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They should be talking to home builders. All the hard stuff like flashings, vents, etc. can be designed out at the start with simple roof forms and good planning - easy to gang plumbing vents, reduce hips and valleys, weird dormers etc. Really they should sell a TSLA Netzero solar HOUSE, not just the roof.
Why stop there? Netzero neighborhood, city, country… /s

Tesla is discovering why all previous solar roofs died. It is a very complex product that requires the cooperation of other businesses, which also happen to be very conservative when it comes to adopting new technologies (since it has to be reliable for 25 years, even with possibly poorly trained tradesmen doing the install). It was never going to ramp quickly. And their market is limited since they only have ONE roof color/type. While solar roofs may look “cool” it is not everyone’s aesthetic.
 
4F53FA6B-3AB7-4854-9BEC-456934908881.gif
 
Drew Baglino explained the problem with Solar Roof in the Stanford interview in late May. The video is private now but I still have notes I posted here on May 30th.



Tesla also has said the entire business was shortchanged for almost two years to support the Model 3 ramp. They had lawyers helping out in the general assembly tent in Fremont. It was all hands on deck to prevent the collapse of the company in 2018.

@Blue horseshoe had also said:


Roofing companies have put out several videos about Tesla Solar Roof and say they like it and the general installation process of the tiles is easy because they just snap into place, but also that it requires expertise to deal with flashings and stuff. There’s behind the scenes work Tesla has to do in planning the tile layout and cutting customized edge pieces to ship to the roofing contractors, which seems to be where a lot of the cost is currently coming from. However I believe a lot of this is an opportunity for software automation.





Comparing Solar Roof to ground mount solar isn’t quite right. Solar Roof is more intended for urban and suburban houses with limited area in the yard, especially limited unshaded area due to obstruction of trees and surrounding buildings. Rural properties with big yards will generally be better off with ground mount solar and some other roofing option if cost is a major concern.
It is of course exactly the right comparison. They are two solutions that offer exactly the same outcome, a roof of some other sort and solar from some other solution compared to a roof tile. There are factors such as home resale, costs, lifespan etc but at the end of the day you have an expensive roof and solar power. Solar roof is just not competitive and I really wish it was. Tesla cars (before pandemic) were competitive with high end models with which they competed. Maybe a small premium but then you could feel good and do good. You don't even have to have the solar system on your own property, you can buy solar power from a utility scale solar farm. If that power is 10x cheaper than solar roof power why buy a solar roof?

4 years ago they not only shorted the solar solutions and threw it in a closet but they forgot they had locked it in the closet and then forgot what closet. Then they found it and raised the price while alternatives had fallen. It is not just solar roof it is panels as well, they are losing marketshare while others are growing and making profits. At the current trajectory Tesla may exit the solar install market in a couple of years. The storage market is just a bit mind boggling. To be market leader and then just completely atrophy for 4-5 years is bizarre.

Someone posts a shot here of a bunch of megapack systems sitting in reno and what people should realize is how weak that is, not how great..its not great. Like posting they made a million 4680 cells in February. Not a million a day...a million up to that point in time. That announcement was not great, it was troubling and pointed to severe (unexpected) difficulties with the 4680 ramp. They don't have the batteries. Huwai has the batteries and chips. LG has them. Lots of others have them. Half a billion in megapacks is nothing when the demand is magnitudes of order above that.

Tesla used to be exciting and interesting and the products released had the real potential to change the world. With the exception of auto that no longer seems to be the case at all. Even in Auto they have raised prices to such an extent that they are going to be unaffordable to the general market, it is now a pure luxury product. Longer term as EV solutions role out (and they are rolling out) Tesla used car market will have challenges. Even now a bolt at $20k less than a model 3 is a price point that makes one pause.
 
Current state of the US Virgin Islands is $.56/kWh and an avg of 5hrs of blackout per week. Propane & diesel plus a tiny bit of solar. It's just absurd.

People are leaving the 200MW grid as solar+battery is maybe 1/4 that cost. Which obviously on exacerbates the issue leaving fewer ratepayers behind to split the costs.

The opportunity for an Autobidder plus Megapack solution in these kinds of places is crazy massive. They'd be saving money day 1.
And how much you want to bet another solution gets there first?
 
On Twitter, I don’t see any reason Elon would walk away unless his family waves him off. If he did walk, the question is where better to put his cash from selling TSLA shares? Does he want to diversify or just return to Tesla?

Remember in Nov '21 when he executed his 2012 stock options? He needed cash to pay the income tax. Now he has cash, so he could execute a portion of his 2018 options at this (artificially) low SP and save on taxes vs. executing the same number of shares at a higher SP. Elon did the same thing near the low in June 2019 (executed Options, paid taxes in cash).
 
Megapacks, in particular, have both substantial deployment in Tesla sites and numerous large commercial projects that almost certainly have project accounting rules. Those should be material but are not sufficiently disclosed to know. Perhaps some could be seen by looking into public project finance documents, both the effort would outweigh the value. Further, Megapacks have been known to imply cells from numerous sources (Hornsdale was Samsung SDI, IIRC) and now they seem to be moving to LFP.

In the meantime all major battery suppliers including BYD have competitive offerings. BYD even has a range with wide modular size options.

With all that is visible in stationary storage I no longer think Tesla has major advantages, is simple storage.
I wonder how many of us even think about these:
The utility, grid services and distributed storage links are distinctly different:
Quite without our general notice Tesla has scaled the original Autobidder to Opticaster, with Powerhub, Microgram Controller and Virtual Machine Mode allowing quite vast grid services.

Now Tesla has utility licenses in EU, UK, Texas (not yet all permitted) and some others. We've noticed those developments but always thought they were too obscure to measure.

We have all noticed that Tesla is opening Superchargers to other brands, and we have commercial pricing schedules for some places already. We have not noticed that Supercharger sites have increasing storage capacity, that pricing is already demand-variable. Right now we are about to have NA BEVs all able to use Superchargers, and our interest has been limited to whether or not our wait times will increase.

All this means that grid services and Tesla as a storage intermediary has arrived. This market is so gigantic that it swamps automotive. Thus far we've not figured out how to quantify this but we must.

There must be some among us who, like @Paracelsus , understand the structure of NA energy markets. We need somebody who really understands wholesale energy accounting to help with finding the numbers.

I've been too optimistic several times; maybe I suffer from Elon disease. This time all the pieces are already in place and many are already functioning, almost invisibly, as befits typical electrical grid information worldwide. It all hides in plain sight.

So, take the smallest and most trivial part of all this, BEV charging. If one million vehicles is a Suecharger 3 times per year and US$18 average price and margins for Tesla are 25%, there's at least US$3.5 million annual to the bottom line now. Obviously that much probably happened last year, and this year it's already less consequential than are the utility products. Solar roofs, solar panels, wind farms and other sources are already using these Tesla products and much of the Supercharger network is already operating in grid services.

What should we do? Am I still too optimistic?
My educated guess from sparse and scarce news is that Tesla is working on huge projects only. We even have a few videos on Tesla Youtube. It probably simplifies burocracy and overhead, product is shipped where it counts (replacing peaker gas plants and the like) and demand is so big that this way at least they sell what they can save a lot of resources with simplification. I think Elon got burned with "tailored" business like solar: every roof is different, and probably at the end of the day making a great car and "just" selling it is easier and better capital/resource allocation than fighting in a low margin industry like installing PVs on roofs.
I'm not happy but the deafening silence on Tesla Solar (and a bit Tesla Energy) points in this direction.
Really hope that @unk45 is right and they are seriously brewing important stuff with utilities and grid services.
 
Remember in Nov '21 when he executed his 2012 stock options? He needed cash to pay the income tax. Now he has cash, so he could execute a portion of his 2018 options at this (artificially) low SP and save on taxes vs. executing the same number of shares at a higher SP. Elon did the same thing near the low in June 2019 (executed Options, paid taxes in cash).
Looking at the volume, someone is buying. It is hard/impossible to find a better place to invest to outrun the bounce back IMO.
 
It is of course exactly the right comparison. They are two solutions that offer exactly the same outcome, a roof of some other sort and solar from some other solution compared to a roof tile. There are factors such as home resale, costs, lifespan etc but at the end of the day you have an expensive roof and solar power. Solar roof is just not competitive and I really wish it was. Tesla cars (before pandemic) were competitive with high end models with which they competed. Maybe a small premium but then you could feel good and do good. You don't even have to have the solar system on your own property, you can buy solar power from a utility scale solar farm. If that power is 10x cheaper than solar roof power why buy a solar roof?

4 years ago they not only shorted the solar solutions and threw it in a closet but they forgot they had locked it in the closet and then forgot what closet. Then they found it and raised the price while alternatives had fallen. It is not just solar roof it is panels as well, they are losing marketshare while others are growing and making profits. At the current trajectory Tesla may exit the solar install market in a couple of years. The storage market is just a bit mind boggling. To be market leader and then just completely atrophy for 4-5 years is bizarre.

Someone posts a shot here of a bunch of megapack systems sitting in reno and what people should realize is how weak that is, not how great..its not great. Like posting they made a million 4680 cells in February. Not a million a day...a million up to that point in time. That announcement was not great, it was troubling and pointed to severe (unexpected) difficulties with the 4680 ramp. They don't have the batteries. Huwai has the batteries and chips. LG has them. Lots of others have them. Half a billion in megapacks is nothing when the demand is magnitudes of order above that.

Tesla used to be exciting and interesting and the products released had the real potential to change the world. With the exception of auto that no longer seems to be the case at all. Even in Auto they have raised prices to such an extent that they are going to be unaffordable to the general market, it is now a pure luxury product. Longer term as EV solutions role out (and they are rolling out) Tesla used car market will have challenges. Even now a bolt at $20k less than a model 3 is a price point that makes one pause.

There's a lot I disagree with in this post Nativewolf, and to be honest I'm a tad surprised to see you post something like this.

But rather than start an argument I'll simply disagree and leave it at that. I feel very confident time will prove you very wrong though.
 
If QQQ closes over 297 we are officially entering a new bull run by TA stand point. Hope AAPL and TSLA brings us there. This would be a magnificent start of a summer rally.

QQQ meeting resistance at the 50-day MA (currently at 296.43). But with the Upper-BB being being so close, I don't think it's a hard cap (lot's of 'upside' FOMO today):

sc.QQQ.50-DayChart.2022-07-08.11-38.png

Cheers!
 
Options……you can bet your horse MM’s are just holding the line until volume dries up and then a push to right below 750

I've been looking this morning at the options order flow for large TSLA orders. It was literally all calls coming in, but it changed very quickly to puts once the price went above $760. It doesn't help that SPY also hit resistance about the same time as TSLA.

1657292338532.png


EDIT: Still a very bullish day for options traders.
1657295590718.png
 
They should be talking to home builders. All the hard stuff like flashings, vents, etc. can be designed out at the start with simple roof forms and good planning - easy to gang plumbing vents, reduce hips and valleys, weird dormers etc. Really they should sell a TSLA Netzero solar HOUSE, not just the roof.
Exactly, and they are doing so.

For instance, last July a partnership was announced with Brookfield and Dacra for a Tesla solar roof and Powerwall neighborhood in Austin.


Alset is another subdivision development company looking to build in the entire Tesla ecosystem from the start, although they’re new and might not make it.


It’s quite possible Tesla has pivoted to focusing Solar Roof development on new home builds without saying anything.
 
And how much you want to bet another solution gets there first?

I don't need to bet, I'll have already won. We don't need Tesla to hoard these opportunities and funnel the transactions to their teams at ultra-high margin. The mission is to seed and accelerate transition.

Business in Energy will be as abundant as the Sun and wind over the next 30 years, regardless of the "competition".

These aren't simple products. And the technical problems they solve pale in comparison to the political and economic forces keeping them from being implemented. I think you'll see that one needs massive cajones to break these utility/govt strangleholds. The likes of BYD and LG simply don't have the Elon factor required to even begin breaking into the USVI power market.

We shall see.