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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

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PHEVs are the worst of all worlds - most expensive, most complex, MOST EXPENSIVE PRODUCTION, most complex to service for the dealers, heavy, slow, short range, full of flammable liquid plus batteries etc. They are great as a used vehicle to bridge to a full EV while saving some money but not a good deal as a new vehicle IMO.
Depends - since some of them get full they tax credit and have decent lease options, they are cheaper new. I had Volt for a year when waiting for 3 because I could get it for < $200/m while Bolt was > $400/m.

BTW, for a while we have been thinking about getting a Van - and the only plugin option now is the Pacifica PHEV. No EV Vans (and my wife doesn't want to drive an expensive X).
 
OT: The plot of the "Command and Conquer" game series revolves around the appearance of a seemingly alien, crystalline "plant" called tiberium, after the Tiber river where it's discovered. Its lifecycle involves extracting minerals from organic matter into its crystal structure, then spreading tiny crystals in the wind like spores. This is needless to say an environmental catastrophe. An cultlike organization known as the Brotherhood of Nod notes its potential as a concentrator of valuable minerals, however, and develops a way to harvest and refine the tiberium - making the organization incredibly wealthy. It deliberately spreads the tiberium around the world, then uses the ensuing destabilization as a way to help gain recruits into its paramilitary ranks and establish economic and military strongholds. To combat the spread of Nod, and Tiberium, the Global Defense Initiative is launched, as a unified international military front - but Nod uses this as a further recruiting tool, painting itself as a resistance against fascism and statism (in practice, it's a cult of personality built around its founder, Kain).

I guess the reference was too obscure :) Back to our regularly scheduled market discussion!

Indeed! Maybe my son would know, butty gaming knowledge kinda ended with Quake 4 Arena, and a bit of Minecraft.

Weird, really, when I was a kid I gamed all the time, in arcades back then, Asteroids, Space Invaders, Defender, etc. Now I have the time and the means to invest in that, I'm not remotely interested - a good book is way more rewarding :)

Sorry, OT!!!!
 
There is a reason dealers have been opposing Tesla sales centers in various states.

AutoNation names new CEO as slowing auto sales hit results
REUTERS 6:30 AM ET 2/22/2019


Feb 22 (Reuters) - AutoNation Inc(AN) said on Friday it has chosen insurance and financial services executive Carl Liebert to succeed longtime Chief Executive Officer Mike Jackson and lead the largest U.S. auto dealership chain at a challenging time when the domestic vehicle market has been slowing.

AutoNation (AN) reported lower-than-expected quarterly profit and revenue as it sold fewer new vehicles and gross profits on new vehicle sales declined.
 
My last gripe about the CR situation. Their data is 6 months old. July-Sept 2018 data only being published 6 months after the fact.

A) what took so long?!?
B) while virtually no other business and certainly not any other OEM updates their products that quickly, Tesla does. Even on a daily basis. That alone makes CR ill-equipped at best to judge Tesla products accurately. Today’s cars are already improved and better than yesterday’s cars.

CR is as antiquated as ICEs in this regard.
 
And Morning Cindy has arrived in Shanghai yesterday, with 1,600 Model 3's and a delivery celebration with Robin Ren, Tesla’s VP of worldwide sales:


That's much faster than I expected: February 5 to February 22 is 17-18 days door-to-door delivery time from Fremont to Shanghai.

That's faster than average delivery times to certain east coast location, such as Vermont, which were in the 20 days range last year (!).

This means the last ship headed for China can leave at around March 6 and still have 7 days within China to get delivered by March 31.

Has anyone estimated European delivery times?

The Grand Venus which left yesterday has an ETA of 3/16. So this might be the last load for this quarter.(with total of 6 boats so far for EU)
Tesla Carriers

Also, Vincent on Twitter has only total ~1800 units for Shanghai. Seems very low, so hope there is another port of call ...
 
Indeed! Maybe my son would know, butty gaming knowledge kinda ended with Quake 4 Arena, and a bit of Minecraft.

Weird, really, when I was a kid I gamed all the time, in arcades back then, Asteroids, Space Invaders, Defender, etc. Now I have the time and the means to invest in that, I'm not remotely interested - a good book is way more rewarding :)

Sorry, OT!!!!

Quake 4: Released in 2005
Command and Conquer 1: Released in 1995

Just saying ;) It was the first popular, true RTS game ever made (three years before the original Starcraft), and spawned a series of 11 games over a decade and a half timespan, selling over 30 million copies. I just figured people would have heard of it ;)

Also sorry, OT!!! :)
 
Here’s the thing, Tesla’s aren’t appliances. And while for many the main purpose of a vehicle is getting them from point A to B, safe and reliably (I fit in that category for the most part), a Tesla changes how one looks at a car. It changes one’s view about driving. It changes one’s life for the better. Yes. It does. Anyone who says otherwise isn’t being honest. And more importantly, every single additional Tesla on the road is one step closer to changing humanity’s future. And *that* deserves better treatment than CR is affording via their outdated system.

What’s going to happen when FSD starts being implemented? How is CR going to adjust to that huge change? Keep right on thinking in the same archaic way?

If people are viewing Tesla’s like other vehicles, as appliances, then that is wrong-ways and needs to change and CR should be doing something about changing that perception, not encouraging it.

@Fact Checking made the most poignant point, CR needs to change and improve their scoring/testing if only to remain relevant, but more importantly to be truly accurate, just as much as Tesla needs to continue to improve in their areas of weakness.

If you’re going to hold Tesla’s feet to the fire, you’d better be holding CR’s feet to that same fire or you’re a hypocrite. Never mind that it’s entirely unacceptable for CR to be leaking recommendation changes to a select group. For that alone they can kiss my pooper.

Tesla's play on multiple dimensions. Yes, of course they are cars, but they're also tech, they're also practical cars that happen to out-accelerate pretty much everything else on the road.

But most importantly, they're love-affairs, warts-and-all.
 
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The Grand Venus which left yesterday has an ETA of 3/16. So this might be the last load for this quarter.(with total of 6 boats so far for EU)
Tesla Carriers

Also, Vincent on Twitter has only total ~1800 units for Shanghai. Seems very low, so hope there is another port of call ...
If we assume about 3k cars per boat to EU - that's about 20k.

I've not been keeping track, how many boats for China ?
 
Wall Street be lookin' at TSLA right now and bein' all
whack.jpg
 
Depends - since some of them get full they tax credit and have decent lease options, they are cheaper new. I had Volt for a year when waiting for 3 because I could get it for < $200/m while Bolt was > $400/m.

BTW, for a while we have been thinking about getting a Van - and the only plugin option now is the Pacifica PHEV. No EV Vans (and my wife doesn't want to drive an expensive X).
While I may have ordered my Model 3 this week, with hopeful delivery in a week or so, my wife and I purchased a Volt last year. Funny that I'm using the tax refund on the Volt as a down payment on the Model 3. :) Anyhow, she has family that lives in areas where there are no superchargers along the route, and we couldn't afford two $50k cars... The Volt was $29.5k before the $7.5k tax rebate. 65% of her driving is now electric, which is better than the 0% with her old car. It's safer, quicker, and will have a lower TCO than her old car. For someone who lives in an urban area, a PHEV is actually a good alternative, because it can still do long drives if need be. I think it's a decent bridge technology. I do wish they had put a 1.3L or 1L engine instead of the 1.5L engine it has, along with a smaller gas tank, but c'est la vie. We will probably keep the Volt until we can get a Model Y.
 
Here’s the thing, Tesla’s aren’t appliances. And while for many the main purpose of a vehicle is getting them from point A to B, safe and reliably (I fit in that category for the most part), a Tesla changes how one looks at a car. It changes one’s view about driving. It changes one’s life for the better. Yes. It does. Anyone who says otherwise isn’t being honest. And more importantly, every single additional Tesla on the road is one step closer to changing humanity’s future. And *that* deserves better treatment than CR is affording via their outdated system.

What’s going to happen when FSD starts being implemented? How is CR going to adjust to that huge change? Keep right on thinking in the same archaic way?

If people are viewing Tesla’s like other vehicles, as appliances, then that is wrong-ways and needs to change and CR should be doing something about changing that perception, not encouraging it.

@Fact Checking made the most poignant point, CR needs to change and improve their scoring/testing if only to remain relevant, but more importantly to be truly accurate, just as much as Tesla needs to continue to improve in their areas of weakness.

If you’re going to hold Tesla’s feet to the fire, you’d better be holding CR’s feet to that same fire or you’re a hypocrite. Never mind that it’s entirely unacceptable for CR to be leaking recommendation changes to a select group. For that alone they can kiss my pooper.
It's like if they were using horse and buggy criteria to evaluate the first model T's. They might not be expected to know any better...
 
Why do they always do this? :Þ Are there any other automakers beside Tesla who actually make their production cars as pretty as their "concepts"?

Porsche built a prototype of the concept and they were like "Holy crap, the drag coefficient for those headlight air dams is off the charts! We better aerodynamify this."