Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Marc_K_inNJ]

I can't imagine this is based on rational decision making as opposed to hatred of Elon and/or Tesla. I look forward to him losing a boat load of $$$

EDIT : I didn't realize this was paywalled. Just saw the headline and figured the rest was self explanatory.

Longtime Tesla bear Greenlight's David Einhorn is betting against the EV maker again

Greenlight Capital's David Einhorn, who has a history of betting against Tesla, just disclosed a new short position in the Elon Musk-led company.

www.cnbc.com

EDIT 2 : found this quote, not sure if in article linked... The fad is in owning TSLA stock. We have quipped before that twice a silly stock price is not twice as silly, it's still just silly. But what about 20 times a silly price?" said Greenlight. "Of course, there is the possibility that we are just wrong and bad at measuring silliness. But setting that aside, we think that the answer is that certain stocks are held exclusively by valuation indifferent investors."

That is definitely not rational thinking. Purely emotional.

Bullish! Time to load up more TSLA… I remember the last time he was short…

 

[BrownOuttaSpec]

I just watched the movie "Ford v Ferrari" for the first time last night and I couldn't help but draw comparisons between Ford trying to win Le Mans in the 1960's and Ford trying to compete in the BEV market now.

The example of the red envelop going through 4 people's hands just in the waiting room of Ford and the half dozen or so VPs calling the shots leads me to think that not much has changed at Ford in the last 50 years. Unfortunately they don't have Carroll Shelby and Ken Miles this time so instead of winning Le Mans they'll be happy to just be in the top 5 of the BEV vehicle market in 5 years.

We are truly lucky to be alive and witness Elon and Tesla's effectiveness of the first principles approach as I don't think we will see another company's efficiency on this scale for another 50+ years.

P.S. I highly recommend you watch Ford v Ferrari movie if you haven't already. Please dont respond to this post in regards to anything in the movie.

 

[ZeApelido]

EV Competition is coming, with their.... manual transmissions?

It Seems Like Toyota Has Taken #SaveTheManual Quite Seriously

Toyota is thinking about driving enthusiasts in the age of electrification by working on a manual transmission for EVs

www.topspeed.com

 

[Stormy24]

EV Competition is coming, with their.... manual transmissions?

It Seems Like Toyota Has Taken #SaveTheManual Quite Seriously

Toyota is thinking about driving enthusiasts in the age of electrification by working on a manual transmission for EVs

www.topspeed.com

I think you will find it’s to use up all the gearboxes they have in stock….

 

[ZachF]

EV Competition is coming, with their.... manual transmissions?

It Seems Like Toyota Has Taken #SaveTheManual Quite Seriously

Toyota is thinking about driving enthusiasts in the age of electrification by working on a manual transmission for EVs

www.topspeed.com

That’s like putting a mechanical rotary dial on a smartphone

 

[2daMoon]

I think you will find it’s to use up all the gearboxes they have in stock….

Just trying to imagine what the life expectancy of a mechanical transmission will be when coupled to an energy source with the torque, horsepower, and RPM range to not require them.

 

[Silent Ludicrosy]

I just watched the movie "Ford v Ferrari" for the first time last night and I couldn't help but draw comparisons between Ford trying to win Le Mans in the 1960's and Ford trying to compete in the BEV market now.

The example of the red envelop going through 4 people's hands just in the waiting room of Ford and the half dozen or so VPs calling the shots leads me to think that not much has changed at Ford in the last 50 years. Unfortunately they don't have Carroll Shelby and Ken Miles this time so instead of winning Le Mans they'll be happy to just be in the top 5 of the BEV market in 5 years.

We are truly lucky to be alive and witness Elon and Tesla's effectiveness of the first principles approach as I don't think we will see another company's efficiency on this scale for another 50+ years.

P.S. I highly recommend you watch Ford v Ferrari movie if you haven't already. Please dont respond to this post in regards to anything in the movie.

If you watch Sandy Munro’s videos, he says basically the same thing. He mentioned how he had a great idea to preassemble door modules to make door assembly easier and management wouldn’t consider it. And also that the super bottle / octovalve could never happen at a traditional OEM because the cooling department won’t collaborate with the electrical & software department, etc.

 

[FastCompany]

Let's not ignore the real 800 lbs gorilla in the room: @DaveT recently came up with this long list of questions about Elon's "methodology" which clearly is NOT how Elon runs his closely held projects. Unless Dave is willing to give up that mindset, he doesn't really stand a good chance of getting to any deeper truths about Tesla (which is what Dave advertises as the basis of his investing method).

Dave: here's some hints:

1. Elon is practical (that's why they "fail quickly", fix, and move forward)
2. Elon is pragmatic (that's why he "closed all retail stores everywhere", then changed his mind within 4 weeks when he saw the problems)
3. Elon is tied to "outcomes", not "methods" (we're going to build a city on Mars, not we're building a carbon-fiber rocket and won't even consider steel because "we only future")

TL;dr Don't try to stuff Elon into your little box; his mind doesn't fit. Maybe pick a specific historical episode which is not well understood, and do a deep dive on it. AND: Give Elon a least 1 night's sleep on the topic BEFORE you ask the question. That'll maximize your chances of getting at the deep answers.

One possible topic for example, "EXPONENTIAL GROWTH", how it affects Tesla (ie: how to battery scaling to 2TWh/yr), and the outcome for Renewable Energy.

Good luck, and

Cheers!

I vote for Rob Maurer and @Artful Dodger as interviewers.

 

[thx1139]

1% MoM print is a very bad number.

I think the market knows now that rates are indeed going up to a massive 0.5% in a couple weeks.

 

[MABMAB]

I hope everyone maintains better self control in their investing than they do in staying on topic around here.

 

[Nocturnal]

I knew I should have used all my dry powder the moment we heard that Einhorn was short again.

I think you will find it’s to use up all the gearboxes they have in stock….

Oh, its far worse than that. It's just electronic. They make it feel like you are shifting by reducing torque. Sooo stupid.

 

[SOULPEDL]

I just watched the movie "Ford v Ferrari" for the first time last night and I couldn't help but draw comparisons between Ford trying to win Le Mans in the 1960's and Ford trying to compete in the BEV market now.

The example of the red envelop going through 4 people's hands just in the waiting room of Ford and the half dozen or so VPs calling the shots leads me to think that not much has changed at Ford in the last 50 years. Unfortunately they don't have Carroll Shelby and Ken Miles this time so instead of winning Le Mans they'll be happy to just be in the top 5 of the BEV market in 5 years.

We are truly lucky to be alive and witness Elon and Tesla's effectiveness of the first principles approach as I don't think we will see another company's efficiency on this scale for another 50+ years.

P.S. I highly recommend you watch Ford v Ferrari movie if you haven't already. Please dont respond to this post in regards to anything in the movie.

Bingo... add in the Ford windshield wiper delay rip-off in the movie "Flash of Genius" and these are great movies to better understand Ford Motors. I was going to add in Tucker's "Man and His Dream", but that was more the SEC's undoing (perhaps influenced by the Big 3 but who knows as they seem to work in tandem even today).

 

[Mengy]

I knew I should have used all my dry powder the moment we heard that Einhorn was short again.

I knew I should have used margin in my "fun" account the other day when we were down at $855. Ah well!

 

[Featsbeyond50]

Market Watch is speculating that Musk's 5 million shares may really have gone to the UN World Food Program (I emphasize speculating). I kinda hope not. That executive director came across as kind of a .

I'm pretty sure that's exactly where it went. Elon said that's what he would do if someone came up with a plan, and they did. Their plan probably didn't meet his standards but he would have considered it to be poor taste to criticize their well intended plan and he'd rather give the money to the UN Food Program than Uncle Sam anyway.

 

[canoemore]

I think the market knows now that rates are indeed going up to a massive 0.5% in a couple weeks.

The market seems really broken up about it.

 

[2daMoon]

It seems that there was something we aren't supposed to talk about this morning and I can't recall what it was.

I've always been very superstitious about superstitions. (Murphy, on the other hand...)

 

[daniel]

That’s like putting a mechanical rotary dial on a smartphoneView attachment 769290

Don't forget that the early prototype Tesla Roadsters had a two-speed transaxle. I don't remember if it was a manual transmission or automatic. But I got a ride in one and they had locked it out because it didn't work. Of course they abandoned it for the production cars. (That prototype was also very loud and VERY uncomfortable.)

I'm not a stock trader. I sold some of my shares way back when I thought they were overpriced (and of course regretted it), but kept most, and have just sat on them since. But the drop from almost $1,200 almost down to $850, and now about $900, has been hard to watch. I need to stop looking at it but it's hard. Especially since, like art, I have no way at all of knowing what it should be worth. The price seems to be based on the market's assessment of future potential, rather than current numbers. And the market can be very fickle.

 

[H Mak]

EV Competition is coming, with their.... manual transmissions?

It Seems Like Toyota Has Taken #SaveTheManual Quite Seriously

Toyota is thinking about driving enthusiasts in the age of electrification by working on a manual transmission for EVs

www.topspeed.com

They will only convince me to buy one of these electrified vehicles if they fit an oil canister with a metered drip

 

[2daMoon]

They will only convince me to buy one of these electrified vehicles if they fit an oil canister with a metered drip

Harley Davidson may already have the patent on that.

 

[Mengy]

That’s like putting a mechanical rotary dial on a smartphoneView attachment 769290

Or a rotary dial on a touchscreen.