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Tesla Gigafactory Investor Thread

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What is that building in the picture?! Gigafactory looks way different and
is not surrounded by paved roads. Is Tesla constructing two buildings there
or did the author pick the wrong picture?

EDIT: O.k., should have read the whole article first:
Cary Richardson — vice president of Miles Construction, which happens to be building a facility for a different battery company at Tahoe Reno Industrial Center — said he's already seeing the benefits starting.


 
The Q4 shareholder latter said "We remain on plan to begin equipment installation later this year and for the start of battery pack production in 2016, in partnership with Panasonic."

How do you think this should be interpreted? One way to interpret it is that they will move the battery pack production from Fremont to the Gigafactory in 2016, but continue using imported cells for a while longer. Another way to interpret it is that they will make the battery pack from scratch at the Gigafactory in 2016.

I think it could easily make sense to start up pack production before starting up cell production. Pack production only requires moving equipment from Fremont, and there's a lot less hassle when it comes to clean-room requirements. Cell production should take a lot more time to get up and running. It needs a lot more equipment, and there's very little margin for error.
 
I think that is correct. I see one road and a rail line. It is very early in the project. I don't know why you would expect to see more roads and structures completed at this point.

Maybe I was not clear enough, I am not expecting more roads and structures, but the picture looks quite different from the pictures I have seen of the Gigafactory:

Official Gigafactory pic from ER:
Screen shot 2015-02-13 at 9.31.37 AM.png


This is obviously another project, as also stated in the article it comes from:
attachment.php?attachmentid=71937&d=1423662554.jpg
 
One way to interpret it is that they will move the battery pack production from Fremont to the Gigafactory in 2016, but continue using imported cells for a while longer.

That's my guess to... And one more reason for this: By moving the pack-production out of Fremont, the free some space there to prepare for the Model 3 production, something they need to have done at the time Panasonic delivers cells from the GF.
 
It can still be interpreted several ways.

You might for instance see battery pack production start in Q1 2016, with cell production starting in Q4 2016. And since november, the expectation might have slipped from Q4 2016 to Q1 2017, for that matter. There will probably be a slow ramp-up of cell production, as they work out all the kinks, so for the first few months of cell production, most of the cell demand will probably still be met with imported cells.
 
You can parse words ad infinitum.

Could would maybe possibly might

At earnings call yesterday Elon confirmed GF is on schedule and maybe slightly ahead.

Cell production starts in 2016. Whether Jan 1st 2016 or Dec 31 2016.


Moving cells from the port of Oakland to be packaged in Nevada to be sent back to Fremont makes little sense while you have no production in Nevada.

Fremont still has massive unused floor space.

Being opportunistic and buying properties at a good price in the Fremont area and moving in before absolutely necessary makes sense.
 
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000119312514403635/d812482d10q.htm


7 Nov 2014
Tesla 10-Q Securities and Exchange Commission report had the following information: (Page 26)



2jfzpzl.jpg
This seems pretty clear about cell production in 2016. It leads me to wonder why 30% of cells will be externally sourced at all. One hypothesis is that the cells produced at the GF will only be the lattest technology, highest density cell which will go primarily into automotive packs, and the outsourced cells will be used for stationary storage applications. To the extent that the equipment will be optimized for the latest technology cell, it would not make sense to invest in new machinery optimized for older technology. The text above is also clear that the cells made in 2016 will be for Models S and X, but late that packs may also be for stationary storage applications and may outsource cells. So this at least is consistent with my hypothesis.
 
This seems pretty clear about cell production in 2016. It leads me to wonder why 30% of cells will be externally sourced at all.

Presumably because Panasonic would not have been with the GF plans without an assurance that their existing factories could still deliver cells. Reckon that in the long term either concludes this section (when there are more GF's up and running) or submit these cells directly into a Tesla factory in Asia (China?).

One hypothesis is that the cells produced at the GF will only be the lattest technology, highest density cell which will go primarily into automotive packs, and the outsourced cells will be used for stationary storage applications.

That's more or less their stated plan.
 
It leads me to wonder why 30% of cells will be externally sourced at all.

Because in order to get Panasonic to invest ~$1B in the GF Tesla had to commit to buying Japanese cells made by Japanese workers in Japanese factories.

This is not a conspiracy theory but pretty much reported in the press and especially in the Japanese press.


Panasonic was not going to invest $1B in Nevada to remothball two recently reopened Japanese battery plants with recently recalled laid off Japanese workers.
 
Well, it's good to get some clarity on the intention for rhe 30% outsourcing. So if this is just to keep Panasonic plants in Japan working, there are other wasy to do this.

For example this new home grid storage device could be manufactued entirely in Japan. It really quite within Panasonics wheelhouse to make a finished electronic good. Have we heard anything about where these will be made?

Certainly as Tesla starts to make cars in Europe and Asia the Japanese supply could be directed there. But I kinds like the idea of building up astationary storage market to absorb capacity with slightly older technology. This sort of option improves capital effeciency. For example, if you have a brand new technology, build a new factory. Five years later, you've got a next generation technology. You could either upgrade your first factory or build a new one. If you've got a strong stationary market for the first factory, then you can make more off your initial investment by diverting its output to the stationary market and opening up a new factory with the latest tech. Five years later, you've got a new third generation tech. At this point the ten-year-old equipment in the first plant may well be due for replacement, so it makes sense to upgrade.

This does lead me to wonder what density of cell the home grid storage device will use. DemandLogic used 200 Wh/kg, but the Model S is using 250 Wh/kg. I wonder if the new device will use these higher density cells. Next up, the Model X gets say 300 Wh/kg cells. Perhaps the Model S won't get a range upgrade for many years simply because it would cost too much to upgrade 250 Wh/kg at this point in time. This could be why it is important both to build out the GF for 300 Wh/kg production while advancing a storage product to absorb the surplus 250 Wh/kg capacity. Once this surplus is absorbed or upgraded, then the Model S can get new batteries. So we can only hope the stationary market takes off as that will enable Tesla to advance the technology for cars at top speed.
 
Can't we hire someone to take a cpl of photos every day so we get a little progress reports. My search for new pics is dysfunctional.

Here is some real estate agent's photos from Feb 15.
02.15.15 Tesla Gigafactory photos : teslamotors

A couple of recent developments that may be of interest here:

Samsung acquires Magna International's battery pack arm SDI News - Read News Articles | Samsung SDI

Alevo and Customized Energy Solutions partner to deliver 200 MWh of stationary storage to an ISO. It seems like they stick a bunch of batteries into a shipping container as a module that can be deployed, an interesting solution.
Alevo and Customized Energy Solutions Announce Largest Ever US Energy Storage Deployment - Alevo
Alevo and Customized Energy Solutions Announce Largest Ever US Energy Storage Deployment | Customized Energy Solutions | CES