatrickTM]

I think they should fund charging stations but giving tax credit to people buying $100,000 luxury ev’s is pretty stupid. You can expect the f250 crowd to key you car daily. If you can afford a premium luxury ev you don’t need some truck drivers paycheck in Iowa who doesn’t have the means to participate in the ev game.

F-250 (MSRP $40k to $100k) drivers triggered by the existence of Tesla (MSRP $40k to $100k)

 

[EVMatt]

I feel doubtful it will happen, but dang it'd be a nice surprise for my tax payments this year!

 

[k.alexander]

Just this past week our 22 yo daughter bought a Hyundai Kona with an MSRP of $32k. Hypothetically, a $10k EV credit could put the Tesla 3/Y within striking distance, especially when you include the gas/maintenance savings of an EV. She would've absolutely preferred an EV, even if not a Tesla. She also would've accepted paying a slight bit more if it meant being more environmentally friendly. That's what the EV credit would do for the EV market & it's why big oil companies are terrified of it going through.

It's also why I'll maintain an "I'll believe it when I see it" attitude in regards to EV credits.

We've gotten to an interesting point in our lives where when someone mentions a car I'm not familiar with, and it's on here, my first thought is to google if it uses ICE or EV for propulsion. Crazy!!

 

[a2t2]

F-250 (MSRP $40k to $100k) drivers triggered by the existence of Tesla (MSRP $40k to $100k)

Right but f250 isn’t subsidized. People get upset when someone buys an expensive car that is then partially paid for by their higher taxes. It’s a douche move by ev owners esp Tesla owners who are generally very wealthy and it furthers the gap to their mainstream acceptance.

 

[PatrickTM]

Right but f250 isn’t subsidized. People get upset when someone buys an expensive car that is then partially paid for by their higher taxes. It’s a douche move by ev owners esp Tesla owners who are generally very wealthy and it furthers the gap to their mainstream acceptance.

What exactly is the douche move by EV owners and Tesla owners? To buy a Tesla? To register their vehicle? To file their taxes?

If people who choose to purchase an expensive steak (which is subsidized by govt) are generally very wealthy, does that make it a douche move? I'm being facetious of course

 

[Doit]

I think they should fund charging stations but giving tax credit to people buying $100,000 luxury ev’s is pretty stupid. You can expect the f250 crowd to key you car daily. If you can afford a premium luxury ev you don’t need some truck drivers paycheck in Iowa who doesn’t have the means to participate in the ev game.

The exact opposite: those buying $100,000 of ANY vehicle don't need the tax credit and also don't care that much; it's for those on the margin of being able to afford a decent EV: $10,000 credit would effectively make a Cybertruck at least as affordable, or more so than F-250, or even F-150. Same deal for other types of vehicles. The above view is what big oil wants you to believe and what they're trying hard to infuse into people's conscience.

There're plural versions of wide spread misconception about EV credit/incentive worldwide, in no small credit (pun intended) to big oil. The basic truth is that such incentive is just somewhat, but far from enough to even the playing field of EVs vs ICE vehicles - not gonna to write thesis here but there's vast amount of evidence to support it for anybody who's willing to explore.

Bonus:
Guess who's among the most enthusiastic touting hydrogen fuel?

 

[Noflash]

Right but f250 isn’t subsidized. People get upset when someone buys an expensive car that is then partially paid for by their higher taxes. It’s a douche move by ev owners esp Tesla owners who are generally very wealthy and it furthers the gap to their mainstream acceptance.

Yes they are. Farmers are subsidized. My coworker (also farm owner) had to buy a new F250 "work truck" every other year for tax/subsidy reasons. And the oil is burns is subsidized too.

 

[TwelveVoltMan]

Right but f250 isn’t subsidized. People get upset when someone buys an expensive car that is then partially paid for by their higher taxes. It’s a douche move by ev owners esp Tesla owners who are generally very wealthy and it furthers the gap to their mainstream acceptance.

I’m going to wager that the subset of F250 drivers who are savvy enough of the US tax code to know that a particular EV can claim a tax credit is pretty small.

I’m also going to wager that if Tesla gets an EV tax credit back for tax year 2021, you will claim it.

The idea of tax credits in general isn’t just that certain people cannot afford to buy something without the tax credit. The idea is that we are promoting a particular concept (EV adoption, home ownership, etc) and we give all people a reason to make that purchase.

 

[a2t2]

no that isn’t true. The f250 drivers know very well if there is a tax incentive they have to pay for so us 1%ers can drive a luxury ev. You are seriously underestimating that impact

Of course I would take the credit if it’s provided. I’m not an idiot. But I wouldn’t push for it as it furthers the gap to mainstream ev acceptance. Don’t be surprised when the f250 crowd parks in front of your supercharger or keys your Tesla.

There are zero Tesla cyber truck shoppers that are low income lol. Nobody buying that or any new Tesla needs this tax credit. You and I bought it anyway.

and yes certain businesses are subsidized as well,

That’s a different topic though.

What we are talking about here is a California company going up against the big 3 by using tax money from people that are extremely loyal to the big 3.


It’s justnot a smart fight in the long run. It’s not even smart for Ford to do it.

here in GA when Nissan came out with the leaf you could get a 5k tax rebate on a 2 yr lease, essentially making ownership free. So I and a lot of other people did that. As a result, now in GA there is a penalty associated with registering your ev since the leaf tax rebates pissed off the rednecks.

we don’t need this rebate we will buy the car anyway, it’s an awesome vehicle put the $ into more charger networks not back into us Rich people’s already stuffed wallets. Putting the $ into a bigger charge network would also make ev’s more usable. That impact would be far greater than helping Elon get richer and us wealthy owners saving some $ we wouldn’t notice anyway

 

[PatrickTM]

But I wouldn’t push for it as it furthers the gap to mainstream ev acceptance. Don’t be surprised when the f250 crowd parks in front of your supercharger or keys your Tesla.
t topic though.

What we are talking about here is a California company going up against the big 3 by using tax money from people that are extremely loyal to the big 3.

Don’t live your life in fear of what the “F-250 Crowd” thinks. Just be smart, alert, mitigate your own risks. If someone wants to pick a fight by blocking your way, trespassing, or vandalizing your property, they’re going to do it regardless of reason. Mentally instability can manifest itself many ways. Today they’re pissed about potential tax credit. Tomorrow it could be a conspiracy theory, election, civil rights, etc. and it doesn’t mean the world stops for them.

Transition to EVs is ready happening, and tax credit is going to speed it up, not slow it down. Mainstream EV acceptance is already here, and no, I’m definitely not a 1%.

 

[Firocity]

That's the problem. Sienma (AZ) and Manchin (WV) are 2 Dems who have already said they won't pass the bill through reconciliation. Fact is, there's just too much big oil money in the politicians pockets to keep any of them from aggressively pushing anything EV. Senator Cornyn called the EV credit a jihad against jobs in the oil and gas sector. Others have said similar.

They actually said they won’t support it in its current form and at $3.5T. They are both going to vote to open debate on it which means amendments can be introduced. Sienma and Manchin are just posturing so they can get a few things they want. Its going to pass, it’s just a matter of the exact makeup of the bill which we will figure out when the sausage making finishes.